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49er mast height?

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Granite Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 49er mast height?
    Posted: 30 Nov 07 at 1:15pm
It is also hastle to make a working sheave for the top of your home made carbon mast. a loop of string is eiser, cheaper and works better on the water than 20m of spectra or wire(back in the day).

The other advantage is that boat on its side is stable so you can leave it there, leaving a cherub upright with sails up is a disaster waiting to happen
If it doesn't break it's too heavy; if it does it wasn't built right
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Post Options Post Options   Quote alstorer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 07 at 7:40am
How could we get this into one of the boat shows? Iain to fully change his sails on his Fireball, with Andy to change his rigs, head to head, whilst a chef whips up a little neoprene stir-fry for the loser.


As for halyards, locks, compression etc, the one I've never understood is the Dart 18- a veritable tree trunk of a mast (a non tapered hefty wing seemingly made out of wrought iron), yet they use an exceedingly fiddly little lock for the main. I understand the one on the jib, don't want to put any more force than needed on the pivot. Silly thing. Glad I came back to the light side.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Lukepiewalker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 10:14pm
Compression. The halyard goes up the mast, around the sheave at the top and then to the head board. For the bow and arrow analogy imagine an external halyard as the bow string and the mast as the bow. So this puts a compression force on the mast which manifests itself as bend. Obviously the more flexible the mast, the greater the effect, and it is a bit more of an issue with unstayed masts which don't have the extra support of the halyards to control the bend. You can get round it by using halyard locks, but this involves external halyards (in all the ones I've seen) and a bit of faffing around.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote mike ellis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 8:37pm
Originally posted by andy_cherub

The main reason for not having halyards

..... 2 the 'bow and arrow' effect it has on the mast!

please elaborate

600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Iain C Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 6:49pm

Did I mention I own a 1.5mm shortie???

In fairness if I chop it up and slap it in a pitta bread it will pass for my local kebab house...

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Post Options Post Options   Quote tack'ho Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 6:35pm
I forsee an improtu race coming up
I might be sailing it, but it's still sh**e!
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Iain C View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Iain C Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 5:29pm

Fair do's forgot you only had 1 prod, however I'd still be pretty gobsmacked if you can change in less than 10 mins...if it takes you a measly 60 seconds (which it won't) to take a sail from being rolled up in it's bag to being on the boat totally rigged, or vice versa, that's 6 sails to do and that only leaves you 2 minutes to take a complete rig down and another 2 minutes to put a new one up...

I won't get my wetsuit relish out the fridge just yet...

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Post Options Post Options   Quote andy_cherub Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 3:58pm

HAHA! may I correct you Iain.............

On my 12 I use just one prod - two blocks on it, so the tack line just comes off the kite and goes through the other block. So prod, antles, cheese lines etc all stay on. Both the trap lines are connected at the top by one shackle which gets shackled onto the strop on the mast. The sail again slides off the top - all controls clip on, and the jib sheet is also on a shackle onto the clew board - so again pops off with ease! Boom stays on the boat - so its, oh just a goose neck to slide it off! & the shouds, caps, and D2's are all on one chain plate, so again just one shakle! Honest to god its less than 10mins to change the rig, it takes me litterly twice as long to just rig my scorpion!

I think a wetsuit eating compet*tion is in order!!

& if it takes you more than 10mins to just change your FB main there are some serious lazyness points which need to be awarded!!

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Iain C View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Iain C Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 1:22pm

I took that picture.  It was just a giggle, Stu was not seriously looking to use that sail.

The main reason Cherubs don't have main halyards is because they don't have jib halyards...a jib halyard does put big compression loading down the mast, which can be lessened with a 2:1 system as some fireballs use.  However, traditionally you do then still need a lot of string and blocks and cleats etc or a muscle box or nasty highfield levers, and all this wire, string and fittings does actually weigh a bit, and of course cost a lot too!  So if you are going to roll it over for the jib, you might as well do the main too.

However the Daemons use halyards, and to be honest my new boat probably will too, simply becasue it's a pain in the bum to find space to roll boats over, and they are easily damaged (racks/hulls more than rigs).  I will probably go for a system similar to a 14, with a boatbreaker and a zipped jib, the jib halyard can be 1:1 and simply holds the jib up, not the rig tension.

Andy, I'd be gob smacked if it takes you less than 10 mins to do an complete rig change on a 12.  It takes me most of that just to change mains on my Fireball.  So on the 12, you have to roll it over, drop the boom off, take the main off, take the jib down, take the kite off, bag all three, remove 4 traps, D2s, shrouds and lowers, take the mast off, put the new one one, attach shrouds, 4 traps, D2s, lowers, jib, tension it all up, get the main out the bag, get it up the mast, attach the boom, and you're off.

No wait...undo 2 cheesewires, bobstay, antlers, undo tack line, remove prod, put other prod on, re-attach antlers, cheesewires, bobstay and tack line, attach tackline, halyard and kite sheets, then put it in the bin, tape over all of the split rings, roll it upright and finally go sailing!

If you can do that un under 10 mins I'll eat my wetsuit!

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Granite Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 07 at 12:47pm
Originally posted by andy_cherub

Theres nothing wrong with putting bigger sails on your boat



There is if you make the boat go much slower than it did before you messed with it!

If it doesn't break it's too heavy; if it does it wasn't built right
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