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Solo changes survey

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zeon View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote zeon Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 Sep 19 at 9:09pm
Originally posted by CT249

Originally posted by zeon

I am with Colprice on this one . No dinghy class can stand still, even the Streakers have voted for tracked centre main and carbon booms recently. Small changes would make the boat look more modern. Get rid of the coffee table on the centre board case for one and carbon boom would be a good start. I would even be in favour of a small weight reduction so you could remove the correctors that all frp boats have. On the other hand I would be against carbon masts for a number of reasons.

How modern can a boat designed in the 1950s look, unless it gets a new hull, complete new rig, new deck, new foils and just keeps the same mainsheet block?


You missed my point a little  Every boat has to gently updated . Not to make it look brand new but to stop it looking old and out of date. 
I sail in a class that was designed in 1932, but that doesnít mean it still has to  solid wood decks and a wood mast and boom.  Itís had two weight reductions, can be made out of frp and can have carbon masts and boom. 


Edited by zeon - 07 Sep 19 at 9:36pm
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Paramedic View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Paramedic Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 6:24am
Originally posted by ian.r.mcdonald

 
You missed the inevitable change to a loose footed main when rivet on tracks stick and start separating from the boom. New sail needed.

Whats needed to put that to bed is a commitment that there will be no further rig changes for a minimum of - say - 5 years.

The tracks are glued on and a clew strap would still be needed. It makes attaching the kicker and mainsheet blocks more complex but its do able. Other classes do it.


Edited by Paramedic - 08 Sep 19 at 6:25am
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JimC View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 6:41am
Originally posted by Paramedic

Whats needed to put that to bed is a commitment that there will be no further rig changes for a minimum of - say - 5 years.

Trouble is that's a commitment that cannot be made in a democratically controlled class. The membership is always free to introduce a rule change.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ian.r.mcdonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 7:45am
Originally posted by Paramedic



Originally posted by ian.r.mcdonald

†You missed the inevitable change to a loose footed main when rivet on tracks stick and start separating from the boom. New sail needed.

Whats needed to put that to bed is a commitment that there will be no further rig changes for a minimum of - say - 5 years.
The tracks are glued on and a clew strap would still be needed. It makes attaching the kicker and mainsheet blocks more complex but its do able. Other classes do it.



I thought most classes made the change to loose foot at the same time. Based on another classes experience, does just a boom swap work as well as the existing unit? Is the benefit of carbon significant?
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Post Options Post Options   Quote davidyacht Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 8:46am
The lens foot that is used with a boom with a track helps seal the sail to the boom, which forms an end plate which reduces drag losses from the foot of the sail, and increases the effective aspect ratio of the sail and its efficiency ... well thatís the theory.

However with the loose foot pulled tight, the boom still forms and end plate, and there is an opportunist to get some unmeasured sail area under the boom when sailing downwind.

I think that the innovation in the Northern Hemisphere was off the back of a book by Murray Ross which brought a lot of the stuff the Aussies were doing in Northbridge 14ís, and then the Merlins and N12s converted to loose foot.  I went to Michael Mac got my bolt rope foots changed for loose foots and bolted a short track to the old boom and it worked fine.

Fitting out a carbon boom will normally require sailcloth or webbing straps for the kicker and mainsheet take off and a track and associated blocks for the outhaul, I would suggest that these will cost a lot more than the standard Selden set up.

I guess that a carbon boom will be kinder on the head, having less hard corners, and being lighter it carries less momentum, but it will be more expensive.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 9:44am
Originally posted by davidyacht

...there is an opportunist to get some unmeasured sail area under the boom when sailing downwind.

Class rules ought to be smarter than that really these days. ERS has the option to measure such area, whether loose footed or shelf foot.

Originally posted by davidyacht

and then the Merlins and N12s converted to loose foot.

Some of us were a good 10 years or more ahead of that ... #CherubClass
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Post Options Post Options   Quote maxibuddah Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 10:42am
Davidyacht,
you don't need a track for the outhaul, a looped strap or rope on the clew will suffice. You are also right that a webbed strap will do for the main and kicker take-off. Its position is controlled by a rope to the end of the boom. Pretty simple and cheap, plus no holes in the boom to create stress points. 

As the for lens foot creating an end plate, etc, does it really make that much difference on a slower boat like a Solo? Also its not controlled either, as it changes shape as you play with the outhaul. In a lot of cases its such a flimsy material I cannot see that it provides any end plate effect. Its about getting the lightest bit of material in place to meet the rules, while in effect attempting to not actually being there. It just seems like a fairly useless piece of material getting in the way adding a little more expense to a sail. In fact I expect that in most cases you could just cut it off if you swap to a carbon boom, negating the need to buy a new sail. Would it make that much difference?

As for updating the boat, etc, the Solo seems fairly sucessful without the need to constantly update. Not keeping up with the Joneses seems to be a good thing for it.


Edited by maxibuddah - 08 Sep 19 at 10:44am
Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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Post Options Post Options   Quote davidyacht Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 11:58am
Problem with the webbed strap for the outhaul is the friction c/w a track.  Roger Angel used to insert a stainless steel rod with a block running on it, which worked quite well.  To be fair the inhaul system on Solos pretty much negates the need to adjust the outhaul.  I would suggest the two reasons not to go to carbon booms would be that these would not be off the shelf like the Selden section and would cost more.
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Post Options Post Options   Quote davidyacht Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 12:10pm
Originally posted by JimC


Originally posted by davidyacht

and then the Merlins and N12s converted to loose foot.

Some of us were a good 10 years or more ahead of that ... #CherubClass

Yep I think the book was a summary of Antipodean thinking at that time and rolled out many Cherub and Bethwaite ideas which were subsequently adopted in the Northern Hemisphere ... loose foots, close sheeting, mast struts and daggerboards were all in there.

I guess most of this was featured on Flat Stanley, Jim may well advise if these were on earlier Cherubs.


 


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Post Options Post Options   Quote JimC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Sep 19 at 12:17pm
We learned about this stuff in the early 70s.
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