Rossiter Pintail Mortagne sur Gironde, near Bordeaux |
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Laser 28 - Excellent example of this great design Hamble le rice |
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Laser 140101 Tynemouth |
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List classes of boat for sale |
Sailing Downwind |
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andymck ![]() Far too distracted from work ![]() Joined: 15 Dec 06 Location: Stamford Online Status: Offline Posts: 397 |
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Posted: 03 Sep 20 at 3:31pm |
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Having sailed next to Nick Craig when he was sailing Phantoms.
F 3-4 at Carsington some years ago. 1. He was often sailing by the Lee, loose rig and minimal kicker. 2. He was often turning to stay in the gusts and small Wave patterns 3. Went from third to first on the run The two in front were sailing high angles, one was a previous national champ. I was the lead Solution at a combined event and followed Nick, as the Phantom fleet cane through the slower sution fleet. Almost fell in three times, but fortunately had watched the rooster vid so saved it. I overtook one of the Phantoms as well. I never sailed high on the run in a solution after that. Even started doing the by the Lee thing in a national 12. Was quick there too, but easier to get the boom forward. Boats with spinnakers are a different breed. Andy Edited by andymck - 03 Sep 20 at 3:31pm |
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Andy Mck
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Mark Aged 42 ![]() Groupie ![]() Joined: 24 Aug 11 Online Status: Offline Posts: 98 |
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You have all assumed flat water. Watch top Laser sailors going downwind when there are waves, they steer crazy amounts to ensure the boat is using waves to the maximum
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lissa78 ![]() Newbie ![]() Joined: 11 Mar 20 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1 |
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You are right, I agree with you.
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H2 ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 26 Jul 17 Online Status: Offline Posts: 750 |
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For me I went out and just practised gybing until I was sure that I was not losing and possibly marginally gaining from the act of a gybe - yes I know the rules - go watch any race though. Once you know for sure there is no downside of popping in a roll gybe why not play the shifts as much as possible? I suspect this is what you are seeing in action rather than people messing with angles.
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H2 #115 (sold)
H2 145 OK 2082 |
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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It works in sub planing conditions too, if more subtly. Head up and get the better flow and some apparent wind, and you can slide down again and keep the sail working more efficiently.
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Noah ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 29 Dec 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 611 |
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What lots of peeps seem to miss - including me - is the ability to maintain speed while heading lower once planing has been achieved. I had a graphic demonstration of this years ago thanks to a 'large' and extremely able crew - thanks Robin. Hoisted at the top mark for the run leg, in a reasonable breeze. Not mental but plenty for planing. I'm pointing a the bottom and looking forward to a bit of a rest (all that mainsheet trimming is tiring, you know). Robin says 'head up', then 'more' until we're flying, then 'down', 'down' and 'down more' until we're pointing at the leeward mark but the apparent wind says we're reaching. I don't think I had ever been so fast before and it was somewhat scary at the time, but jeez, did it work! And this was in a wooden-top Fireball, so no rocketship. Lesson learned.
Edited by Noah - 12 Mar 20 at 1:01pm |
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Nick
D-Zero 316 |
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423zero ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 08 Jan 15 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 3420 |
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The Minisprint is best gybing boat I have ever sailed, in any wind strength, on a long leg I would not hesitate to swing from gybe to gybe, also with its chine, it sails well by the lee, so various options.
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Robert
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JimC ![]() Really should get out more ![]() ![]() Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6662 |
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I don't believe there are any sudden transitions. At dead down wind the whole rig is stalled out, no power and its all doggy, as the boat heads up a bit more of the rig starts to work better progressively as things improve.
Personally I doubt many people sail absolutely dead downwind for very long. There's an obvious test - pull the boom across with no course change. Does the boat feel exactly the same on the opposite gybe? Ultimately it seems to me a lot is in the ears. Your ears will tell you better than anything else if the boat is going faster or slower... Edited by JimC - 12 Mar 20 at 10:32am |
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Wetabix ![]() Posting king ![]() Joined: 15 Feb 10 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 118 |
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So: having started the leeward leg, do I keep the burgee pointing backwards and sail with the mainsail stalled in an apparent wind of 4 kts or do I turn up just a teeny weeny bit and bring the apparent wind more or less onto the beam and the leeward tell tales attached? I guess I could go to YouTube and dig out some races from the Stars, Lasers,Finns and 470s and see what they do. Volvos, 18ft Skiffs, GP32s and F50s are not quite as relevant!
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Rupert ![]() Really should get out more ![]() Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Maybe, and sometimes I'll bet against, with, as you'd expect, mixed results, some good, some bad. But putting this into a racing situation means my decision to go off course will be influenced by everything others have said. If someone is sailing angles, I may decide to cover and keep clear wind. If on my own, then the choice is DDW or 5 degrees off to create flow, depending upon wind strength, where the trees are, etc, as JimC says. But I sail short, slow boats, so the speed gains are limited, especially in non planing conditions. Volvo 60s they are not. |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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