29er GBR 074 Tynemouth |
Laurent Giles 'Jolly Boat' Exeter |
J24 (Sail No. 4239) Dartmouth |
List classes of boat for sale |
Seamanlike Rounding |
Post Reply | Page <12 |
Author | |
redback
Really should get out more Joined: 16 Mar 04 Location: Tunbridge Wells Online Status: Offline Posts: 1502 |
Post Options
Quote Reply
Topic: Seamanlike Rounding Posted: 13 Jan 05 at 11:09pm |
Many thanks for all that. I'm inclined to agree the Laser should have gybed. It is unlikely that the Phantom didn't keep clear since he has shrouds and is less able to run really deep like a Laser. The Laser sailor did confirm that the Phantom did not gybe until hit. My suspicion is that the Laser luffed a little when the gust hit, hit the Phantom which gybed it and that gybe the Laser. I would say that once past the mark the Laser was obliged to gybe - even if it meant a capsize. This is why it is much more difficult to race than just cruise. I sail a hairy boat which others have sailed at places like Minorca Sailing. They come back to the UK, buy one and get in a hell of a mess when they start racing. I'm not saying they shouldn't try, but racing one is a steep learning curve. |
|
Harry44981!
Really should get out more Joined: 26 Aug 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 736 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 14 Jan 05 at 8:00am |
http://www.uksailmakers.com/RulesQuiz/index.html a good rules quiz |
|
grahamd
Newbie Joined: 28 Jan 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 4 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Feb 05 at 11:49pm |
So most people are saying that the Laser is in the wrong, he should have gybed despite the conditions. However the basis of the rules are to ensure safety How about if the Laser, rather than being too scared to gybe decided that the conditions meant that gybing would have put his boat and himself at risk and he wanted to wear round. Would he be justified in asking for room to complete this manoeuvre. Would the Phantom then be in the wrong by insisting that the Laser gybed How about if this situation involved a lot more potential for damage than tow dinghies; consider the same situation with a 45knots squall with two 40 footers on the edge of control; could the outside boat insist the inside yacht gybed?
|
|
Stefan Lloyd
Really should get out more Joined: 03 Aug 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1599 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 09 Feb 05 at 7:49am |
The rules are exactly the same. If you can't race in the prevailing conditions, then don't. Nobody made your hypothetical 40-footer carry on racing in the squall and nobody made him take an inside overlap at the mark. He put himself there. BtW I've sailed bigger boats quite a lot, so I have been a skipper in that kind of situation.
|
|
grahamd
Newbie Joined: 28 Jan 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 4 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 09 Feb 05 at 11:07pm |
I know the rules are the same whether it is Maxis or Oppies. It's the interpretation that I am considering under different conditions. I agree that it is each skippers responsibility to continue racing, but we all make bad calls at different times and end up where we don't want to be. Are you saying that racing rules force the skipper to put his boat and crew at risk by putting in a gybe, irespective of the conditions?
|
|
Scooby_simon
Really should get out more Joined: 02 Apr 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2415 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 09 Feb 05 at 11:20pm |
No, I would argue that if the skipper did not want to gybe then (s)he should have manovered to come outside the other boat and so not be forced by the rules to gybe. Or (in the 'big' boat case) dropped the kite early/ and subsequestly dropped the main too if reguired.
|
|
Wanna learn to Ski - PM me..
|
|
Stefan Lloyd
Really should get out more Joined: 03 Aug 04 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1599 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 10 Feb 05 at 9:10am |
No, because you can always retire at any time. If you cannot carry on racing in the conditions, don't. What you can't do is ignore the rules because it is a bit windy and carry on racing. Once one of the boats has retired, colregs apply, which have nothing to say about mark roundings. Under colregs, the outside windward boat must keep clear. Edited by Stefan Lloyd |
|
Garry
Really should get out more Joined: 18 Apr 04 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 536 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 10 Feb 05 at 10:07pm |
The rules are about allowing boats to complete the race course in very close proximity. I think the only safety duty placed on boats by the rules is the decision to race or continue racing which is the responsibility of the crew. Perhaps I should also add assisting those in danager and avoiding collisions if possible. Edited by Garry |
|
Garry
Lark 2252, Contender 298 www.cuckoos.eclipse.co.uk |
|
Blobby
Really should get out more Joined: 07 May 04 Location: Australia Online Status: Offline Posts: 779 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 11 Feb 05 at 3:30am |
18.4 states "until she gybes she shall sail no farther from the mark or obstruction than needed to sail that course." So you may tack, but you cannot ask for more room to tack than you were entitled to if you were to gybe. So to complete a tack, the skipper should consider this in advance and create enough room to do so. With our Laser and Phantom, the laser should have slowed to allow the Phantom to pass ahead, and then he could have tacked once he felt ready to do so. |
|
Post Reply | Page <12 |
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |