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The best racing sailor ever ...

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9356
Printed Date: 26 Jan 21 at 2:44am
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Topic: The best racing sailor ever ...
Posted By: 2547
Subject: The best racing sailor ever ...
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 2:25pm
So apart from Ben who's on the short list?
 
Coutts, Connor Elvstrom, Blake, Grael ...?



Replies:
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 2:28pm
GRF, of course!

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 2:36pm
There are just so many more opportunities now than there were in, say, the 1930's, that it is really hard to tell just who might be better than who. And how do you compare skippering a 12m or a J class to helming a Finn?

I think I'd agree he is a pretty damn fine sailor, and certainly one of the most single minded racers I've come across - his self belief is staggering. But probably justified...


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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 2:38pm
Originally posted by Rupert

GRF, of course!
 
Only in his own mind is this a fact ...


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 2:58pm
Elvstrom changed the entire game like no-one before or since. And in some ways he didn't really have the big event temperament.

Blake, Coutts and Conner aren't even on the same page as the great Dane.


Posted By: olly_love
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:06pm
Originally posted by Rupert

There are just so many more opportunities now than there were in, say, the 1930's, that it is really hard to tell just who might be better than who. And how do you compare skippering a 12m or a J class to helming a Finn?

I think I'd agree he is a pretty damn fine sailor, and certainly one of the most single minded racers I've come across - his self belief is staggering. But probably justified...


dont forget ben did helm a cup boat and is on the list for the current cup.
the main thing ben excels is under pressure, he will come from last to first in one run


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TWO FRANK-Hunter Impala




Posted By: G.R.F.
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:28pm
Lester Noble has to stand out imv, if as his fan club suggest he has mastered that 49er..

None of those folk you've listed have sailed and won on Div 2 sailboards and dinghies and now mastered a boat like the 49er, so until I've spotted someone better, those guys are all single discipline sailors and we all know sailing sailboards is technically more difficult to 'sail' due to the absence of compasses etc never mind the motor skills that wag was cracking on about with clearly no understanding of what they were, that need to be possessed at the top of the windsurfing game.

Then comes me.Wink


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Posted By: ex laser
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:31pm
ben never used a compass when he was laser sailing, dont know if he uses one in the finn.

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Posted By: Daniel Holman
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:34pm
No mention of Robert Scheidt? Just chalked up 3rd star worlds to go with 7 laser world champs. And two golds two silvers at Olympics.


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:37pm
Eric Tabarley? Another game changer, but in ocean racing.

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: gbrspratt
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:40pm
Lowell North?

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Posted By: CJ..
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:51pm
No doubt about it.....got to be Paul Elvstrom.  Get hold of a copy of the book "Elvstrom Speaks" and you'll realise what a legend he was!


Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:51pm
Originally posted by ex laser

ben never used a compass when he was laser sailing, dont know if he uses one in the finn.

you probably don't need one when you're on the water as often as he is!


Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:57pm
Originally posted by pondmonkey


Originally posted by ex laser

ben never used a compass when he was laser sailing, dont know if he uses one in the finn.


you probably don't need one when you're on the water as often as he is!


he's a terminator so there's one built into his head

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Everything I say is my opinion, honest


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 3:59pm
Originally posted by pondmonkey

Originally posted by ex laser

ben never used a compass when he was laser sailing, dont know if he uses one in the finn.

you probably don't need one when you're on the water as often as he is!
You dont need a compass when you use "the force" ...
 
So our short list is:
 
Ben Ainslie
Paul Elvstrom
Robert Scheidt
Torben Grael
Russel Coutts
Dennis Connor
Peter Blake
Eric Tabarley
 
2 further slots available; Y&Y poll allows 10 options ...
 
 
 
 


Posted By: tedm
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:00pm
and we all know sailing sailboards is technically more difficult to 'sail' due to the absence of compasses etc never mind the motor skills that wag was cracking on about with clearly no understanding of what they were, that need to be possessed at the top of the windsurfing game.

[cough]borrocks[/cough]  Sorry, something caught in my throat Wink


Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:08pm
2547 - you should probably chuck one of those french cat fellas in for good measure.  They seem to compete across the wind and water spectrum, from small regatta courses through to global RTWs.  Yves Loday even designed the fastest, most tactically astute lake racing monohull the world has ever seen- GRF is about to attest anyway.

And what about the Spanish boys - Martinez & Fernandez, not one trick ponies either.


Posted By: Laser 173312
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:13pm
Can I put forward Joshua Slocum, the first man to sail solo around the world.
2547 don't you mean Peter Blake?
 
