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Youth classes

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy Yarns...
Forum Discription: Tell us your sailing stories
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1210
Printed Date: 16 Jan 22 at 10:55am
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Topic: Youth classes
Posted By: radial179102
Subject: Youth classes
Date Posted: 18 Nov 05 at 6:25pm

I dont know whether anyone else has had this problem but the youth sailing scheme is so irritating! I normally sail a laser radial but my club (dovey yacht club) has a thriving GP14 racing scene. i love sailing the GP's but i cant go anywhere with them, alright there are normal nationals and everything but there is a very limited youth scene. also there is no youth hiking class, apart from the rs feva, which is a junior class and im sorry to say - not very good.

any other youths here annoyed about the fact that we are being shoved into the boat that is apparently 'right for us'??

 

(sorry bout the ranting, its a terrible condition of mine)



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Villan is my Bitch ;)



Replies:
Posted By: Contender443
Date Posted: 18 Nov 05 at 6:50pm

There is no sitting out 2 person youth dinghy as there is no such thing in the Olympics.

Youth sailing in the UK is firmly aimed at the Olympics and all RYA youth classes lead to this goal. Otherwise bots like the RS200 might make it to become a youth class.



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Bonnie Lass Contender 1764


Posted By: Isis
Date Posted: 18 Nov 05 at 6:51pm
The youth classes are chosen to reflect the olympic classes and including a hiking boat would not follow this principle and just dilute the followers, leading to smaller fleets which are one of the big draws for the youth classes.

I totaly understand where you are comming from though, I did the 'done thing' and got a radial as soon as I was big enough. I never did any of the big youth events but trained with a few of the front-of-fleet guys and usualy wasnt too far back on them.
I then decided to concentrate on my kayaking for a few years and when I acomplished my goals with that went back to sailing. From the first time I got back in my boat it hit me just what a dull boat the laser is without the close racing, and within 2 months swaped it for a moth and havnt regretted it for one moment.

If I had a reliable crew I would have been tempted to hit the 29er but I would recomend anyone to go with the class they really want to sail, not the one they are expected too.

Oh, and the GP is an old mans boat


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Posted By: HannahJ
Date Posted: 18 Nov 05 at 6:53pm
Iknow how you feel, radial 179103, i have the same, so i raced toppers for a while with the other kids then went independant and im now trying to race my mirror - bring a new club in and get you friends interested. GPs are good witha a good boat and good helm/crew, but not as a youth boat (we're mostly not heavy/strong enough, or like faster stuff...

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MIRROR 64799 "Dolphin"
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist hopes it will change; the realist adjusts the sail


Posted By: Harry44981!
Date Posted: 18 Nov 05 at 8:25pm
The RYA Youth scheme is only interested in getting the olympians through. If youre not the right size or don't want to sail a recommended boat they're not really interested in you. Having said this i'm going to be very hypocritical and get a radial, but i'll keep my options open by crewing in 200's.

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Posted By: sam knight
Date Posted: 18 Nov 05 at 9:31pm

i got the problem of being too light. The classes they want me to move up to are to big unless i got a really big crew, but i'm too old to stay in toppers

 



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Topper 43749


Posted By: Isis
Date Posted: 18 Nov 05 at 10:09pm
Originally posted by sam knight

i got the problem of being too light. The classes they want me to move up to are to big unless i got a really big crew, but i'm too old to stay in toppers

 


How much do you weigh? age?



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Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 19 Nov 05 at 7:42am
I'm not a GP14 sailor but people I know who are tell me there are plenty of young people doing GP14 events. Have you been along and tried any?


Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 19 Nov 05 at 1:34pm
Sam have you looked at the Topper Youth Squad???

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Posted By: owain
Date Posted: 20 Nov 05 at 11:47am

The gp14 class hold a youth nationals every year in october. This year they were at chelmarsh in the midlands (my club) and i think there were about 25-30 entries and the standard is pretty high. Many of the youth sailers also compete on the national circuit aswell!



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Owain H
49er GBR055
Fireball 14291
Plymouth Uni Sailing Club & Chelmarsh Sailing Club


Posted By: Harry44981!
Date Posted: 21 Nov 05 at 4:13pm

Originally posted by Jon Emmett

Sam have you looked at the Topper Youth Squad???

I think you should consider this. I'm in it this year, I'm 15, and it's for 15-18 year olds. It's great fun because of the large amount of people, sleeping on site etc. after 2 years in RYA squads this is soooo much more fun, with the same standard coaching (albeit 8 to 1, not 6 to 1). if you want to enjoy your sailing go to http://www.gbrtopper.co.uk - www.gbrtopper.co.uk and click on youth squad in training pages. You're too late for this year, as we've already had 2 weekends, but for next year it could be an idea?

Btw what age/ weight are you, many people think that because the Rya encourage you to move out at 15 then there are no 16+ year olds, when there are loads.

