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Easy to learn, hard to master: What class? |
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andrewwilde
Newbie Joined: 21 Jun 12 Location: Wokingham Online Status: Offline Posts: 4 |
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Topic: Easy to learn, hard to master: What class? Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 6:35am |
Hi all,
I'm just getting back into sailing after a (15 year!) break, and the other half is starting to learn. We've just joined the local club (large lake sailing) and are looking at what class we should go for - any ideas appreciated. What we're after is a 2-man 3-sail boat, that's relatively forgiving to the novice, but will be good for learning (or re-learning) how to make a boat go properly and has a good racing circuit. Ideally it would be a fairly punishing boat, so that making mistakes slows you down and the better crews end up at the front - not just the financially better off... We need something that's relatively cheap to start with (not uncompetitive boat for ~£500?) that we can upgrade if we start racing properly (something competitive for <£2.5k). Faster is generally better; it would be great if there's a single trapeze; and ideally a symmetric kite rather than an asymmetric (with the aim of more to learn and more to go wrong, if you can handle a traditional kite then an asymmetric is easy, but not vice versa!). A good class association and friendly yet competitive open circuit would also be an advantage, as would a comfortable hiking position. Oh, and one other requirement, that rules out a lot of the modern stuff: A dark coloured hull. The other half has light-sensitive eyes, and won't be able to quickly identify where ropes are on a white hull on a sunny day. So ideally wood decks, but certainly not white plastic... Thanks in advance! (ETA: we'll be around 22 stone combined weight)
Edited by andrewwilde - 21 Jun 12 at 6:39am |
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Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 7:35am |
Welcome back to the world of dinghies.
A Fireball sounds like a close fit. Or a Scorpion, but you'll struggle to find one for £500 I think. If learning is top priority, have a look at what is sailed at your club and join a fleet. Mank large lakes have fleets of Flying Fifteens which may fit the bill. Edited by Peaky - 21 Jun 12 at 7:43am |
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winging it
Really should get out more Joined: 22 Mar 07 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3958 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 8:10am |
totally agree, a fireball sounds right up your street and sits within your price range. Lots to learn, boat handling is rewarded, but still a good learning platform. Plus plenty of choice in build types.
If you're interested a chap at my club has a beige and brown plastic boat for sale - pm me if you want to know more. |
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the same, but different...
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MattTrinder
Newbie Joined: 19 Dec 11 Online Status: Offline Posts: 27 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 8:27am |
Merlin Rocket ticks most of those boxes (apart from the trapeze) - would have had one myself when I was in your situation but the missus wasn't happy with the idea of me spending hours maintaining a wooden boat....!
They're a lot prettier that Fireballs as well, and have a lot more space to move around in. Edited by MattTrinder - 21 Jun 12 at 8:32am |
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r2d2
Far too distracted from work Joined: 29 Sep 11 Online Status: Offline Posts: 350 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 9:20am |
two "cheap" MRs on ebay just now: Edited by r2d2 - 21 Jun 12 at 9:21am |
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RS400atC
Really should get out more Joined: 04 Dec 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3011 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 10:12am |
As you have decided on a club, I would strongly suggest looking at the boats already there, looking at the people who sail them, and ask yourself 'who do I most want to race against?'
You will get up to speed much faster if you have direct comparison of people racing the same class of boat. You know your improvement is real and not just some fluke of yardstick. At least look for comparable boats, you don't want to be disadvantaged all the time except the one day a year the course and wind suits your boat. E.g Fireballs are great for a) racing other Fireballs, and b) Windy days. Also look at the class association, are there opens you might want to do? Is there any coaching? Are they supportive of old boats? Look also for availability of secondhand sails, some classes there is a ready trade, other not. This can help a lot if you are trying to upgrade on a budget. spending £500 on something that falls apart or is impossible to sell may be more expensive than spending £1500 on something you can sell on easily. We paid £3500 for our RS400 five or so years ago, you might get one of the same standard for £2500 now. It can still do very welll against brand new ones. That is cheap sailing. Although you have to weigh in the odd sail, insurance, a new cover, boat park fees etc etc. Don't dismiss the asymmetrics, although it's less string, the skill of getting the most out it is still there, and the tactical aspect of downwind is good. And it's fast and fun. But if the main opposition is Merlins, get a Merlin. It's about having people to race against mostly. |
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GybeFunny
Far too distracted from work Joined: 27 Oct 09 Online Status: Offline Posts: 403 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 11:47am |
I agree with others, look at results of races at your chosen club to see which classes are best represented on the water (no point buying a Fireball if there are 100 at the club but only 1 ever sails).
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Rupert
Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 12:23pm |
If nothing takes your fancy at the club already, I'd agree about the Fireball. £500 should get you something which stays together, but will likely be a bit heavy and have tired sails. Get you started, though.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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andrewwilde
Newbie Joined: 21 Jun 12 Location: Wokingham Online Status: Offline Posts: 4 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 9:49pm |
Thanks for all the advice. There are a few Fireballs at the club, but just the one racing (thanks for the tip to look at results, wouldn’t have thought of that...) There are a good few Enterprises (first impression are a bit heavy?) and a reasonable fleet of an N12's (a development class - I assume expensive to be competitive, ever moving goal-posts?). There are a lot of RS’s of various forms, but they’re all white or light decks: Pity, there’s some nice boats in that stable... There’s no Merlins or Scorpions, though they’re both beautiful boats – thanks for the advice, I’ll look into what the Open circuit is like and what’s on Apollo Duck to get an idea of prices... Another option is the Miracle? But again, none at the club... Most of the racing we’d be doing, at least for a year or so, is a Weds evening pursuit race. Entries from 45 upwards on most weeks, so there would be a number of boats to pit ourselves against, even if not a direct comparison. Though I take on board the weather conditions being advantageous to some but not others... Right. Now to look at getting aboat. There's a few for sale at the moment, here's hoping we strike it lucky...
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JimC
Really should get out more Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6649 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 21 Jun 12 at 10:12pm |
Largely a myth. Consumables like sails and so on get used at much the same rate and much the same cost in any class. Competetive lifespan is pretty long too. If you compare the ages of the boats at the front of the fleet in development and one design classes they don't in general seem to be very different. No dount lots of people will be along to claim that their class is uniquely cheap or something, and the Twelves have got a bit of development on with trick winged rudders at the moment. Fireball or 12 ought to be an easy decision as they are utterly different in equipment:-) |
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