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Match Racing in Handicap fleets

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RS400atC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote RS400atC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 1:41pm
This has been done to death.
You can match race another boat, provided your intention is to improve your place in the race, series or regatta.
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rogue View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote rogue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 1:56pm
Originally posted by RS400atC

This has been done to death.
You can match race another boat, provided your intention is to improve your place in the race, series or regatta.

agreed
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 2:08pm
So it would be fair for, say, a Phantom, which has qualified for a club race series, to sail a Mirror, which needed a result to qualify, and a good result to overtake the Phantom in the standings, off the course?

The phantom would be fast enough to sail round and round the Mirror, and would be able to catch up to it whatever happens, and attack it again and again, and if no rules are broken by the Phantom, then there is nothing theMirror can do? In fact, as the Mirror is unlikely to get any form of redress, it wouldn't matter if the Phantom lost a (discardable) protest anyway - the damage has been done.

Mirror and Phantom are used just as 2 examples of boats of differing speeds, not because I think either class is more likely than any other to be involved in such things.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote r2d2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 2:16pm
Originally posted by rogue

Originally posted by RS400atC

This has been done to death.
You can match race another boat, provided your intention is to improve your place in the race, series or regatta.

agreed
you can but I'm not sure you should
 
Rupert makes a good point (although I don't know why he thinks those big burly phantom boys would do that (to what would probably be a timid youth team in a mirror) more than anyone else (only kidding!)
 
rule 2 does exist, so the current rule already include fair play and sportsmanship - it is then just a matter of judgement about what is reasonable
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rogue View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote rogue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 2:33pm
you're right, I wouldn't...  but that's not to say I shouldn't.  If I'm one of those ultra competitive types (btw - I'm not), then it's not wrong- it's just the way I am and sailing against me would mean that my competitors could use that to their advantage also.  I know I've certainly psyched out faster boats into covering me before... only to crawl across the line 2 seconds behind them and beat them on handicap.

I've also had the cards turned racing a 100 against Albacores and Lasers... no point getting in tacking duel with them, you'll lose and lose badly!


Edited by rogue - 27 Feb 12 at 2:34pm
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Little Monster View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Little Monster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 2:51pm

The discussion of match racing a slower boat within the same race, such as a handicap or pursuit, is clear that its just unfortunate for the slower boat. I have done it and had it done to, its just part of racing.

However the debate following the weekend is slightly different in that the Fireball was not competing on the same start as the slower phantom. They started their race and waited 5 mins above the line for the phantom to start.

In normal circumstances I would see that as them being in different races and therefore breach sportsmanship.

As the event was the Draycote Dash does the phantom have grounds against sportsmanship for the Dash or as its also the Sailjuice does that mean that its ok for them to interfere??

Either way I find it very rewarding that they messed up and came in 3rd overall

 
 


Edited by Little Monster - 27 Feb 12 at 2:54pm
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r2d2 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote r2d2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 2:52pm
oh yes keep away from the lasers - thats a true thing!
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rogue View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote rogue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 2:59pm
Originally posted by Little Monster

The discussion of match racing a slower boat within the same race, such as a handicap or pursuit, is clear that its just unfortunate for the slower boat. I have done it and had it done to, its just part of racing.

However the debate following the weekend is slightly different in that the Fireball was not competing on the same start as the slower phantom. They started their race and waited 5 mins above the line for the phantom to start.

In normal circumstances I would see that as them being in different races and therefore breach sportsmanship.

As the event was the Draycote Dash does the phantom have grounds against sportsmanship for the Dash or as its also the Sailjuice does that mean that its ok for them to interfere??

Either way I find it very rewarding that they messed up and came in 3rd overall

 
 

well if they were on separate races (starts) then I personally think this is bang out of order... is it illegal under RRS?
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Phantom Titch View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Phantom Titch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 3:12pm
Same series so its OK unders RRS but should it be changed is the question?
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r2d2 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote r2d2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Feb 12 at 3:18pm
no its not clearly OK under RRS
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