New Posts New Posts RSS Feed: Dare I even discuss a new class?
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Dare I even discuss a new class?

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12345 7>
Author
ian.r.mcdonald View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work


Joined: 24 Feb 06
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 297
Post Options Post Options   Quote ian.r.mcdonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 1:19pm
Originally posted by rich96

Originally posted by iGRF

Originally posted by davidyacht

I donít think traction is an issue for Graeme, despite his complete displeasure with the PY system he appears to have equal disdain for fleet racing.
What about a Toy?


Never come across a Toy and fleet racing does emphasise body differences even more in dinghy than it does in windsurfing and people whine about any activity one might consider to even things out, like pumping.

Originally posted by H2

Whilst I have never meet you Graeme I believe you are a small chap and hence relatively light weight (i.e. probably at or under 80kg). If that is the case you actually have a huge choice of boats already which are well established with large fleets nationally and internationally. Whilst these offerings sound like they do not appeal to you, I suspect that the issue will be convincing enough people to leave these well established classes to come join you!
If you were a larger chap then the options are much more limited with Finn, Phantom & Blaze traditionally being your choices which is why the H2 got some traction as this segment was less served than the weight category you fit into.
Personally, I think it will be very hard to get traction.


Yes, 5'6" 67 kgs maybe 70 in full kit. As for all the boats, I have cast my gaze wide and been through a few now and have yet to come across one that isn't flawed in one way or another, you also need to add Contender to your big guys list, along with the D1, MPS,RS700, RS600, RS300, RS100, EPS In fact I'd argue there's more for big guys than small, what do we have? Streaker? Lightning? Supersofa? Solution is a middle weights boat as is the Solo and the Laser with it's main rig if the breeze is up. The Farr is the right boat for my size, it's just not the right length as I've said all along.


Buy a Contender. Get a flat cut sail for the breezy days.

Accept that, at your size, you wont be quick in breeze (the same will really apply to any single hander)

Enjoy the light days.

Learn to sail it to the point that the limiting factor isn't you

Then - once you have pushed the boat to its limit - think about what you could do to make it better

Sorted

Next


And to keep your drive to develop and design happy, go crazy on the fit out and setup
Back to Top
423zero View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 08 Jan 15
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1768
Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 1:49pm
Originally posted by rich96

Originally posted by 423zero

Buy a new Laser hull from LP, Laser 2 mast and standing rigging, better than Laser 1 rudder, redesigned dagger board that fits existing slot. Larger Laser 2 sail and wire should give you more speed than standard Laser 1 and in lighter winds you will be able to hike with other Laser 1 sailors.


Can you fit a L2 rig on a Laser ?.

One is totally unstayed ?

One sail or 2 ?

This surely is not a great plan.

There would have to be an adaptor between Laser 2 mast foot and Laser 1 mast pot.
Laser with a sail you can drop.
I would go with option of a 3 sail set up, Laser 2 already as fittings for them.
Not something I would do myself, I prefer classic boats.
Robert
Back to Top
Do Different View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 26 Jan 12
Location: North
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1014
Post Options Post Options   Quote Do Different Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 1:53pm
I know nothing of them but for us small and grey oldies I thought the Blaze Fire an interesting idea. 

edit add. Still loving my Contender inland @ 5' 3" and now down to 70kgs, really quite a gentleman's tool up to a decent breeze now I'm settled to a technique that suits, not too sure I'd be heavy enough to recover it from capsize in a sea though if I got caught out and it came up rough.  


Edited by Do Different - 27 Sep 19 at 2:00pm
Back to Top
iGRF View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 11
Location: Hythe
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5719
Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 2:23pm
Originally posted by Do Different


I know nothing of them but for us small and grey oldies I thought the Blaze Fire an interesting idea.†
edit add. Still loving my Contender inland @ 5' 3" and now down to 70kgs, really quite a gentleman's tool up to a decent breeze now I'm settled to a technique that suits, not too sure I'd be heavy enough to recover it from capsize in a sea though if I got caught out and it came up rough. †


Yes, and there are a couple of Blazes now that come out occasionally and one with a Fire rig.

