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singlehander for small(ish) lake

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Choosing a boat
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URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12843
Printed Date: 25 Jun 18 at 3:59pm
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Topic: singlehander for small(ish) lake
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Subject: singlehander for small(ish) lake
Date Posted: 04 Sep 17 at 9:41pm
I know I've asked this question before but I'm now a little better informed so I'll ask again......

I've got a Blaze which I sail in Holyhead bay..... And a Supernova for the inland club (Leigh & Lowton). I love the Blaze and have just returned from a five week holiday in Anglesey, sailing 4 or 5 days a week, mostly the Blaze and in F2-6.... it's an absolute joy to sail. I managed a few races in the 'nova before the summer break and found it very difficult (I clicked with the Blaze on the first sail). I'm definitely going to give the 'nova some time, certainly until Christmas but am already considering alternatives if I can't gel with her.

Budget is £1500 but I would not rule out spending (maybe quit a lot) more. Mostly it will be sailed/raced on Wednesday nights and winter Sundays and I'm wondering if I could cope with a Phantom at 76 kg in my shorts? Solution, D-Zero and Aero are also possibles as are Solo. OK and maybe even a L@ser.....

Thoughts so far :-

D-Zero, Aero and Solution are probably over budget (though a Solution showed up this week that was just affordable).

Phantom is definitely affordable but depends on the PN committee at L&LSC and being able to hold the damn thing flattish............

Solos are affordable but I'm not prepared to maintain a wooden boat and competitive plastic ones are expensive.

L@ser..... well...... I sailed one last week for an hour and it wasn't as bad as I expected but I guess anything feels okay in F3......

Or should I just buy another Blaze?


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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)



Replies:
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 04 Sep 17 at 9:47pm
Solution [ /end thread]

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https://www.edgeactionsports.co.uk/collections/snowboards" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals      https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 04 Sep 17 at 11:45pm
Why did I know you'd say that Graeme... :) Definitely like the idea but used ones are a bit scarce and somewhat stretching of the budget.

FWIW it was your Phantom thread that got me considering a Phant as a possibility, then my mate beat me on handicap after I finished 30 secs in front (sailing the Blaze) in his pre 999/tin rig Phantom on it's handicap of 1047. He's a good bit heavier than me but we're probably pretty evenly matched in ability. 

I guess, on aggregate, I might be better sailing at the bottom of a boats weight range than at the top.

I'm pretty good in the light stuff and not so much when it blows so I guess it comes down to 
do I choose a boat that flatters my strengths or compensates for my weaknesses'? The Blaze does the the latter but maybe the compromise in light wind performance on a small lake, is too much of a disadvantage and I should accept that I'm not going to be competitive in a blow......


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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: Phil_1193
Date Posted: 05 Sep 17 at 6:14am
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

I'm wondering if I could cope with a Phantom at 76 kg in my shorts?

Yes you will.

But in all honesty, if you sail a Blaze anyway I would suggest you stick with one.

Having recently sailed against a few, including the current national champion, when it gets to hiking weather, they will be more comfortable and controllable for you up wind than the Phantom, but down wind in the same conditions, the Phantom is the easy winner. In light weather crouched in the bottom of the boat, neither are very comfortable!!

Swings and roundabouts.

If however you are sailing the same type of boat at both locations, it can only improve your sailing and understanding of what makes that boat go. Swapping and changing means adapting each time you sail, possibly affecting your competativeness in each boat.


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 05 Sep 17 at 7:31am
Boat swapping is fun, though! You may never reach the potential like a full time Laser sailor would, but you won't forget how to smile, either.

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Firefly 2324, Lightning 130, Puffin 229, Topper 44496, Minisail 3131, Minisail 3446


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 05 Sep 17 at 10:38am
Well I'm OK in light and have always struggled in single handers in a breeze, probably because most of my single hander choices have been a tad over canvassed, EPS 9.4, Blaze, 10, RS100 10.2 (not that I gave it long enough) and this, (the Solution) has been the first boat I can still consider that I'm actually competing in rather than just get round surviving. I've had a couple of quite breezy races I've managed to hold my own in but I put that down to the beam of that Solution, it seems relative to it's length and the sail size quite wide so there's a fair bit of righting moment the further back you sit. (You tend to want to sit on a narrower bit when it's light and get forced back when it gets breezy). Not that I won't get thrashed by the other young guy when it get seriously gusty, but he's as many kilos heavier as he is years younger, but it gives one a measure of how useless one still is in a breeze.
One day I'll capitulate and get into a bloody streaker or something more suitable to 68 kgs, but I'll miss the power and being able to seek the front of the fleet where tbh I'm happiest and lots of times when it's windy folk don't race anyway so it doesn't really make lots of sense to equip for strong wind.

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https://www.edgeactionsports.co.uk/collections/snowboards" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals      https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 26 Feb 18 at 11:24pm
Revisiting this thread as I have raced the Blaze over the winter with much enjoyment but little success Smile and I do think I will be moving the Supernova on soon.

But, while I still think the Blaze is not the ideal boat on the lake most of my problems are with boat handling (after 30 years windsurfing and the last 10 sailing the Spice but not competing seriously). I'm getting better in the Blaze and think I'll go for either another Blaze (and remain uncompetitive) or something else to suit the lake better.

FWIW I'm still around 76-78kg.

