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Selecting a boat: compromise?
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Selecting a boat: compromise?
    Posted: 19 Dec 18 at 11:14am
"Club sailor" is a good book (I have bought it) but you probably don't need both it and Start To Win as they cover much of the same ground. IMHO, Start To Win has the edge (but maybe I'm biased as I have had a copy of "Start To Win" since the early '70s).

Keith and Ian Escrit have pedigree (IIRC, Keith was Div 1 World Champion and Ian runner up back in the day) and were very approachable. They both sail at Yorkshire Dales (and were instrumental in opening Grimworth up to windsurfers and dinghy sailors).


Edited by Sam.Spoons - 19 Dec 18 at 11:19am
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jeffers View Drop Down
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 18 at 11:03am
Originally posted by iGRF

Two bits of advice from me.
1) It's time to read a couple of books if your serious about racing, get start to win by Eric Twiname for starters then there are others, there's a guy who posts here has written one and being a dement I've forgotten it, but it'll probably come to me later.

Clive Eplett Club Sailor from back to front (order it here http://clubsailor.co.uk/wp/buy/ promo code XMAS18 will get you a discount)

Not my book just promoting for Clive (who did used to hang around here).


Edited by jeffers - 19 Dec 18 at 11:04am
Paul
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Posts: 6499 		Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 18 at 10:18am
Two bits of advice from me.
1) It's time to read a couple of books if your serious about racing, get start to win by Eric Twiname for starters then there are others, there's a guy who posts here has written one and being a dement I've forgotten it, but it'll probably come to me later.

2) Yorkshire? Seek out the Escrit brothers, they'll set you straight as to what to do Keith or Ian spent their lives doing proper things like windsurfing first, then dinghy sailing, the way it should happen. As to the boat get something that's faster than whatever is being sailed at your local club that way you get to keep up with the good people at the front and watch what they do, mimic how they sail (body language stuff, tactics etc) then when you feel you're up to it, by all means get what they're sailing and see if you can still do it. Don't fall into the trap of buying the same as everyone else first, you'll forever be at the back, get dispirited and eventually give up.
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jeffers View Drop Down
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 18 at 3:38pm
Originally posted by The_Pilot

All great posts everyone - thank you!
I’m heading to YDSC on the 27th to meet some members and hopefully get more familiar with the operation there, the groups of owners and what they get up to. Finding the right club and the opportunities are ultimately what this is all about :) I must admit I do like the idea of a single-hander and then crewing for people who are on the look out. Part of the nervousness here is that I’ve never been out on a wire and subsequently will need to consider this progressive / development rather than jumping in as a pro!!

So then I’m back to the 100 / full rig Laser / RS Aero / Laser Vago (?). All useful knowledge though being received - so thank you!

If you are considering an Aero then do give a D-Zero a try, there is one at YDSC and the guy who owns it is a good chap.

27th will be very busy too, there are 4 or 5 D-Zero people heading up for the event.
Paul
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Posts: 3401 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 18 at 2:15pm
Yorkshire Dales have, at last count, 4 Blazes. It's definitely worth a go in one. Grimworth is a big sailing area with, relatively at least, steady winds compared to most lakes so would suit the Blaze and the RS100.
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Posts: 2 		Post Options Post Options   Quote The_Pilot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 18 at 1:34pm
All great posts everyone - thank you!
I’m heading to YDSC on the 27th to meet some members and hopefully get more familiar with the operation there, the groups of owners and what they get up to. Finding the right club and the opportunities are ultimately what this is all about :) I must admit I do like the idea of a single-hander and then crewing for people who are on the look out. Part of the nervousness here is that I’ve never been out on a wire and subsequently will need to consider this progressive / development rather than jumping in as a pro!!

So then I’m back to the 100 / full rig Laser / RS Aero / Laser Vago (?). All useful knowledge though being received - so thank you!
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Posts: 310 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Gordon 1430 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 18 at 11:08am
Totally agree with whats been said and only wanted to add some clubs also have boats you can hire so might get a chance to try before you buy a class of boat.
good luck and enjoy whatever you choose to go with
Gordon
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Posts: 1312 		Post Options Post Options   Quote Do Different Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 18 at 11:06am
Check out Clubs YDSC is really lively and been growing steadily for a few years now since a major refurb. 
Don't be in a rush to buy a boat and certainly not one designed for two people, nothing worse than sitting ashore with a boat and no crew / helm.
Your size is in the window to crew a reasonably powerful boat and more often than not a keen crew will quickly find a ride. I often think crews have more fun, especially in single wire two person boats, best view in the house with no hiking, what's not to like?
You could always get a singlehander and make it known you're available to crew, best of both worlds.
I think there's also a few Contenders at YDSC, might be a leap of faith but they are a pretty kindly if you treat them with a little respect.  
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 18 at 10:26am
In short: I'd recommend joining a club first. 

Long version:
Likely a club will have 'club' boats you can use (single and double-handers) or you can start by sailing with other people in their boats. If you're only looking to buy once this will allow you to make a much more informed decision. Or, you may find you really like crewing, and never have to pay to own a boat at all!

It's great to hear you're looking to do some racing. It really adds another dimension to sailing and you'll improve your skills much faster than cruising alone. However, racing you're more likely to choose a boat based upon; 
- local fleets to race against, 
- your racing weight and the availability of a complimentary crew (ability and size)
- whether you like the people who race them. 
Again this makes it more important to investigate local clubs and meet the people before making a purchase. 

There are some boats which are raced competitively which are also forgiving enough to be sailed solo or two up. I wouldn't really put the RS200 or RS400 in that category though. The Feva isn't a bad idea, but you are going to be very big for it as soon as you have another person, plus it's more of a junior trainer type boat, so I can't see you wanting to stay in it for three years.  

The more racier boats are less forgiving with crew numbers, so the best boats are dual design for training and a bit of racing. My family had a GP14, Laser 2000 (now RS), Gull and Mirror which all fit this bill. Gull and Mirror were better if your potential crew is likely to be a child or you spend most of your time solo. GP14 and 2000 are better if your likely crew is an adult or you spend more time sailing 2-up. A word of warning here, boats that are forgiving on crew weight achieve this stability by being heavy themselves. Pulling some of these heavier boats up a steep slipway, shingle/sandy beach alone is quite a chore. 

However, if those boats (or similar) don't have fleets at your preferred club, then you may reconsider. You'll still be able to get handicap racing and people will still be really welcoming and helpful. But unless there are people there familiar with the boat you have then it's a barrier to getting knowledgeable help from your fellow members. And that really should be one of the big selling points of joining a club. 

Hope you get on well and let us know how you do



Edited by mozzy - 18 Dec 18 at 10:32am
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jeffers View Drop Down
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Posts: 3048 		Post Options Post Options   Quote jeffers Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 18 at 9:19am
Good advice from Sam. There is a very varied fleet at YDSC and many single handers that will fit the bill (I wouldnt go for a 200 or a 400, you definitely need a crew if you are going to race). I would pop along to each club. If you ask nicely they will probably even let you have a go so you can get a feel before you buy in.
Paul
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