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Summing up ...

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Olympic Sailing
Forum Discription: The top end racing in our sport
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9708
Printed Date: 21 Oct 20 at 4:31pm
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Topic: Summing up ...
Posted By: 2547
Subject: Summing up ...
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 1:55pm
Just been watching the 470s on TV ....
 
Well now it's all over for GBR what are our thoughts on the event?
 
Here are mine:
 
- 5 medals for GBR, good team effort ahead of the public target of 4. I am sure they hoped for more but given the uncontrolable factors I think 5 is a great results
- Congratulations to AUS who done us in our own back yard
- Nothe course was poor and too fluky for events of this type
- TV coverage was excellent; commentary improved I thought. No mention of the joker in latter programmes so perhaps they read this?
- No GPS tracking was dissapointing
- We were lucky with the Weather
- Looked well organised and Weymouth put on a good show
- All bodes well for Rio; who will we see switch to kites?



Replies:
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 2:29pm
Excellent results from an excellent team... got to be happy with that given the conditions and format.

I thought both Golds were well deserved from the antipodeans today, they won on the water fair and square and the Silvers are still monumental victories for the two British crews.  

Great racing to watch- biggest surprise personally was watching the Finns, loved it.  Want one, want somewhere local to sail against more of them.  And that isn't Anslieism.... JHC was totally inspiring to watch and there were other moments of brilliance that just captivated me throughout the coverage.    

Biggest disappointment... 49ers, DULL.  Made me realise I've been wrong about a lot when it comes to potential televised sailing... this was the first true test- 5 minutes on youtube is just not the same as watching an entire race like we've been lucky enough to have this time.  There's no spectacle in watching a skiff go fast, it doesn't hold your attention like a tactical race.

Biggest loser- match racing.... kicked out from Rio before they had a chance to shine.  For established sailors this has been great to watch imho.  With more time and an AC coming up, the format would really come into its own as technical, tactical piece of televised sailing for the genuine sailing audience.  

Still just about hanging on to still giving a crap.... RS:X.  Despite the great respect I have for both british athletes, watching them didn't make me want to reach for my board and go race.  Maybe if it were a slalom format it would be more relevant?  The only reason for caring is that I think kite racing will be even worse to watch and obviously I empathise with those who've followed a pathway only to have ISAF switch the torch off without due notice.  It deserves one more games.... but in truth come 2020 I couldn't give a fig if there wasn't a board discipline at all.  

Best moment- Sas giving Hannah a hug....  legends.  

Harshest moment - Goody's interview with Penny Clark.  He's a true athlete and I hope he bounces back into something else for Rio.  

To finish on a positive note - absolutely amazing supporting infrastructure from the Y&Y team.  Thank you Gael Mark (& Tom for snapping it all).... you enabled us all to engage and really enjoy it and that is genuinely appreciated by all of us.  Thank you so much for all your hard work!    Roll on Rio... 


Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 2:34pm
Aye- it is important to remember that the 470 Silver were hugely ahead of the rest of the fleet, and only just behind the winners, who are class acts- no shame is losing out to them.

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Al


Posted By: G.R.F.
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 2:40pm
Well apart from the obvious annoyance that the convicts have bettered our gold haul, our guys have done us proud. As to the coverage, in all seriousness I consider us lucky to even be able to complain about the commentating t**sers, it's the best televised sailing I've ever witnessed and I've actually learned stuff from watching, got my pumping technique totally dialled, watching that downwind laser bear right off to clew first wave riding inspired to to heroics last night that I normally would push my luck at. Really annoyed a dentists appointment robbed me of the mens 470 and the wimmens start (I gather the Kiwis visit to the doctor paid off).

So summing up, I'm really going to miss having it to watch and have increased my respect of our guys (and theirs) a thousand fold, maybe some dinghy sailors aren't such t**sers after all, even though they could still learn a thing or to from the dusty old windsurf racers tactics book here and there.Wink

And +1 on 2547's more factual summing up.




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Posted By: Peaky
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 2:57pm
Great to be able to watch it, great to have feeds and Y&Y (and Stu) and good medal haul. Five medals is a(nother) good haul, but those who missed out will all probably be thinking "could have, should have".

Do you reckon the kiters will come from the existing world of kites or squaddie sailors switching over? I could imagine some 49er crews being tempted.

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Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 3:03pm

I can't think of any regatta where competitors don't look back and think about lost opportunities.

I hope those who missed out can take posatives from their performances.
 