So, no trapeze or kite....... Budget £2k (but a little stretchable). Not a Solo (yet at least) as I think I don't get on with fully battened sails on a singlehander and FRP are out of budget anyway. Not a L@ser............ And nothing wooden (as I CBA maintaining it). That Lightning 368 iGRF posted looks pretty nice (and I'm too big for a Europe, which I like) but I can't afford a new one. H2 looks lovely but new boats (of any flavour) are expensive and used H2s are rare to say the least and still over budget. Solution looks great but the odd used one that comes up would stretch the budget but is definitely on the short list. I have a soft spot for OKs but am not a bendy as I was in the '70s when I raced one (and good ones ain't cheap either). Not agile enough for a 300, don't fancy a Streaker, and too light for a Phantom.

So, any others I may be missing?


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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: pondlife1736
Date Posted: 28 Feb 18 at 10:54pm
What is it you don't like about the Supernova?

Don't discount the Phantom even at your weight. They seem to have very controllable/depowerable rigs these days and you'd fly on the light wind days.
Main thing that puts me off them now is all that kneeling downwind, but I loved mine back in the day.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 28 Feb 18 at 11:29pm
TBF I haven't really given the 'nova a fair crack as I only got to sail it three times last year. My main issue has been that I struggle to read the FB sail despite 30 years racing windsurfers with FB sails and the last ten sailing the Spice (though that does have a jib to look at upwind). Then to put the tin hat on it my Supernova sailing buddy damaged his knee and swapped to a Blaze so I have raced mine over the winter.  As the season comes around and the Blaze will go and live on the coast I need to decide what next. Another Blaze is the obvious choice but I definitely fancy a Solution if I can find one I can afford. I think I need to flatter my weaknesses so a Phantom is probably a non starter as I will get 'mullered' as soon as it passes F3. Or I could persevere with the Supernova (though that will be a little lonelier than it was last year).

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: Gordon 1430
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 8:57am
Hi Sam
Just had a quick troll of Apollo duck and your choices for 3k seem to be
 Streakers, early epoxy Phantoms with carbon ribs, some blazes and bytes. A solution just over budget.
Plus lasers.
No lightning's that I could see or on the class website so you can rule that one out.


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Gordon
Phantom 1430


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 12:02pm
I may be forced very much against my will to sell my Solution if things down the lake go as pear shaped as they appear to be, I definitely don't have the storage space for it or the other couple of boats I've got down there if they expect us to clear the site by March 31st.

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https://www.edgeactionsports.co.uk/collections/snowboards" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals      https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 12:23pm
Blaze's around from £1200, Mk2 similar to SSD for a little over £2k so still looking the most likely prospect. As you say Solution and FRP Streaker (which TBH doesn't really light my candle) are around £3k which is a bit more than I really want to spend for what is, really, a 'spare' Wednesday night boat. Still fancy an OK too but not sure of I'm still flexible enough (did sail a Europe last year a bit cramped but doable) and a modern FRP boat with the carbon rig is even more expensive. As are D Zeros and Aeros.

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: KazRob
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 12:47pm
It's not plastic, but it has just been fully restored and has a carbon mast and looks like a bargain tbh. If the last time you sailed an OK was in the 70's you'll find then easier to sail now btw and you don't need to be quite as flexible either.
%20" rel="nofollow - http://www.okdinghy.co.uk/classifieds/ok-1759-gbr-99-sale/

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OK 2122 & 2148


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 1:00pm
Seems to have disappeared but I've done my time maintaining wooden boats. I'm retired now so am far to busy enjoying myself.........

edit :- found it, it's gorgeous and cheap but, sadly, see above.......


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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: H2
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 2:01pm
Sam - sell a kidney and get a H2. If you like the Blaze I suspect that you would find it to be very similar in many ways - I think that the majority of converts (certainly the early ones) have come from Blaze's and there will be a few 2nd hand ones coming back in soon as the first ten boats were offered a deal I think.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 3:10pm
TongueTongueTongue Oh if only the premium bonds would deliver that £100k win........

Even if I could (and the H2 is a lovely looking boat...... looks do matter you know) it's still a boat that likes to stretch it's legs. And I won't be converting from the Blaze just buying another boat to leave at the inland pond.......

edit :- and I'm still not sure about FB sails on singlehanders 


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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: Peaky
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 3:33pm
You are spoilt for choice looking for a singlehander at 76kg. Personally I think many of the classes should band together to forma superclass with close handicap racing.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 01 Mar 18 at 5:46pm
You are right but that just makes it harder to choose the right one Embarrassed

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 18 Mar 18 at 3:43pm
So, is the RS300 really that hard to sail?

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 18 Mar 18 at 4:02pm
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

So, is the RS300 <b style="font-style: italic;">really that hard to sail?


Think Div 2 board, fine in its wind band, absurd when not.

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https://www.edgeactionsports.co.uk/collections/snowboards" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals      https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website


Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 19 Mar 18 at 6:50am
Topaz Uno Race or Comet seem to be the handicap bandits on our puddle for lighter weight adults.


Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 19 Mar 18 at 8:58am
Thanks for the suggestions PatJ Thumbs Up I've sailed a Topaz, nice little boat but not really a 'proper' singlehander. Comet has addressed some of the design errors in the Laser (those absurdly wide side decks for example) but it's still too Laser-like for me to be attracted to it. Fortunately I'm not looking for a bandit, just a 'nice to sail' boat that is better suited to racing on a lake than the Blaze. My days troubling the silverware are behind me so something vice free and rewarding to sail will do (and another Blaze might be the answer.......)

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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Supernova 395 "dolly the sheep" (now sold but considering a second (mk3) Blaze as her replacement)



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