The RYA pathway doesn't suit everyone.



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Posted By: HannahJ
Date Posted: 21 Nov 05 at 9:07pm
owain? They were in Plas Menai weren;t they? Two of my friends went...

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MIRROR 64799 "Dolphin"
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist hopes it will change; the realist adjusts the sail


Posted By: sam knight
Date Posted: 22 Nov 05 at 7:50pm
im 15 and a 1/2, but just about 50 kilos 

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Topper 43749


Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 22 Nov 05 at 8:56pm
Sam it sounds like it is time for you to buy a Laser 4.7!

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Posted By: sam knight
Date Posted: 22 Nov 05 at 9:05pm

problem is, the rya class that as under 15 as well!!

 



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Topper 43749


Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 22 Nov 05 at 9:10pm

Yes but there is provision for up to three sailors outside the under 15 bracket to make the squad (if you are very good and very light but a bit old...)

However as a Youth I believe your aim is to get into the Radial Squad, but you are too light, so the best thing to do is to practice in the 4.7 for a year and move into the Radial next year. There are loads of open training weekends for 4.7s and you still have plenty of time left as a Youth.

Any problems email me mailto:jonemmettsailing@aol.com - jonemmettsailing@aol.com



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Posted By: Skiffman
Date Posted: 23 Nov 05 at 10:07am

Or get a 60+ kilo monkey and go and sail 29ers? Its the youth isaf boat in 2007 and 2008, so your a good age for it. Theres helms lighter than you sailing and the girl teams are about 105 kilos all up and there not that slow.

Just and option



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49er GBR5

http://www.teamfletcherandsign.co.uk - teamfletcherandsign.co.uk
Team Fletcher and Sign campaign site


Posted By: Harry44981!
Date Posted: 23 Nov 05 at 4:08pm
I'd say at 50 kilo's you're on the light side for competitive topper racing. 55-65 kilos seems like the best weight

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Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 25 Nov 05 at 9:30am

Sailing is like Bruce's price is right...... you can be plenty under but not one pound over. The concept of being under weight for a class is always over stated, so long as you are not masses under - the reason is not cos more weight = more righting/sail carrying ability, the ratio of force on the sail to ability to drive weight of boat is not proportional, but because you might not achieve full waterline length (the key factor in dispacement sailing).

From my experience, you get too big for a topper when you get too tall, before you get too heavy.

Rather than worry about being the next Ben Ainslie of the youth classes consider what you enjoy, most, about the sport...... then aim to do as much of it a possible.... and note: good 50kilo crews are like gold dust anywhere in the UK.



Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 25 Nov 05 at 7:13pm
Who says you cannot be one pound over weight? Usually the weight range tends to vary with the optimum weight being similiar to the average weight! In boats like Lasers you do not want to be underweight as you will be far more disadvantaged in the windy stuff than you are advantaged in the light. Talking of Ben he was 75KGs when he won the Radial Worlds...

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Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 5:01am

Is that supposed to be heavy? I thought 75kg was the ideal weight for radial.

Besides, I think your wrong...... once the wind gets up, being over weight is just as big a disadvantage as being under weight. The boat doesn't accelerate through the gusts and the chop stops it every time. I think Ben would be the first to remind you how hard he needed to work at keeping the weight down to stay competitive in the Lasers.



Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 2:00pm

When you are heavy you can take more power or foot more easily upwind, especially useful in short chop. The Laser is relatively heavy so a few KGs will not make much difference to the overall weight and hence acceleration but will be a big difference to overall leverage. In the UK the Radial Nationals has nearly always been won by someone on the heavy side and NEVER won by someone on the light side! Hence the basis for my comment.



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Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:10pm

True enough...... I know its nothing to do with this thread but I think your comment about the radials really highlights how unsuitable a class it is for the womens Olympic class.

 



Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:12pm
I do not understand... Why is the Radial unsuitable as a class for Women?

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Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:13pm

75kilos isn't a very average weight for the women of the world.

 



Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:16pm

The reason more weight is needed in the laser is to maintain waterline length and imerse the hull so your moment pivots around the maximum width of the hull - same as the Finn. I feel stupid saying this out to an Olympic coach.



Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:16pm

Yes but 75 Kilos is not the average weight of the Radial class!

By that agruement the Laser is unsuitable as 80 Kilos is not "a very average weight for men of the world". (Do not even think about the Finn!)

The fact is sports people tend to be fitter, stronger (and therefore heavier) than average...

 



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Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:19pm
True, true true..... but 70kilos even is a big girl.....isn't it.????


Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:23pm

All the girls on the Podium were under 70Kgs at the Radial Europeans...

Besides look at any "power" sports and you will find lots of women well over 70Kgs!!!



