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Oppostie Gybes, leeward Mark |
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damp_freddie
Far too distracted from work Joined: 20 Oct 05 Location: Aruba Online Status: Offline Posts: 339 |
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Topic: Oppostie Gybes, leeward Mark Posted: 23 Jun 10 at 9:39pm |
If you were in really light winds in an RS400 then "sailing to the mark" would mean sailing a hot angle, and in our case a gybe
( just having a go at winding up Jim C on the 400s optimised drag.. .) What'dya think guys? Hot street legal ? or drop and run to the mark? |
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gordon
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Sep 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1037 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 23 Jun 10 at 9:51pm |
Rules say straight line from point of entry into zone to a position beside the mark where boat can commence to turn to round mark
Gordon |
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Gordon
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Brass
Really should get out more Joined: 24 Mar 08 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1146 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 5:07am |
Nope: just make them come up in a pop-up box 'on-hover'. For a hard copy print version having them on the very last page as they are at present is the most accessible option. |
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Brass
Really should get out more Joined: 24 Mar 08 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1146 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 5:15am |
C'mon Gordon, the rules don't say anything like that. That's just how the rules drafters and nearly everyone in the known universe says they should be interpreted. |
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Brass
Really should get out more Joined: 24 Mar 08 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 1146 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 5:19am |
Mark-room to sail to the mark may include room to gybe, that is room to handle and deploy your sails and spars in a seamanlike way, if gybing is the seamanlike thing to do, but only as long as you do not change course off your course to the mark. |
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gordon
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Sep 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1037 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 7:51am |
In fact the standard interpretation of the first part of "mark room - to the mark - is that mark room entitles a boat to occupy a narrrow corridor, a little larger than the the width of the hull and equipment - which in the case of a boat flying a symetrical spinnaker is probably about a boat length in width, taking account of pole + hull + boom - from the point of entry to the required side of the mark.
If a boat sails outside of this corridor then they will have towork hard to convince the jury that they are taking mark room. If at point of entry a gybe is necessary to get to the mark it is best t do it immediately. If a gybe is necessary to round the mark it is best to do so at the mark. Gordon |
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Gordon
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ColPrice2002
Far too distracted from work Joined: 25 Nov 08 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 222 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 12:07pm |
Quote:- Mark-Room Room for a boat to sail to the mark, and then room to sail her proper course while at the mark. However, mark-room does not include room to tack unless the boat is overlapped to windward and on the inside of the boat required to give mark-room."To" has no special definition, so it's from the "mark room circle" to the mark. It's difficult to interpret as "sailing high then gybing" because it doesn't refer to "proper course". It's a bit like going from Land's End to John O'Groats - via Amsterdam. Colin |
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JimC
Really should get out more Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6649 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 12:36pm |
Agreed... If you've come in high of the mark and have to run down and you stop whilst doing so then that's just tough. Life is tougher when you're on port tack... |
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asterix
Really should get out more Joined: 01 Aug 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 621 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 1:28pm |
So, in the example below (which happened to me on the water - I was the red boat) (with the wind coming up the page) can the leading (green) boat who was clear ahead when it entered the zone legitimately sail high and then gybe so that the following (red) boat has to gybe away from the mark when the courses meet? Green could have sailed straight to the mark but chose not to so he could carry the genny further (it was light winds) and so as to make sure of rounding and coming out of the mark ahead of red.
Edited by asterix |
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JimC
Really should get out more Joined: 17 May 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 6649 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 25 Jun 10 at 2:11pm |
Well, no doubts under 18.2 that green is entitled to Mark room... So we go to the definition...
All the way through green is entitled to mark room by that definition. Whilst green was clear ahead she was right of way boat: R12 I reckon when green gybed onto port an overlap was created, and she ceased to become right of way boat and was required to keep clear of red (R16) but red wasn't required to give green room, (R15) since it was green's actions that gave red ROW. So once the boats were on opposite gybes red was ROW, and thus green was only entitled to room to sail to the mark. She's not yet at the mark - indeed sailing away from it - so I reckon proper course doesn't apply. Thus until red gybes I think green is sailing higher than entitled to. Once red gybes green becomes ROW again. What it would come down to, I suspect was whether the PC found that red could have given green mark room without gybing if green hadn't sailed so high when they were not ROW, but I'm no rules guru. |
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