Clark comforting Mills was nice to see; Clark having missed out before knows how good a silver really is ...
 
Congratulations TeamGB ... now to restore our #1 position over AUS in Rio.


Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by Peaky

Do you reckon the kiters will come from the existing world of kites or squaddie sailors switching over? I could imagine some 49er crews being tempted.

It depends on definitions.... yes, I reckon they will have ktiesurfed before recreationally maybe.  Do I think the kities will come from the existing world of kiteboard racing?  No, except probably in the US where they can't get a pathway up the front drive, never mind to an Olympic sailing medal.  Some ex 29er crew called Johnny Heineken is suitably named and locked for the cool wall.  I'm sure he'll get his ass suitably schooled on what it really takes to make an Olympic champion in due course.  

From the UK.... watch out for the RS:X or Freestyly transitioners....  although there's one kid, Olly Bridge, who's likely to feature in the front runners for selection and is already an early days medal hopeful.  His mum being the 'bird option' apparently.


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 3:18pm
Hopefully there will be less of a "they just have to turn up to win" attitude next time around from sections of the British press. I'm glad my prediction of 2 silvers and a bronze was wrong - from the first few days of sailing it looked about right, but then the sailors got their acts together a little as they settled into the routine.

Really hope some of the young teams stay together for the next games. And do you think Iain Percy kitesurfs?! Or will he move into AC sailing with Ben?


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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 10 Aug 12 at 3:23pm
Iain Percy was interviewed about his bird.... you know, the RS:X girlie, the fit one, yep her.  Same name as his sister... I bet that's awkward.  

apparently he couldn't even get off the beach on the RS:X

I think the AC might just be a bit more lucrative than a career as a Mary Poppins impersonator.  

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/how-we-met-iain-percy--bryony-shaw-7920021.html - http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/how-we-met-iain-percy--bryony-shaw-7920021.html


Posted By: j24_4208
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 4:40am
I was a bit disappointed by the 470 silvers, probably like anyone else. The men made a valiant effort, but once AUS got ahead downwind, there was not much left to be done. The women I think  should have tacked after the start to go with NZL to the right side of the course, instead of going in the opposite direction - much better to be close and have the chance to overtake at the end, than take a flyer. I guess they could not quite tack because of another boat on their hip. Still, overall the team should be proud of the total results.
The Northe course did screw the GBR teams esp STAR, (almost Finn), 470M and 470W, and also the Elliot.



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J24 4208
Laser 190300


Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 7:36am
Do you honestly think they forgot to cover?   Even if they had initially planned to go port, they would have protected their prestart advantage if they could. It looked to me like they were pinned out by AUS on the port side. Team racing? Maybe, maybe not.... Either way trying to match race in a fleet race was always a tall order for both NZL and GBR.


Posted By: Oatsandbeans
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 7:54am
Hindsight is a great thing, especially when doing it from the luxury of your PC tablet with a cool beer in your hand, but in both 470 races there were a key point where the GB sailors lost control. For the boys it was when they crossed the Aussies and didn't tack onto them ( even Simmonds thought that they would do that). For the girls it was letting the Kiwis get across to the right after the start, (It could have been tricky executing due to the other boats, but we all know the effect of separation on such a shifty course.)  But what a weeks sailing from both teams well done, terrific sailing and 2 silver medals, we can't complain about that.


Posted By: Fahrenden Gesellen
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 10:02am
Fantastic results. What a week Big smile Wonderful to see the 470 guys ecstatically congratulating one another in the water just across the finish!
I agree the visual coverage was brilliant; great variety of different locations - onboard, from the air, from RIBs on the course - but the commentary woefully inadequate from some of the team, well, mainly one. Lucy O'Conner on the boxing -  that's how it should be done.
No wonder some find sailing coverage boring when commentary fails to explain basic techniques, so that those who know nothing can begin to understand the subtleties, and decisions that have to be constantly made to suit an ever-changing unpredictable scenario.
Did anyone spot this amusing Richard Simmonds gaffe - mistaking the Finns for the Aussies in the match-racing, when it's plain that the Finns are leading not even a minute into the start? Watch from the start at 02:09:54
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/2012/live-video/p00w32nb
his blooper is at 02:10:49, and there's a wry stifled chuckle from Leigh Macmillan at 02:11:11 LOL


Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 10:05am
When the kiwi's headed off on port I did have a split second of "TACK" going through my head, but then I realised the loss it would've incurred (effectively wiping out 80% of the advantage gained in the pre-start) and thought, no, ok, carry on for a bit.    Very tough decision to take that one was a complete roll of the dice.


Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 10:48am
Originally posted by pondmonkey

Originally posted by Peaky

Do you reckon the kiters will come from the existing world of kites or squaddie sailors switching over? I could imagine some 49er crews being tempted.

It depends on definitions.... yes, I reckon they will have ktiesurfed before recreationally maybe.  Do I think the kities will come from the existing world of kiteboard racing?  No, except probably in the US where they can't get a pathway up the front drive, never mind to an Olympic sailing medal.  Some ex 29er crew called Johnny Heineken is suitably named and locked for the cool wall.  I'm sure he'll get his ass suitably schooled on what it really takes to make an Olympic champion in due course.  

From the UK.... watch out for the RS:X or Freestyly transitioners....  although there's one kid, Olly Bridge, who's likely to feature in the front runners for selection and is already an early days medal hopeful.  His mum being the 'bird option' apparently.
It was mentioned in the coverage that Dorian is heading to California post games to start his kite surfing campaign. 


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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 2:05pm
 
Originally posted by Peaky



Do you reckon the kiters will come from the existing world of kites or squaddie sailors switching over? I could imagine some 49er crews being tempted.

It's an interesting one. One of my objection to kiting is there's no sensible places for those getting started inland, at least in this country- countries with big lakes will be fne, but otherwise it is pretty much coastal only



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-_
Al


Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 11 Aug 12 at 11:48pm
AIUI banned in Sydney harbour too?


Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 12 Aug 12 at 8:26am

Quite possibly. Also, banned from any half-way busy beach in this country.

There's no good prospects for a "Team 15" style grassroots kite-boarding scheme, in this country or elsewhere.



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Al


Posted By: gordon
Date Posted: 12 Aug 12 at 3:02pm
Low point of the TV coverage - the red flag protest between FIN and RUSin the match racing. Quite obviously the commentators had not a clue about standard MR procedure for resolving disputes.

And their incapacity to explain the idea of giving room to keep clear when ROW boat changes course - as happened in one of the AUS/ESP final races. BBC should give Bill O'Hara a job!

Gordon


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Gordon


Posted By: Chris Turner
Date Posted: 12 Aug 12 at 5:02pm
Bill O'Hara had a job, he was the rules advisor/coach for the Russians


Posted By: gordon
Date Posted: 12 Aug 12 at 8:45pm
Yes, but he, or any other IU/IJ, would have done more good for the sport, by explaning the rules in a coherent fashion to the general public on TV.

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Gordon


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 12 Aug 12 at 10:06pm
Originally posted by gordon

by explaning the rules in a coherent fashion to the general public on TV.

Good trick if you can manage it, but the general public proverbially doesn't understand the offside rule in Soccer, doesn't understand most of the rules in Rugby, and has the attention span of a Mayfly...

I mean, have you ever heard a commentator try and explain the rules of Golf? And look what a hash they normally make of explaining the rules on the Formula One shows...

I'm not saying it can't be done, but I know I wouldn't have a hope of managing it...


Posted By: Chris 249
Date Posted: 13 Aug 12 at 1:46am
Originally posted by j24_4208

IThe Northe course did screw the GBR teams esp STAR, (almost Finn), 470M and 470W, and also the Elliot.

Why was the home team supposedly "screwed" 50% of the time?
 
That's way above the odds, especially on a course they should have known better than anyone else.
 
Have you done a comparison of their placings on the Nothe course v their placings on other courses?


Posted By: ohFFsake
Date Posted: 13 Aug 12 at 2:00am
Originally posted by Chris 249

Originally posted by j24_4208

IThe Northe course did screw the GBR teams esp STAR, (almost Finn), 470M and 470W, and also the Elliot.

Why was the home team supposedly "screwed" 50% of the time?
 
That's way above the odds, especially on a course they should have known better than anyone else.
 
Have you done a comparison of their placings on the Nothe course v their placings on other courses?

I'd say 50% is actually way below the odds!

If the wind is 100% unpredictable and there are ten boats in the race then the odds of any particular sailor winning are 10 to 1 against. Looking at the races I've seen on the Nothe then maybe it's (say) 50% predictable which halves the odds, so they are still 5:1 against the best sailor winning!

So if we have 5 "best" sailors going into the medal races needing a good result then 1 gold and 4 silvers would be the statistically correct result, whereas if we had a steady course with predictable winds then it would have been 5 golds...




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