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Posted By: les5269
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:35pm

just to add my ten pence if all the girls are under 70kgs does it matter,wouldn't they all be that little bit handicapped?(I've never raced a laser so I don't know there charactoristics)



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49er 531 & 5000 5025 and a mirror(now gone to mirror heaven)!

http://www.grafham.org/" rel="nofollow - Grafham water Sailing Club The greatest inland sailing in the country


Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:38pm
For the Radial I think being under 70Kgs is definitely a good thing. The last two World Championships sailed in moderate breeze were won by Men under 70Kgs. As far as the change from Europe to Radial, the Radial is a more physical boat (as it has a less responsive rig) so a lot of the girls have hit the gym, gaining strength (and weight),,, Just out of interest the Radial has much less sail area than the Europe.

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Posted By: les5269
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 3:41pm
So theorectically it shouldn't make any difference if they are slightly out of the optimum weight range?

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49er 531 & 5000 5025 and a mirror(now gone to mirror heaven)!

http://www.grafham.org/" rel="nofollow - Grafham water Sailing Club The greatest inland sailing in the country


Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 26 Nov 05 at 11:16pm

Hey Guys!  just whilst we're in this weight range convo
weight is not a huge issue to boatspeed!  over the years weve seen the likes of ian percy and ben ainslie bring the so called optimum wieght range for the finn down by some 5+ kilos!  And more annoyingly than that at the 800 nats this yr which was minimal winds for the most part, Irish + Gotrel were happily caning it round the course and they weighed in at 159kg, which is pretty heavy!!  
Thats all from me

Doug



Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 27 Nov 05 at 5:33am
Originally posted by Doug.H

Hey Guys!  just whilst we're in this weight range convo
weight is not a huge issue to boatspeed! 

Not true..... its a huge factor, just different hulls have different characteristics under loading.

Originally posted by Doug.H

over the years weve seen the likes of ian percy and ben ainslie bring the so called optimum wieght range for the finn down by some 5+ kilos! 

The finn is naturally tolerant of a wide range of weights due to high dispacement and a hull shape which, under loading, increases imersion without proportionally increasing waterline beam. Some 5+kilos is very little for this class, and even less for Mr Emmett who feels its quite reasonable to train hopeful female Olympians with protein and weights to gain at least twice that.

Originally posted by Doug.H

And more annoyingly than that at the 800 nats this yr which was minimal winds for the most part, Irish + Gotrel were happily caning it round the course and they weighed in at 159kg, which is pretty heavy!!  

Weight (so long as not excessive) slowing you down in the light stuff, especially 'minimal' winds, is a myth. The sole indicator for over 100years of a boats light wind speed potential is the waterline length/sail area ratio...... the sail/weight (so called Bruce number) has no relevance till strong motion is given.

For every kilo added in righting moment more force on the sail can be balanced up to a threshold, when it tails off ... in the case of some dinghies very sharply - this threshold gives us the optimum weight for a given hull and in most cases has nothing to do with sail area. The myth that more weight in a dinghy can enable you to carry more sailarea in more wind exists because thats how it feels when you are over powered but, the reality with most planninghulls is, the threshold weight is very close to the lower limit needed to stop it tipping over.



Posted By: les5269
Date Posted: 27 Nov 05 at 5:17pm
Quite agree Bumble I sailed 5ks and in the light stuff we could whip the likes of 49ers and 800s,most of the time beating them on the water!(we weighed about 160kgs and the boat 180kgs slightly more than the average 49er!)

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49er 531 & 5000 5025 and a mirror(now gone to mirror heaven)!

http://www.grafham.org/" rel="nofollow - Grafham water Sailing Club The greatest inland sailing in the country


Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 27 Nov 05 at 5:35pm
I do not know any of the girls who have put on more than a kilo or two! (I am sure I would have noticed if any had gained over 10 Kilos!!!) and yes I feel it is quite reasonable for the radial girls to go to the gym, this is a natural part of training for all sports!

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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 27 Nov 05 at 6:33pm

Also in jons defence, i dont think its a case of being reasonable for ppl to train using protein suppliments. The ones reccomended by the rya were considered and tested in the highest respect before being given the go ahead for anyones use.  And it is the sailors choice, they are not force fed anything.
As for what i experienced at the 800 nats, on the first day no it wasnt minimal winds, (upwind) most boats were single wiring with the crew sometimes peaking out, where as irish + gotrel were able to be twin (almost flat wiring!!).  and for a boat where i would consider the optimum weight being somewhat less than theirs, it can be clearly stated that their speed was due to pure skill!!  not their correct weight to boat ratio!
Another good example of weight NOT being a huge issue would be steve Restall any time he sails a topper.  Through the complete wind range he is rarely seen out of the top 5 and he would be considered massively overweight. (around the 12 stone mark i believe)
I myself am 64kg and sail an RS600 where i myself am considered massively underweight yet down to much much practice i can happily handle the boat and yes keep competative boatspeed in the top wind range. 
Ive never known anyone to win because they were "the right weight", ive seen many people win because they were the better sailor!
And another thing on being "the right weight" , i think its fair to say that the right weight has pretty much been dictated from whoevers winning the most in that class.  so called optimum weights are forever fluctuating due to who's currently top in the considered class.

please dont take this as a heated reponse, im not up on hydro/aerodynamic theory so this really is JUST an opinion based purely on what ive seen first hand.
lets keep it going, i like hearing what people have to say on this weight issue
im pretty certain that thers a lot more opinions to be heard yet



Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 27 Nov 05 at 7:15pm

Originally posted by Bumble

The finn is naturally tolerant of a wide range of weights due to high dispacement and a hull shape which, under loading, increases imersion without proportionally increasing waterline beam.

