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Solo - why Winder?

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13681
Printed Date: 30 Nov 20 at 11:32pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Solo - why Winder?
Posted By: A2Z
Subject: Solo - why Winder?
Date Posted: 14 Sep 20 at 10:21pm
I know there is a bit of a wall of silence on these things but Iím curious.  Everyone says good things about all the builders but ultimately the vast majority of Solo sailors buy a Winder. Why is that? Are they cheaper?


Boatyard@Beer, Ovington and P&B all have good reputations in the wider sailing community but fight for scraps in the land of Solos... what gives?



Replies:
Posted By: davidyacht
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 6:43am
I shall raise my head above the parapet In support of Winder Solos ... well engineered product which is constantly being improved, choice of two successful proven shapes, constant supply not in batches, active in the class, support the class, prepared to tweak/customize, fair price, good residuals, nice people.

In fairness to the other builders, I donít think that there is much wrong with any of the builders that you mention, there is little in the performance or quality of the build, but Winders were there first in the market with a winning FRP product and are more established.  

My approach is that unless a supplier messes up, they have my loyalty ... hence I have had five Winder Solos.


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Happily living in the past


Posted By: GarethT
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 6:46am
Out of interest, why 5? Are you going back decades, Solos have a competitive life of X years,or you just like shiny things?


Posted By: davidyacht
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 8:37am
Because the residual values for Solos are high relative to the replacement cost, I replace every two or three years, and I suspect the depreciation cost is around £ 500* each year , which is not bad considering I sail most weeks.  *man maths!  

There are quite a few that do this and it doesn't hurt the class to have a steady supply of not quite new boats.

Worth bearing in mind that the Solo that won the Nations Cup last year was a Winder 1 and around 10 years old.


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Happily living in the past


Posted By: Mark Aged 42
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 8:53am
Out of curiousity, there seems to be a steady supply of older Holt Solos on eBay. Are these likely to be hopelessly heavy, or uncompetitve shapes?


Posted By: GarethT
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 11:00am
Originally posted by davidyacht

Because the residual values for Solos are high relative to the replacement cost, I replace every two or three years, and I suspect the depreciation cost is around £ 500* each year , which is not bad considering I sail most weeks.† *man maths!††
There are quite a few that do this and it doesn't hurt the class to have a steady supply of not quite new boats.
Worth bearing in mind that the Solo that won the Nations Cup last year was a Winder 1 and around 10 years old.


Makes sense. Europe class could definitely do with a pipeline of good used boats like that.


Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 11:15am
they are lovely guys to deal with... it feels like a proper piece of craftmanship when you pick one up.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 11:18am
Originally posted by Mark Aged 42

Out of curiousity, there seems to be a steady supply of older Holt Solos on eBay. Are these likely to be hopelessly heavy, or uncompetitve shapes?

Older GRP solos have a reputation for being soft/flexible/not stiff but overweight and the joints between the tanks and hull are often weak or failing. Basically, before the introduction of FRP fibreglass was a poor material to build boats designed for plywood. GRP works well with 3D curves but not with large flat panels. If you want a cheap, competitive (well, fairly competitive at club level), old Solo then a good wooden boat is the only way to go.


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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"


Posted By: Late starter
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 12:44pm
I had quite a nice looking GRP composite Solo a few years back and my experience was also that it wasn't a quick boat. A pal of mine had a half decent wooden boat of similar age and value and it was way quicker, so I agree with Sam.




Posted By: ian.r.mcdonald
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 5:45pm
I bought a new grp composite Solo ( last century)

I was unhappy with it, it was slow.

Jim Hunt offered to help and I took it for him to sail in a very competitive club fleet. He won both races. And he hadn't made any changes.

I wonder how?

And yes, the wooden double floor ones are way faster!


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 5:57pm
I suppose the differences between boats are relatively small compared with the differences between sailors. I'll bet if the three front guys in a decent club fleet swapped boats with the three at the back their positions would not change.

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"


Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 6:30pm
Winder seems to be the boat of choice. I seem to recall the P&B Solos are Winder ones fitted out by P&B, I could be wrong though.

Winder have 3 models, Mk1, Mk1a and Mk2 which give a bit of something for everyone.A guy at our club had a 1a and really couldnt get on with it so he now has a 2 which he loves.


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Paul
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D-Zero GBR 74


Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 7:09pm
1a is a mk1 with a new deck mould. Hull is the same.


Posted By: A2Z
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 7:13pm
 But are they really any better than an Ovi or BY@B?  Iím sure they make the buying experience pleasant too.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 15 Sep 20 at 7:41pm
It's probably 'cos people will buy a winning boat, if you win enough you become a safe bet in the eyes of the average sailor.

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"



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