 


Posted By: G.R.F.
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:21pm
I would have thought by now that Noah fella must be pretty high on the list was he in CVRDA?

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Posted By: Dougal
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:32pm
John Merricks? Jimmy Spithill? Nathan Outteridge?
 
Personally I would vote for Elvstrom...
 
or Captain Pugwash.


Posted By: Max McCarthy
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:36pm
I second Nathan Outteridge, a good moth sailor, and also good with those 49ers

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Vintage skol moth 3438


Posted By: rodney
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:43pm
Off TopicEmbarrassed

Ben uses a ball compass not one of these new fangled T***T*** that the Finn class rules now allow.  I must say that I too prefer a ball compass (big one for me fading eyes) but as all of my boats are for sale I am obliged to use the dreaded TT.


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Rodney Cobb
Suntouched Sailboats Limited
http://www.suntouched.co.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.suntouched.co.uk
[EMAIL=rodney@suntouched.co.uk">rodney@suntouched.co.uk


Posted By: rodney
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 4:46pm
Oh!  I vote for Jack Braidwood Smile

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Rodney Cobb
Suntouched Sailboats Limited
http://www.suntouched.co.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.suntouched.co.uk
[EMAIL=rodney@suntouched.co.uk">rodney@suntouched.co.uk


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 5:25pm
How about Stewart Morris?

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: L192444
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 5:42pm
Who?


Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 5:44pm
I think Lawrie Smith and Rodney Pattison should be on the list.
Who else would be there if we were looking for a top 20?
 Buddy Melges?


Posted By: rodney
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 5:50pm
Originally posted by L192444

Who?

Who to who?


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Rodney Cobb
Suntouched Sailboats Limited
http://www.suntouched.co.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.suntouched.co.uk
[EMAIL=rodney@suntouched.co.uk">rodney@suntouched.co.uk


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 6:19pm
Stewart Morris - very fast sailor before and after WW2. Won lots in I 14's when they were THE class, won gold in the swallow in 1948. 

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446


Posted By: rodney
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 6:20pm
Seriously!  It's not that easy because the goals, the levels of professionalism and the rewards have changed so much.  My personal view is that Ben ranks among the best  but Elvstrom and many others probably deserve the same accolade.  Maybe it's an impossible mission to make this judgement.  

Main thing for me, right now, is that Ben gets the Gold in a few month's time.  I will let history decide after that Smile


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Rodney Cobb
Suntouched Sailboats Limited
http://www.suntouched.co.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.suntouched.co.uk
[EMAIL=rodney@suntouched.co.uk">rodney@suntouched.co.uk


Posted By: charlie1019
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 6:52pm
How about Tom Slingsby? Just picked up his 5th Laser Worlds - that's a couple more than Ben collected.

Maybe another example of how good he is: the D-One Gold Cup last year out at Garda where the results make it look like a walk in the park! While we don't know how seriously the event was taken, the other top guys aren't exactly slow (in fact Scott in 3rd is the only man to have beaten an on form Ben in the Finn) and everyone was new to he boat, so no one had any huge advantage.


Posted By: tedm
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 7:20pm
Oops forgot about Smithy.  Great sailor and a great guy to sail with.

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http://www.wrpclothing.co.uk">


Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 7:40pm
Eric the Red? Sailed all the way to the US of A a long time before anyone else bothered.

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Everything I say is my opinion, honest


Posted By: GarethT
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 10:03pm
Everyone seems to forget Iain Percy, I guess because he's in Ainslie's era, but gold in both Finn and Star puts him in a very exclusive club.


Posted By: dogslife
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 10:06pm
After this weeks total domination of the Finn Gold Cup I can't help but think that Mr Ainslie has to be right up there..........Clap

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Posted By: fudheid
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 10:08pm
John Bertrand ...... took the cup from the yanks and won the etchell world last year. Downside is he is an aussie but that is better than having DC???



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Cheers you

only me from over the sea......


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 17 May 12 at 10:13pm
I agree if you have Conner in there you have to have JB... but with just one bronze medal each I wouldn't put them in Elvstrom's league. To be a successful Americas Cup skipper you first have to be born in the right country (admittedly less so now) and then get hired by the right team. If you fail in either of those non sailing challenges you are stuffed for the AC.


Posted By: Dougal
Date Posted: 18 May 12 at 8:46am
Eric Twiname?  Start to Win was THE book to read when I was starting racing.  I know he died young but I don't know how much he won.

Edit: having done a quick google on him he is probably a candidate for the 'most influential' category rather then best racer.




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