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New ISAF rule on quick release harnesses.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Blobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: New ISAF rule on quick release harnesses.
    Posted: 31 Jan 05 at 3:33am

Having read the forum thread on the ISAF site I am not surprised that they haven't responded in an appropriate manner.  The comments are basically downright rude, childish and provocative...

If you want your comments to be taken seriously, present a serious considered argument!

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 05 at 4:52pm
I don't think they're in touch enough with the real world (ie where people get wet now and then) to be aware they've made a mistake. Either that or they're just too belligerent to care.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 05 at 2:43pm

But then someone gets trapped / dies wearing an 'approved harness' and the ISAF gets sued. 

I still believe the ISAF have put them selves betweena  rock and a hard place with this rule an d can now see this - Hence why they (the ISAF) are dodging making any statements while they (the ISAF) work out how to get out of it. 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Coolhand Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 05 at 2:08pm

I suspect that this rule might be due to the you didn't tell me "not to put my dog in a microwave/that the coffee would be hot/that if I use Cruise control I still have to steer" effect.

If you're told to do something and then don't the liablity is shifted - therefore I suspect that every organisation will have to adopt the rule or face being taken to court for emotional stress by the first person to get a dunking whilst attcached to the wire.

 

  



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Post Options Post Options   Quote catmandoo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 05 at 1:18pm

As we all know ISAF are losing the plot on this one .

 

It's interesting to consider wether the unfortunate trapped Tornado sailor would have benefitted from less bouyancy and being able to move in the water more easily , pehaps without the bouyancy I assume he was wearing , he may have been able to get free.

Similarily in other situations where harnesses get caught , surely the constant upwards force from wearing extra bouyancy must tighten line etc and make it far harder to disentangle from underwater rigging .

Most people in dinghy sailing gear are positive bouyant through air in neoprene , clothing , drysuits etc without the excesses of an aid , after all humans are just about bouyant with no help .

 

 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Matt Jackson Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 05 at 8:13am
... and completely useless if you happen to be unconcious - a side-effect of the drowning process I'm told.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Blobby Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Jan 05 at 4:18am

Read your Y&Y - the RYA is doing something.  They are collecting data and proving that dying as a result of your trapeze harness causing entrapment is a miniscule risk, so we don't need to bother doing anything.  (Mulit mad column, Jan 7th).

Personally I have written to Y&Y and said this is fine but surely the wrong approach.  ISAF will respond saying "the risk may be miniscule but somebody died and it is something that could be prevented so taking action is correct".

After all, if a professional sailor is issued with a harness by his employer or sponsor, it then falls under the Health & Safety at Work Act and big money lawyers get involved with prosectutions etc etc.  End result - trapeze harnesses are inherently unsafe and therefore trapezing should be made illegal...(maybe a slight exageration but not much!)

The fact is there are better solutions - but none are visible in the market place except the Bethwaite ball + socket harness (which will not comply with the new rule as far as I can tell).  The best solution is to prevent the trapeze hook catching on something in the first place.  Having knives or quick release hooks to get released after getting caught is basically a last resort.

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jan 05 at 9:49pm

What about every trapeze class stand displaying (in large print/posters) something like "New Harness Rule ill considered - Is the RYA doing anything?" at the dinghy show?

now there is a good idea

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Garry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jan 05 at 9:36pm
Am I naive in thinking the RYA should be championing this on our behalf! Although looking at the last voting information most of the committee seem to be big boat sailors!

In seriousness carrying a knife might actually be a better safety strategy and... could stop helms abusing their crews

Has anyone spoken to harness manufacturers?

What about every trapeze class stand displaying (in large print/posters) something like "New Harness Rule ill considered - Is the RYA doing anything?" at the dinghy show?

Garry

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Post Options Post Options   Quote Scooby_simon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jan 05 at 8:53pm

Hope you like it :

For clarification, please be advised that the rule concerning quick release for trapeze or hiking harness - ISAF Racing Rule of Sailing 40.2 - does not come into effect until 1 January 2006.

 

Is the ISAF going to be telling all the harness makers on the 1st Jan 2006 which ones are OK ? 

 

Does the ISAF feel that the harness makers will be able to instantly manufacture x,000,000's of harnesses on Jan 1st 2006 so we can all buy them and so comply with the rule ? 

 

Does the ISAF understand that all harnesses do not wear out at the same rate, if I need a new harness tomorrow, can I buy a discounted one (with the ISAF paying) as it may only be of use to me ‘till Jan 2006 ?

 

I think the answer to all the above is no.

 

Somewhere I read that the ISAF wanted to encourage the poorer nations around the world into sailing, does the ISAF understand this "non answering" of the question  posed above will impact the poorer nations (and poorer sailors) as they cannot afford to buy a new harness, JUST BECAUSE THE ISAF SAYS THEY MUST.

 

Come on ISAF

 

Make a statement about which designs are OK and which are not so we can all go and buy a new harness

 

Or has the ISAF decided this rule is flawed and should be removed.  If so, please do it now.

 

 

 

I propose a new rule.  “all sailors should have a knife attached to their boat that it capable of cutting any webbing (such as catamaran trampolines) and sail sheets (up to 10mm which is the largest I believe is used) attached to the transom of the boat (or Port transom of Catamarans) for the purpose of assisting rescue craft in freeing trapped sailors.    I’ll let you guys sort out the actual wording, you might be good at that.

 

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