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iGRF View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 19 at 6:18pm
Oh and I'm avaiable for lee bow tidal training for £200 p/hr
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Post Options Post Options   Quote eric_c Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 19 at 6:53pm
Some of what can usefully be coached is very boat specific.
Some is the same on a Sunsail 36 as it is on a Laser.

There is a problem that you could attmpt to coach 5 boats and they'd want to do 5 different things all the time.
You could sail upwind just looking to go through the waves better, you could fiddle with controls, you could concentrate on trim. You could be thinking about judging when to tack on shifts and bends or tsctics relative to other boats.

You can hire someone to buzz around the fleet telling people what they are doing wrong, maybe shooting some video to discuss afterwards. I've seen that work well.

Some of the coaching in RS classes has been excellent. I can't see it paying anyone's mortgage though.

Myself, I could probably race better if I got fitter and did a bit of structured practice before and after races.
Maybe actually reading some of my collection of sailing books again might help?

Doing a ntionals or a few open meetings can improve your club sailing.
If you want to improve, I think choosing a class with some training events and accessible opens or nationals is a good move. Also a class with a high standard, go and learn from some people you respect.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote davidyacht Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 19 at 7:05pm
I think iGRF makes a fair point, and he is right to acknowledge that the problem may be due to his liking for obscure classes and handicap racing.  

I have had a fair amount of coaching from sailmakers in recent years, as a club fleet we have fed and watered them, had a whip round and we all sport their wares, but they only offer this support if they can perceive the commercial benefit.  We usually organise this on a Friday ... the sailmaker/coach can justify it as a working day to his employers ... and we don’t lose a racing weekend.

Also most of the mainstream racing classes have training officers and run coaching weekends.

And for the coaching itself, to get the most from it you need at least two similar boats with sailors of similar skills, and better still a few similar boats, again different classes conspire against this.

Ironically the people who we organise this for rarely turn up ... so there may be some truth that some are happy to get around the course and enjoy the ride.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Oinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Nov 19 at 10:16pm

I don’t think the tennis/golf coaching model lends itself to sailing very well. Our sport is (gloriously) much more complicated than getting a pro to sort out your serve or swing. A great book to read on these darkening winter evenings is Eric Twiname’s Sail, Race and Win. Part of its preamble is “The aim is to move you up the fleet by coaching yourself”. At the end of the day, only you can drag yourself up the pecking order. This book’s a gem.


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Post Options Post Options   Quote Peaky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 19 at 7:32am
How many Olympic medals would GBR have had since 2000 if they’d all coached themselves? Coaching works, but it is time consuming, expensive and needs doing frequently.

Importantly, coaching doesn’t just improve your technique, it keeps you engaged in the activity making it less likely you’ll drop out. But, of course, mid week sailing coaching would be impractical for anyone working, except maybe a few weeks in summer.
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ian.r.mcdonald View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ian.r.mcdonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 19 at 8:51am
And of course the focus and level of the training is very important. The RYA training is just fantastic at creating medal winners. But my impression of the supporting Squad system means that a significant number drop out under the pressure.
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iGRF View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 19 at 10:00am
Originally posted by davidyacht

I think iGRF makes a fair point, and he is right to acknowledge that the problem may be due to his liking for boats that are nice to sail and therefore handicap racing. ]


FTFY

It's been my experience re 'training' that you can lead a horse to water... Many a time over the years back in the day when called upon to offer 'advice' to would be racing boardsailors, you'd explain what is required then watch as they do the exact opposite.

The fact is we need participants, not winners and losers, we tend to only take advice from the 'winners' and I'm here to tell you that for the most part they aint always nice 'particiapants' and nearly always very bad losers.

I like to find my own way about, sometimes, in fact these days, most times it's wrong, but I like to think it doesn't take from the sense of enjoyment of a race. Sure I'd be happy for someone with greater knowledge and skill to offer suggestions, but are they going to improve my handicap? No, nothing they are going to do is going to undo the new unfairness that I find myself surrounded with in my boat versus my friends in theirs and that I find more annoying than any sense of curable incompetence that might beset me, and anyway old dog new tricks?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Oinks Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 19 at 11:45am
"How many Olympic medals would GBR have had since 2000 if they’d all coached themselves? "

I wasn't really talking about sailing at that level but, to some degree, even at that level those sailors will have self-coached quite a lot. One of our most famous sailors Rodney Pattison was renowned for eschewing the squad/coaching route. Input from a suitably experienced coach will always help, undeniable. But the greater benefit would be in putting in the time on the water practicing and refining those things. Not something most of us can afford to do a lot of. A remarkable example of that...a well known international sailor at my club, in the lead up to a major event, was often seen out sailing for an hour or so by 7.30am during weekdays. No coaches in sight at that time of the morning!
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Ian99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 19 at 7:11pm
There's also a very big practical difference between getting a tennis coach for a few hours to getting someone to do something similar for sailing.
The tennis or golf coach will come to wherever you play and stand there watching you, and giving advice. At the most they may bring a camera and a racquet or clubs with them.
A coach who came to a sailing club for individual coaching on all but the smallest of ponds won't be able to coach from standing on the side of the lake. This means they have to bring a boat with them to coach from. RIBs and the petrol and maintenance needed for them are very expensive.
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Do Different View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Do Different Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Nov 19 at 7:55pm
I cannot see anything especially difficult about organising dinghy coaching. It all comes down to demand, if the demand was there it would happen no question.

Riders regularly trail horses to visit coaches at all levels from local instructors, through national competitors and even up to international level. Also many golfers sign up to regular coaching at no small cost.

It would take very little for groups to travel to the home club of a "celeb" competitor or arrange for their own club RIB to be available to carry a coach.

The fact the people are finding it difficult to get private adult coaching simply shows that the majority are not interested. 
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