I'd also assume you can tune mast stiffness and sail shape to match weight. The Europe women certainly did so, while in the Radial they obviously cannot.



Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 27 Nov 05 at 7:36pm
Even though the Europe could tune their rig the girls tended to favour the rig of the people who were performing well and thus ended up matching their weight... So the spread of weights remained small (comparable to the Laser!)

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Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 29 Nov 05 at 6:20am
Originally posted by Stefan Lloyd

I'd also assume you can tune mast stiffness and sail shape to match weight. The Europe women certainly did so, while in the Radial they obviously cannot.

Indeed, and it naturally follows that a class of hull with a broader competitive weight tolerance would have more rigs to suit (change gear) a broader range of sailors. One with a tighter weight range would obviously better optimise around one.

Im not so sure about the Europe but I thought, correct me if Im wrong.......... in the old days of aluminium masts, the cross sectional dimensions were fixed, and stiffness was given by how much aluminium went into the section, so a given flexibilty fore and aft had to be balanced by a similar lateral flexing. You choose the lateral flex for your weight and there should be a mast to fit. Then as C/fibre developed (and the Europe class, if nothing else has given us all plenty of development) manufacturers found that lateral stiffness could be delivered without compromising its longitudinal ability to flex, i.e. bend and depower. The weight of the helm could then be balanced on the sail, by means of fullness, height of fullness and leech tension. Changing a sail being more cost effective than a mast, the masts have become more uniform.

Im sure Jons reason is true also, and this, as well as the above has been mirrored in many other classes. Take the OK...... hull has a high tolerance of 12-15 stone, rigs in aluminium used to be classed into 3 groups, red/green/blue (I think?). Now the've taken Carbonfibre on its just one with a variety of sails. The finns the same, covered by 2 rigs over a massive weight range.. The Europe with a 20kilo range is by comparison quite small.



Posted By: radial179102
Date Posted: 04 Dec 05 at 12:40pm

Originally posted by HannahJ

owain? They were in Plas Menai werent they? Two of my friends went...

 

I went to that, it wasnt the youths it was the howard davies memorial, it was also really good, apart from the fact that our coach had never sailed a GP14 in his life  i wasnt saying i want to sail GP14s, i was jus sayin that i dont agree with the RYA pushing youths to sail certain classes.

 

By the way hannahJ, who were ur friends that went to that week thing?



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Villan is my Bitch ;)


Posted By: BBSCFaithfull
Date Posted: 24 Dec 05 at 12:02am
I agree with you. I am 16 now and a tad chubbier than i should be. Roughly measurin in at 6 foot 3 and 13 stone ish. I am there fore too big for the radial which is the "Youth Class". Also the fact that i do not want arthritic knees helps my decision to sail what i think in my opinion suits me. Which is the breathtaking Laser 4000 which has astronomical speed up and down hill, and also helps me express my very physical sailing style. By this i mean being able to hike a laser 2000 flat in force 4 winds gusting 5 by myself!! God i hurt afterwoods. But it was well worth it


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Posted By: HannahJ
Date Posted: 24 Dec 05 at 5:34pm
radial170102, they were jameel, charlotte, and ben.

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MIRROR 64799 "Dolphin"
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist hopes it will change; the realist adjusts the sail


Posted By: *Poke*
Date Posted: 10 Jan 06 at 9:06pm

The parents are the worst part of the youth classes. I was at my club waitin to get picked up the other week after a powerboat course and there just happend to be an oppie training event at the same time, seriously it is a sad sight



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RS600 781- im


Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 10 Jan 06 at 10:05pm
what have u got against oppies?
But yeah the oppie parents do take things WAY too seriously!


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international moth - "what what?"


Posted By: Isis
Date Posted: 10 Jan 06 at 10:57pm
I heard a while ago that the oppy class rules or at least the notice of race for their champoinships were changed to state specificaly that you cannot carry mobile phones or radios in the boat because the parents kept phoning them to tell them what to do?

One of the funiest thingst Ive ever heard 'oppy parent' related was from the parents sat on the balcony at Rock SC (full of yuppies but a fantastic place to sail) a couple of summers ago during their junior camel week. I finished the race, packed up and was sat in the sun with a beer (a half, I was only a young'un) when one of the hordes of parents came up to me and loudly anounced that she wanted me to appologise to her son for 'porting him' during the race. I didnt have a clue what she was on about untill a very embarased child came up to me later and appologised for his mother. Turns out he'd mentioned having to tack out of my way whilst being on port on the beat and she got the wrong idea and nearly took it to the race committee!


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Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 11 Jan 06 at 4:08pm
lol! yep that's the kind of thing you get in oppies.  Another debait was whether parent's ribs should be allowed on the race course because too many parents were pointing their ribs in the direction that favours them up the beat!  How are they ever gonna get any good if they rely on Daddy all the time to show them the way?  Man i'm glad to be out of oppies!

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international moth - "what what?"


Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 13 Jan 06 at 7:45pm
i dont agree with the limited classes sailed under the rya youth scheme. i think they should train people in classes that they want. i dont want to sail lasers, i want to sail in moths or something exciting not lasers. btw does anyone have an idea of a good weight for a moth helm?


Posted By: carshalton fc
Date Posted: 13 Jan 06 at 7:59pm

well the only problem about training people in different classes is that they wont get the compertion that they get now.  the youth classes are great just wish they had something for me. 

i dont know the weight for a moth  i imagine it wil be around 70ish kg

 



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International 14 1503


Posted By: Isis
Date Posted: 13 Jan 06 at 8:28pm
Originally posted by mike ellis

i dont agree with the limited classes sailed under the rya youth scheme. i think they should train people in classes that they want. i dont want to sail lasers, i want to sail in moths or something exciting not lasers. btw does anyone have an idea of a good weight for a moth helm?


On the contray I think we have a fantastic youth system in this country and although it doesnt suit everyone I cant think of a system that would. I decided it wasnt for me and traded the radial for a moth and havnt looked back once.

Moth weights: The fact the rig can be totaly customised means you can be competative in a relatively large weight range but the average is probibly about 70kgish for lowriders. Most of the top foilers are closer to 60 though for obvious reasons


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Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 14 Jan 06 at 7:51pm
ok. i can see that but the classes are very limited. surely theres room for more classes.


Posted By: Harry44981!
Date Posted: 15 Jan 06 at 6:23pm
The RYA youth classes are what they are because most feed directly into olympic boats. If you don't like it sail something else- there are plenty of fun boats with good fleets and training around (ie: Rs200)

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Posted By: *Poke*
Date Posted: 16 Jan 06 at 9:23pm
The oppie is a rediculous boat, i know lots of great sailors have come from them, but the price that is involved in running the blasted tubs of  c**p. people fretting about the foils and these days they wont touch any spars that dont say 'black gold' on them, I've seen some of those zoom 8 thingys in denmrk and they are a miles better boat for one reason... ONE DESIGN. I like boats where you have loads to tinker with but an oppy, its rediculous. theres none of the foil, spar and sail isnt fast enough because i did one race slow and daddy/mummy is gonna buy a new one malarky. the zoom 8 looks like a much better boat than the oppy and with its carbon mast, one design foils and sails and stuff, i bet kids would far rather sail one of those than an old sprit rigged tub looking thing. down with oppys!!

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RS600 781- im


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 9:46am
i think that they would only want to sail it if all the people in the fleet got them when you are geting 335 boat at the nats i think it would take alot to get them out of it and you have missed out them main reason that they sail oppys because the perunts make them so they can get the jaket with oppy team on it so they can get the moter home to go to events in and the most importent thing so they can get a fast rib which is faster than any other rib in the fleet at the time but bye this time they still have money left over luky people so they put all the rest of it in to there boats that have to have all the best parts but i think you will find that it all gose areound in fads where if some one cleans up at one event they all go to there boat see what they have and the next day buy it i rember 2 years a go when to of my m8s cleand up at the winters to twins never gess who they where doing some devolp ment on some sail which they said where not veary good but the nexte event they went to all the top people had thes sails i think they need to learn how to sail the boat beter first befor they chrang there boat

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Posted By: BOABS
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 3:09pm
don't forget to breathe 5420............or use a few full stops!!


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 5:03pm

we are not going to have to go into all this agen are we i thorght that was all  over



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Posted By: carshalton fc
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 5:12pm

Originally posted by BOABS

don't forget to breathe 5420............or use a few full stops!!

yes good point 5420 does need a chat with his english teacher but u can still read it. 

  can we leave it at that and get back to youth classes?  the 4000 sould be a youth class!! 



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International 14 1503


Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 6:40pm
ok DOWN WITH OPPIES there slow and dont even have a proper front. and there are not enough youth classes. the olympics isnt everything.


Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 6:58pm
Originally posted by 5420

we are not going to have to go into all this agen are we i thorght that was all  over



You should probably put a note at the ends of ur posts telling people not to comment on the poor/lack of punctuation and grammar.
 

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international moth - "what what?"


