Laurent Giles 'Jolly Boat' Exeter |
29er GBR 074 Tynemouth |
J24 (Sail No. 4239) Dartmouth |
List classes of boat for sale |
So, just how important is a Boats PY yardstick? |
Post Reply | Page <1 34567 34> |
Author | |
iGRF
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6496 |
Post Options
Quote Reply
Topic: So, just how important is a Boats PY yardstick? Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 9:38pm |
And so we have it, the usual response and the thread peters out into banality and red herrings, but what does it matter?
It's not as if we have anything to worry about, the fact that in the ten years I've been paying attention the Optimist fleet has lost 100 boats from 447 in 2008 to 347 and the Toppers 120, this year just gone and if you collate the lot you find the numbers have dropped only 40% across those years, so it doesn't matter really we'll be alright with the remaining 60 percent for a while longer.. This all from the Y&Y stats, what's going on at PYAG might as well be at GCHQ the chance of any of us getting to find out. So either we do something about it, or it'll keep on heading south. But then just how important is a boats handicap to all this? Personally I think it's a trick that could be used to re invigorate the sport if handled with vision and vigour, but then what do I know, I'm only a semi retired action sport marketing type frustrated at lack of action to stave off the inevitable decline the modern culture is having on all outdoor action sports and how little is even being attempted. Edited by iGRF - 08 Nov 19 at 9:41pm |
|
tink
Really should get out more Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 788 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 8:38pm |
Lots of discussion about the Laser here so worth re linking CT249s excellent article on the Laser
|
|
Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
|
tink
Really should get out more Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 788 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 5:05pm |
Edited by tink - 08 Nov 19 at 5:06pm |
|
Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
|
ian.r.mcdonald
Far too distracted from work Joined: 24 Feb 06 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 440 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 4:35pm |
I cant find the " I agree" button, so have posted instead.
Well said |
|
eric_c
Far too distracted from work Joined: 21 Jan 18 Online Status: Offline Posts: 382 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 4:16pm |
When I started sailing, a Laser was 114 and an Ent 118 Now they're 1099 and 1119 Not much change really. Back in last Century, Lasers were mostly sailed by younger fitter people who sailed them hard in conditions that suited the laser, when it was windy. Now, we seem to have a lot more older people sailing Lasers who don't go out chasing Fireballs in F6. Other boats have got faster. A modern Ent sail is not like 30 years ago. Likewise Solos. Lasers now have better controls, but that just means that people who are not strong/agile enough to deal with a 3:1 kicker can sail them. It doesn't mean the keen laser sailor is using any more kicker. Compared with most other sports which attract middle aged people, there seems to be a lot of needy people obsessed with winning on this forum. People who go out running or cycling or horseriding or playing tennis badminton, , even fairly competitively to the limit of their ability, seem to be able to enjoy their sport and not worry if they get beaten by people who are better than them, or who've invested more in equipment, or who the conditions suit on the day. I know people who do amateur motorsport. They get out there with what they chose to run with and nobody thinks less of them for not winning.They know they've done OK if they're not too far behind the serious boys with expensive kit, and they enjoy the sport for its own sake, and for achieving or working towards their personal goals. Some people seem to need a shiny cup or their name at the top of a list to validate spending £10k sailing around a pond. Winning on PY is vastly over-rated. Winning on the water isn't everything, looking back over the year, most of the races that are memorable as enjoyable aren't the few that I've won. The PY system is what it is. If you don't like it, sail the same class as the people you care about.
|
|
seasailor
Newbie Joined: 07 Feb 12 Location: Hove Online Status: Offline Posts: 30 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 1:42pm |
|
|
Granite
Far too distracted from work Joined: 12 May 04 Location: Scotland Online Status: Offline Posts: 476 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 12:45pm |
Perhaps the Laser handicap started changing when the returns went to online race time returns, rather than the older one where clubs recommended changes to handicaps? Many years of clubs thinking The laser hasent changed as a boat so we shouldn't recommend a change in handicap could have resulted in it being a bit wrong for many years, and that is now being corrected.
|
|
If it doesn't break it's too heavy; if it does it wasn't built right
|
|
Rupert
Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 8:47am |
I love the idea as a concept, but can see confusion at club level! Hope a club tries it, but I think it would fall on deaf ears if I suggested it at mine.
|
|
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
|
|
tink
Really should get out more Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 788 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 6:47am |
I do like your probabilistic PY provided it could be automated with a computer algorithm and not relying on judgement and extra work for the guy doing the returns
|
|
Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
|
tink
Really should get out more Joined: 23 Jan 16 Location: North Hants Online Status: Offline Posts: 788 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 08 Nov 19 at 6:43am |
Totally The Laser is a much harder boat to sail fast compared to the modern equivalent with much more gust control. The number of moans on a social media post about the rudder is testimony to this. It also is a very physically demanding. So you returning sailor with a Dad Bod simply won’t sail it to handicap. There are also probably more boats racing twenty or more years old than Solos ever built. If more than half the people sail it slower than handicap the handicap will get slower year on year. But if you come up agains a good, fit sailor it suddenly is a bandit
|
|
Tink
https://tinkboats.com http://proasail.blogspot.com |
|
Post Reply | Page <1 34567 34> |
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |