preventing knots in spinnaker halyards?

   What methods do the crews out there use to prevent the spinnaker halyard turning into a big ball of knitting when dropping a spinnaker?
I'm doing a stint in the front of a 400 and struggling to keep it tangle free on every drop. We are currently putting the haylard straight across the crew area like most 400's to prevent any helm feet scenarios.

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rs41212 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Newbie Joined: 27 Mar 17 Online Status: Offline Posts: 9	Post Options Post Reply Quote rs41212 Report Post Quote Reply Topic: preventing knots in spinnaker halyards? Posted: 16 Oct 17 at 4:21pm
	What methods do the crews out there use to prevent the spinnaker halyard turning into a big ball of knitting when dropping a spinnaker? I'm doing a stint in the front of a 400 and struggling to keep it tangle free on every drop. We are currently putting the haylard straight across the crew area like most 400's to prevent any helm feet scenarios.

Sam.Spoons Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3398	Post Options Post Reply Quote Sam.Spoons Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 16 Oct 17 at 5:32pm
	On the Spice I have an elastic tidy running back to the rudder post. Not perfect but it usually keeps things running freely. How often do you get tangles, every drop, one in 10 or fewer?
	Spice 346 "Flat Broke" Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"

rs41212 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Newbie Joined: 27 Mar 17 Online Status: Offline Posts: 9	Post Options Post Reply Quote rs41212 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 16 Oct 17 at 5:48pm
	It's in the fewer category but I'd like it to be never. A particularly bad one cost us quite a few places at the inlands a few weeks ago. I've seen elastic tidy up's work on 49ers but not sure how one would be fitted to the rather odd 400 setup.

Oinks Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 24 Oct 14 Location: Bandol Online Status: Offline Posts: 267	Post Options Post Reply Quote Oinks Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 16 Oct 17 at 6:29pm
	If you have that setup with the halliard in front of the crew, if you always ensure the halliard passes over pole launcher (which means you are doing a bit of housekeeping early on as you start each beat), that will help the tail of the launcher stay free of the halliard. It also helps if the halliard is as short as you dare make it so there isn't too much excess rope lolling about. We used to have an issue with the halliard going back into the cleat during drops so we fitted a small block on a thin bunjee, attached to the eye supporting the spinnaker shelf and ran the halliard thro that. This then pulled the halliard clear of the cleat when it was released.

Oatsandbeans Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 19 Sep 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 382	Post Options Post Reply Quote Oatsandbeans Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 16 Oct 17 at 7:10pm
	I Found that the rope type has a massive effect on how it knotted up. Some of the softest ropes tha went round the blocks great with no friction were a dissaster on knotting up. The ones that are stiffer and possibly more friction round the blocks didn't snag - makes sense.

RS400atC Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 04 Dec 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3011	Post Options Post Reply Quote RS400atC Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 16 Oct 17 at 7:39pm
	I lead our halliard around the back of the boat. I don't know if it's better, it's always been like that. The tangle factor is, as Oatsandbeans says a lot to do with floppy rope. But also twists in the rope, which take time to work their way down the mast and into the cockpit. Also there is rope about with a twisted/laid inner, this adds twists whenever the halliard gets a good stretch in a breeze.

Oatsandbeans Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 19 Sep 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 382	Post Options Post Reply Quote Oatsandbeans Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 16 Oct 17 at 8:42pm
	I spent a load of time making spliced haliyards with super thin Dynema SK78max? front ends and soft polyester back ends PS12. The polyester would tie itself in knots every time, it was so soft and slinky. Complete dissaster

Gordon 1430 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Far too distracted from work Joined: 27 Jun 17 Location: Lee on Solent Online Status: Offline Posts: 310	Post Options Post Reply Quote Gordon 1430 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 17 Oct 17 at 8:48am
	On my 400 I have a block on the halyard fed back under thwart on bungee to try and keep it tangle free. Like yours my halyard does not come aft but having something to add a bit of tension in theory might help. I also think how you hold it on the hoist can effect the rope. Agree with others about type of rope being a factor.
	Gordon Phantom 1430

rs41212 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Newbie Joined: 27 Mar 17 Online Status: Offline Posts: 9	Post Options Post Reply Quote rs41212 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 17 Oct 17 at 11:05am
	Thanks all, we have a dyneema cored rope; switched from the provided 8 plait to reduce stretch which theoretically should improve acceleration but it seems to hold the kinks in it. Maybe there is a good middle ground somewhere. Might have to investigate some form of tension system in greater detail.

laser193713 Send Private Message Find Member's Posts Really should get out more Joined: 13 May 09 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 889	Post Options Post Reply Quote laser193713 Report Post Quote Reply Posted: 17 Oct 17 at 11:16am
	I have a dyneema cored halyard, tapered. The halyard runs to the back of the boat and has never once twisted or been trodden on. It goes through a 20mm block which is attached to the toestrap elastic at the aft end of the cockpit by the inspection hatch. Nothing particularly clever, keep it simple!