J24 (Sail No. 4239) Dartmouth |
29er GBR 074 Tynemouth |
Laurent Giles 'Jolly Boat' Exeter |
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Death Roll and how to avoid it...? |
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G.R.F.
Really should get out more Joined: 10 Aug 08 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 4028 |
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Topic: Death Roll and how to avoid it...? Posted: 22 Jun 12 at 7:44pm |
Now I look at that and see a badly designed craft, low nose volume going under in no waves to speak of. You lot would all go on about it being a technical boat to sail and that fella is obviously doing it wrong, when patently he's not, the conditions are blowy enough for it to be fun, not a battle. And the more you lot get blinded by that 'technical to sail' rhetoric, the more your sport will disappear to the margins.
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sargesail
Really should get out more Joined: 14 Jan 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 1459 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Jun 12 at 9:56pm |
And I just read your comments and extrapolate a bloke who simply doesn't know what he's talking about....
The 300 sailors (and ex-300 sailors) and a few others have told you how to solve your problem - you seem to know better, and then you sl*g off our craft. And the stuff above is part of the fun. And although Steve would tell you that his brother Nick is doing it wrong, I remember this moment: Nick didn't swim - which indicates just how wrong you are about the nose volume. And I don't see my sport disappeearing to the margins other then in your head.
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G.R.F.
Really should get out more Joined: 10 Aug 08 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 4028 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Jun 12 at 11:12pm |
Well since I feel argumentative tonight, the truth is sadly that boat like mine is already in the margins.
But one is in my mind a far better boat than the other, naturally we're going to disagree. And as to knowing better, if I knew better I wouldn't have posted asking now would I? And frankly I'm still not really any better off given all the variables.
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Oatsandbeans
Far too distracted from work Joined: 19 Sep 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 382 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 23 Jun 12 at 8:23am |
The way that I look at this is that there is a sector from a broad reach to dead downwind that is a problem because the air flow over the sail becomes unstable. This means that in the light it is slow to sail in this sector and when its windy the boats behaviour becomes unpredictable leading to death rolls or broaches. So I always avoid this "no go sector" and sail either on a broad reach or bye the lee. If I have to move through this sector I do it quickly. This works for me and the 2 angles give lots of tactical opportunities on the race course. The sail set up for the 2 modes is slightly different with less vang being favourable for the BTL sailing.
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Rupert
Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 23 Jun 12 at 11:22am |
That is a pretty sensible way of looking at things. Of course, what it needs most is time in the boat, learning to control it. |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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robin34024
Posting king Joined: 03 Jan 12 Location: Lincoln Online Status: Offline Posts: 116 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 31 Oct 12 at 1:57pm |
from what i know, it seems the rs300 dude in the picture is doing it wrong; if you bear off rather than luff up when the boat tries to death roll, it comes flat again. if you luff up the rudder and the sail work together to drive the nose of the boat down, meaning that the rig becomes more and more powered up, leading to a death roll. anyways, thats what we did in the topper, although it may be different in other classes.
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frow3n
Groupie Joined: 14 Aug 12 Location: London Online Status: Offline Posts: 95 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Nov 12 at 12:11pm |
When I sail my radial,
- I find its much easier to let of the cunningham but keep some kicker on. - also when the boat starts to heel on top of me I sheet in the mainsheet about 1.5 or 2 armfuls and move my weight slightly into the middle and then ease it out :) sometimes the best thing to do can be to gybe :) |
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Laser Radial 201357
29er 1907 Queen Mary SC |
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Fraggle
Far too distracted from work Joined: 28 Feb 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 220 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 02 Nov 12 at 12:25pm |
Sorry GRF but you really would benefit from borrowing/buying the downwind dvd http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=UG&feature=relmfu&hl=en-GB&v=JivVDWlNiaw. Really explains how to stop the deathroll (and use it to your advantage). Plus, you get to watch Lasernut capsize , as he briefly features in the DVD, which is always a giggle
If you really can't stomach rooster than I think http://www.caribwind.com/ltc/laserdvd/ also includes footage/tips downwind (its a little while since I watched my copy) and I think you know the guys running the centre so should be able to get hold of a copy.
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iGRF
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6496 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 02 Nov 12 at 12:48pm |
You should be a training coach Fraggle, I learned more in the moments we had together rounding those marks than ever I would watching videos. Even if I watched the video I'd forget it almost immediately such is my propensity for watching films, ask the bread knife she just loves watching Dodgeball and The Hangover over and over and over...
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Fraggle
Far too distracted from work Joined: 28 Feb 07 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 220 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 02 Nov 12 at 12:53pm |
Glad to be of service .
I used to coach when I sailed at NSC, let all my RYQ quals lapse since moving south however. Now just run the occasional laser training session with Lasernut at HHSC.
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