So it is feasible a Contender then? They've got mahoosive sails 11 sq mtr isn't it? I went over to the nationals to have a look didn't come across too many guys my build, although there was one ex windsurfer of my acquaintance. Friendly bunch though.

And you must get punished by the Laserati on light wind days, without the ability to run by the lee (which I see as it's biggest light wind liability) nor can you change the angle of the rig on the fly, so no pulling it more upright down wind which might help.


On another point, Rupert if you're reading this, what are your issues with having two aft hulls? I was thinking wetted area reduction, no flushing strips to worry about, the stability to totally raise the plate offwind, other than it's weird what could possibly go wrong?


Edited by iGRF - 27 Sep 19 at 2:23pm
Back to Top
423zero View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 08 Jan 15
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1768
Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 2:32pm
Think of your Minisprint with no turrets and centre of hull removed aft of centre board, larger side tanks obviously, gantry linking tanks for rudder.
Robert
Back to Top
iGRF View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more
Avatar

Joined: 07 Mar 11
Location: Hythe
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5719
Post Options Post Options   Quote iGRF Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 2:40pm
Originally posted by davidyacht

https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat/toy

Originally posted by Rupert

When I owned a ToY I found it very heavy and lacking in power, despite the seat. Shroud base too far back to do more than broad reach, but the speed wasn't there to make it worth it. Too easily beaten by Lasers.

A modern take on the concept, half the weight, maybe with a similar bow but with GRFs tunnel hull aft, if we have to!


It looks like a single handed Fireball, difficult to tell from that picture I shall have a research tonight

Have a think about the Twin hull idea Rupert, reduced wetted area , no flushing strips, kick the plate all the way up offwind. They could even taper off so the boat would be like a swallowtail board but with higher volume in the tails
Back to Top
Do Different View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 26 Jan 12
Location: North
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1014
Post Options Post Options   Quote Do Different Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 3:34pm
I probably shouldn't have commented iGRF, as I suspect we have different agendas.
I don't give two hoots about how it compares to Lasers in v. light; it is what it is, a great big long, elegant and powerful piece of a sailing classic. Also, really relaxing to lay about in while waiting for breeze to fill.
At our sizes I'm wiring and hanging out comfortably with next to no effort in any sort of breeze while others are hiking and beginning to lean out!  When it pipes up a bit more, pulling on cunningham and sailing free n easy for max VMG while others are really hurting. If I get caught out 2 miles at the far side of the res. in a real squall all that length makes it a very predictable platform to deep reach home standing on the rear quarter.
Always liked them and now doing it late in life as a greying midget. Of course I do absolutely nothing on PY, why would that bother me set against all the plus points? 
Back to Top
Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 07 Mar 12
Location: Manchester UK
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2468
Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 5:41pm
Given that the PY's are arrived at from a mix of venues I'd be surprised if any trap boat can be competitive on any but the very biggest lakes and only the flat-land ones at that (I suspect your's is one of those DD if the far side is 2 miles away). Places like Bala and Ullswater are usually gusty enough to make trapezing anything but a pleasure unless the wind is down the length. The fittest, most agile sailors will still do alright but for us ordinary guys a hiking boat with a relatively modest rig is always going to be easier to sail to it's numbers. On open water OTOH where the extra power is more usable then traps and big rigs are the way to go.

Why don't you build your sub 50kg carbon Contender, give it a modern rig and a different name and see how you go Graeme?
Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Back to Top
ian.r.mcdonald View Drop Down
Far too distracted from work
Far too distracted from work


Joined: 24 Feb 06
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 297
Post Options Post Options   Quote ian.r.mcdonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 6:08pm
When I had my Contender, I thought the hotshot who advised me on rake "back until you cant get under the boom, then up one hole" was joking.

He wasnt.

A lovely boat
Back to Top
Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
Really should get out more
Really should get out more


Joined: 07 Mar 12
Location: Manchester UK
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2468
Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 19 at 6:25pm
Originally posted by Do Different

I know nothing of them but for us small and grey oldies I thought the Blaze Fire an interesting idea.

The Fire sail is fantastic (I have one) but the Blaze standard sail is so controllable that I have used the Fire twice.
Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <12345 7>

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.665y
Copyright ©2001-2010 Web Wiz
Change your personal settings, or read our privacy policy