Posted By: BOABS
Date Posted: 18 Jan 06 at 9:03am
Hi 5420. No offence meant. 


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 18 Jan 06 at 9:24am

do not worry about it we have been throg it all befor

 

the 4000 would not be a very good youth class

as we already have the 29er which is better for the 49er and it is not a class that is sailed all over the world unlike the 29er

and to be honist it is not much of a skiff

and i feel after this i am going to get a  from luke



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Posted By: carshalton fc
Date Posted: 20 Jan 06 at 4:41pm

Originally posted by 5420

and to be honist it is not much of a skiff

and i feel after this i am going to get a  from luke

na ur safe for the minute but i will be coming to grafham soon so watch ur back   only kidding. 

yer well i agree with the skiff bit cos it is very stable but that is mainly cos of the 4 foot long dagger board,  but we have the racks which is the trend at the moment to get more leverage but i think they just look cool.  but once the wind gets over a f4ish we can spnak a 29er hands down  



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International 14 1503


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 20 Jan 06 at 5:35pm

well where i sail the only way we could beat tehm on handy cap was when it was a 4 or more and it is not becuse they are not good they are top 3 in the 4000 fleet

i find the 29er very under powerd



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Posted By: Skiffman
Date Posted: 23 Jan 06 at 5:50pm

No offence to 4000 sailors but I have never been beat by a 4000, at rutland we use to lap most of them in club races in a 29er.

The 29er is underpowered but u can still flat line upwind in 10knots which isnt to bad.

I am probably going to get shreded for saying this but the 4k is a shed



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49er GBR5

http://www.teamfletcherandsign.co.uk - teamfletcherandsign.co.uk
Team Fletcher and Sign campaign site


Posted By: BBSCFaithfull
Date Posted: 23 Jan 06 at 6:13pm
The 4k is not a shed. Be quiet i think ur tlkin out of ur arse personally. The 29er is a boat designed for the light sailor and that is where it falters as not every single youth is that small and cannot sail a 29er competitively. This is where the 4k is good as it caters for a larger weight range and is much more robust and generally hust a better boat in my opinion. Although the 9er is a good step up to the 49er i just think that is a waste of time personally.
Now this is just my personal opinion but we have always beaten 9ers up and down hill even one Sailed by Alex Hopson


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Greatfully Sponsored By
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Int 14 GBR 1503!!


Posted By: Luke4485
Date Posted: 23 Jan 06 at 7:00pm

well said alex. 

and anyway we wont listen to someone called skiffman. we will race u any time, any were. 

well as we sail past u in our shed we will wave.



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laser 4000 4485


Posted By: Skiffman
Date Posted: 23 Jan 06 at 7:21pm

You dont have to be that light to sail a 29er, how big is big, you can be up to 80kgs and like 185cm as a crew thats pretty big to be fair for a youth any bigger and you could sail a 49er.

are you coming to the tiger trophy out of interest? If you are i am in 29er GBR5 and the race is on.

see you at the finsh line...



-------------
49er GBR5

http://www.teamfletcherandsign.co.uk - teamfletcherandsign.co.uk
Team Fletcher and Sign campaign site


Posted By: BBSCFaithfull
Date Posted: 23 Jan 06 at 7:30pm
Sadly not as we are doing lots events this year, the parentials decided that it was too much to go to the tiger aswell and we are about 160kg combined so u see our prob!



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Posted By: Jamie
Date Posted: 23 Jan 06 at 8:58pm

Originally posted by mike ellis

ok DOWN WITH OPPIES there slow and dont even have a proper front. and there are not enough youth classes. the olympics isnt everything.

Why does a class have to have a classification as a "Youth Class" before a youth will sail it? strikes of lack of imagination to me. If a Youth doesn't want to sail a oppy/topper/laser/420/29er. Then go look for a different boat, don't expect one to be ready labelled for you. Go out and find it. Have a look in to the dinghy park and find the boat that makes you go wow and ask for a sail in one be it a 4 tonner or a 505 or a RS800. A fireball is a nice fast fun boat that really isn't beyond the ability of most if not all youf sailors that I know. If you get a ride in a boat you really enjoy pester the people who have one untill they find you a route in to the class.

I sailed a Dutchman for the first time properly when I had just been knocked back by the welsh topper squad, So I said, I don't care what you lot think I want to have fun. I was taken out in a Dutchman, and after that pesterd the guy who owned it untill he got me into the class properly. I now crew at most events(for someone else, but still.) The RYA racing youf classes will always be geared towards grooming the next Shirley Robertson, and that's no bad thing. It isn't their job to match people to boats, thats the job of the person.



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www.sailfd.org/GBR - GBR Flying Dutchman


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 9:42am
the reason we all would like to stay in youth class altow they are rubish boats normaly with a few that are good but the free coaching you can get is the best they will teach you lots to get you started in your sailing then you can move on and the only reason i would not sail a youth class as i dont is because i dont want to sail the laser all the time and do the squdes in that i would like to do it in the 29er as i had one but i couln never get a helm and i would still want to as the worlds are at waymoth this year but im not going to put the money into it my self so iv got a boat that i can enjoy and will give me the skills to move up in to the rs700 by this time next year wich is good

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Posted By: Ian S
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 12:38pm

But most other classes provide training.. often by the same people who provide it to the "youth" classes.

If it isn't happening at your club then give your fleet captain or sailing committee a b*llocking until it does!



Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 3:52pm
Originally posted by Jamie

Why does a class have to have a classification as a "Youth Class" before a youth will sail it?

i think the reason i dont want to get into a boat that is suposed to be an adult class is that i think if i did i cant imagine what the parentals would do at opens and all the aldults would gang up on me. ive seen the laser sailors at our club.



Posted By: Luke4485
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 6:06pm

[/QUOTE]

all the aldults would gang up on me. ive seen the laser sailors at our club.

[/QUOTE]

how old are u?  pull yourself together. 

if anything it is better to be in an adult class cos they have so much more knolage & most of them quite like younger people in there classes. 

i wouldnt worry about the laser sailors,  useally there is a reason for why they sail on there own.



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laser 4000 4485


Posted By: Prince Buster
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 6:20pm
Awww Diddems!!!!!
As Luke said, in my experience the adults like younger people sailing with them and usually offer their full encouragement.  Also there are sooo many more possibilities in adult classes.  If you dont like a cleeky gang of people in one class just sail something else.
And stop crying.


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international moth - "what what?"


Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 6:42pm
it wos a joke ok. but the laser sailors are quite competitive.


Posted By: Luke4485
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 6:48pm
yer well most of them dont get out very offten so they have to make the most of it. 

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laser 4000 4485


Posted By: HannahJ
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 8:15pm
mm but sailing adult classes can be good when you go straight past them and hahahahahahhathey don't like it much...

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MIRROR 64799 "Dolphin"
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist hopes it will change; the realist adjusts the sail


Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 8:24pm
yeh that wld be fun. but i dnt want 2 imagine wot parents wld b like at open meetins.


Posted By: Harry44981!
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 8:57pm

Parents are only a problem if they have oppy sailing kids.

It's good if the adult sailors are competitive, it gives better racing.



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Posted By: Offshoretiger
Date Posted: 24 Jan 06 at 10:12pm

Originally posted by mike ellis

yeh that wld be fun. but i dnt want 2 imagine wot parents wld b like at open meetins.

 

Theyd probaly ignore you. After all there are other grown ups there for then to play with 



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...yesterday I couldnt spell enginner...now I are one!......


Posted By: Jamie
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 2:50am
Originally posted by mike ellis

Originally posted by Jamie

Why does a class have to have a classification as a "Youth Class" before a youth will sail it?

i think the reason i dont want to get into a boat that is suposed to be an adult class is that i think if i did i cant imagine what the parentals would do at opens and all the aldults would gang up on me. ive seen the laser sailors at our club.

So far as I'm aware there isn't such a thing as an 'adult class' and from my experience classes are crying out for yonger people to sail their boats. So if yoyu show interest to the right people you will almost get dragged in to any class.

Most adult sailors that i've met are just big kids anyway. So there is no problem.

Oh Amd why do the parents have to go to the opens? if you are there with other adults and can get yourself there. (train, lift, coach.) they don't need to come. It's more fun without them anyway. 



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www.sailfd.org/GBR - GBR Flying Dutchman


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 9:32am

jamie i would like to see you get a boat on a train or coach i know i would be imprest at that

other wise how else dose a under 17 get him and his to an open



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Posted By: NeilP
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 10:40am

5420 - join a proper class, and then get to know the people in the class. If you're nice to people, and ask politely, you'll find there's usually someone who can help you get your boat to events. Most classes love to see young sailors at events, and will help in any way they can. Oh, and Jamie is absolutely right about the big kid bit - we love having yoofs around, even when they beat us! Just stop worrying about the RYA, find a boat you love sailing and get out and do it!

Neil



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No FD? No Comment!


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 11:10am
hay i sail a proper class and there are people that would help me all they could but know one o know has a doble staker traler i did not start this so dont go on at me and my class

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Posted By: Jamie
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 11:13am
Originally posted by 5420

jamie i would like to see you get a boat on a train or coach i know i would be imprest at that

other wise how else dose a under 17 get him and his to an open

If you are going to stick with a singlehander when you havn't got a car then you'll have to stick with local events or wherever your parents will take you. Unless you can find some kind soul with a double stack. One of many reasons why I sold my Laser.

I on the other hand have been to many sailing clubs all over Britain by train, bus, coach and on foot (once, all in one trip.) and some parts of Europe without the bother of persuading my parents.   And had fun almost every day.



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www.sailfd.org/GBR - GBR Flying Dutchman


Posted By: NeilP
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 11:15am
Not having a go - there's always a solution if you look hard enough. If you like the class you're in, stick with it!

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No FD? No Comment!


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 12:52pm

i dont need one as my perunts take me to all the events i want but i was just coming from the pont of veiw of people that dont have perunts that are not as supertiv as mine

mine are grate they are taking me to all the opens this year and the nats which are 4 days long i do not think you can gat much better than that

 

and they may take me to garda this year is the vareos go only if we can get enof boats



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Posted By: Jamie
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 1:17pm
Originally posted by 5420

i dont need one as my perunts take me to all the events i want but i was just coming from the pont of veiw of people that dont have perunts that are not as supertiv as mine

mine are grate they are taking me to all the opens this year and the nats which are 4 days long i do not think you can gat much better than that

 

and they may take me to garda this year is the vareos go only if we can get enof boats

Do your parents already sail? If not They are giving you a whole lot more active help in getting sailing than mine did. I got a lift the 3 miles to the club most weeks so long as I tried to get a lift back. But to do any sailing further a-field than that I had to get myself there by means fair or foul. To be honest this was the reason I gave up on squads fairly quickly. My parents were not unwilling but not keen to do towing and travelling all over the place. I found I could be more independant and have more fun with my sailing If I sailed with people in doublehanders.

Ok they did get a but twitchy when I said I wanted to go to A europeans in Como with 3 people they had never met before instead of doing my 6th form work experience, but they let me.

 



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www.sailfd.org/GBR - GBR Flying Dutchman


Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 1:33pm
Originally posted by Jamie

 One of many reasons why I sold my Laser.



Jamie,

I really cannot see you sailing a Laser.......sorry!




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Paul
----------------------
D-Zero GBR 74


Posted By: Jamie
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 1:54pm
Oh it did happen, but before I got indoctrinated into the wonderful world of crewing.

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www.sailfd.org/GBR - GBR Flying Dutchman


Posted By: Offshoretiger
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 2:42pm
Hey if your really nice to the people you sail with they can even help you get a job to pay for going to events......

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...yesterday I couldnt spell enginner...now I are one!......


Posted By: 5420
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 5:17pm

no my perunts dont sail so im luky

 

 



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Posted By: Pierre
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 7:12pm
Originally posted by 5420

no my perunts dont sail so im luky

 


OT, is this bloke one of your relatives !!! 




Posted By: Offshoretiger
Date Posted: 25 Jan 06 at 7:45pm
Originally posted by Pierre

Originally posted by 5420

no my perunts dont sail so im luky

 


OT, is this bloke one of your relatives !!! 


Not as far as I know P, i think most of my reletives are still giving there kids names insted of numbers....

I can see why your asking thought

 



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...yesterday I couldnt spell enginner...now I are one!......


Posted By: sailorguy
Date Posted: 20 Feb 06 at 1:14pm
I am 15 and a half, and about 50kg, and wanting to sail a double-handed trapeze boat, have started to sail a laser 2 with my younger brother who is thirteen. although we are well underweight, we enjoy is and can compete as long as the wind is below 25 knots! a couple of years ago i tried a season in the 4.7, but i have always found singlehanding very boring.
both my brother and i are very happy with the switch, and hope to get near the top of the fleet at the nationals.


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RS 500 (twin wire)
Laser 157607
Laser 85446
Pico 2136


Posted By: feva_sailor
Date Posted: 21 May 06 at 3:42pm
quote:
also there is no youth hiking class, apart from the rs feva, which is a junior class and im sorry to say - not very good.



fevas are great for ur weight!get a crew about the same train alot and have some fun!and come to the feva worlds at jasc dubai next year(my sailing club and its really warm and good wind)

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Posted By: Isis
Date Posted: 21 May 06 at 4:29pm
Originally posted by sailorguy

I am 15 and a half, and about 50kg, and wanting to sail a double-handed trapeze boat


A twin wire boat for lightweights?
There is only one twin wire boat for lightweights.
Sail Cherub.



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Posted By: laser47
Date Posted: 21 May 06 at 8:29pm
Hey going back to sailing in an adult class. At my club most of the youth sailors do as there are so few of us we just intergrate with the adults in our fleets (topaz, laser, laser radial, bosun, enterprise) in fact the lady i'm training with most at the moment in my radial is old enough to be my mum

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Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 22 May 06 at 8:02am
The 4.7 is perfect for most Ladies (55KG mark). It is a great shame loads more adults do not sail the 4.7 (or medium sized adults the Radial for that matter!)

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http://www.amazon.co.uk/Be-Your-Own-Tactics-Coach/dp/0470973218/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1312565831&sr=8-1 -


Posted By: tack'ho
Date Posted: 25 May 06 at 12:09pm
So its the Byte CII and it is light enought for small people to move about!

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I might be sailing it, but it's still sh**e!



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