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RS 600 where now? |
Post Reply | Page <1 10111213> |
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Rupert
Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
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Quote Reply
Topic: RS 600 where now? Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 7:34am |
I'm sure they are more efficient, but given the number of times I've sailed round Solos and Supersofas in very light winds with them unable to stop going backwards, I'll stick with soft sails and give up that last few % of top end.
But on a 600, or a Cherub? They are all about the top end. Be like putting a diesel engine in a Le Mans car otherwise... |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Sam.Spoons
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3398 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 9:30am |
Like this one?
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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish" |
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Rupert
Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 2:41pm |
Exactly... Still doesn't seem right to me.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Sam.Spoons
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3398 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 2:57pm |
Still won it's first three Le Mans 24 hours though. I'd take that........
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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish" |
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The Moo
Really should get out more Joined: 01 Jun 06 Online Status: Offline Posts: 807 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 4:42pm |
Does it sound like an old taxi though?
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Cirrus
Really should get out more Joined: 29 Oct 15 Location: UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 590 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 5:21pm |
The Blaze switched from the awful original fully battened rig back around 2000/2001. The sail developed then and used today is both smaller (by about 0.5m) and a fair bit lighter. The key however was never maximising theoretical 'raw power' it was always about maximising available usable power across all wind conditons. The impetus for it came from a conversation with an RS 800 owner at the time ... We enquired as to why the 800 employed a 'semi-soft' (ie a mix of short and full length battens in the head) which was definately in contrast to so many of the then 'new' designs emerging. His responce was that he did not know why RS had gone this way but he reported that it was so much easier to 'feather' the main upwind in real breeze conpared to other poweful designs he had raced. Depowering by sheeting out at the onset of each gust and keeping the boat 'flat and going' is fast .. as we should all know. The lightbulb lit up for us !! Anyway the advantage is even more marked in a single-sail racer as you also lack a jib to resist the boat slowing as you sheet out. The sail chord is 'held out' by the full-length battening against the breeze as you ease (or dump) the main out .. so very very 'draggy' - in contrast the 'semi-soft' sail allows the area just behind the luff to partially collapse .... so far less draggy .. and the boat maintains more of its pace). Yes - you can flatten the sail and depower with control input and will do this with either batten configuration anyway in constant breeze - however in gusty conditions you will struggle to do this in real time so can end up alternating between being 'under' and 'over-powered'. Today we just concentrate on keeping the boat flat(ish) and the semi-soft sail will automatically do much of the work for you. If constantly too much breeze - add some control input - and vice versa. But do keep the boat moving and flatter - and that means playing the main 'in' and 'out' as often as needed. There are other handling advantages but I'm not going there just now ... There is also plenty of 'static' state theory around but even (most) CFD does not and cannot easily look at rapidly changing wind speed and shiftyness. The outputs can point towards a measure of greater effectiveness but .. remember the assumptions usally employed in these models. 1) Constant wind speed 2) Constant wind angle .... So great for a theoretical approach / appreciation but do not be totally deceived by the nice pretty images on offer !! The real world is far more complex. To cut the long story much shorter the Blaze ended up faster and very much 'nicer' to race - the class rallied and its numbers have since grown considerably. It is a rare year indeed now when the Nationals see anything less than 40-50+ entrants. There are a couple of other single-handers who might do well to at least look at the benefits (or not !) of at least trying this approach.....
Edited by Cirrus - 22 Dec 18 at 5:24pm |
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Sam.Spoons
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3398 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 6:05pm |
Who cares
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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish" |
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RS400atC
Really should get out more Joined: 04 Dec 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3011 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 6:17pm |
Development classes seem to end up with full battens? I suspect the real difference is a sail that's well cut and matched to the mast, rig tension, spreader settings etc, rather than whether or not some lower battens are full length. It's a bit of a change for the 600s to look at a new sail planform, when not so long ago allowing the kicker to be rigged 4x2x2 to give enough travel was deemed beyond the pale. Trouble is, I feel the hull design is more dated than the rig.. But still a great boat that more people should have a go at.
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Sam.Spoons
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 12 Location: Manchester UK Online Status: Offline Posts: 3398 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 22 Dec 18 at 6:30pm |
Pros and cons to each I guess, development classes are always going to look for a performance edge though irrespective of if it makes the boat harder to sail. The 600 is not a dev. class so does not need to do that.
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Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish" |
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RS400atC
Really should get out more Joined: 04 Dec 08 Online Status: Offline Posts: 3011 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 23 Dec 18 at 7:16am |
If changing the sail reduced the 600's tendency to get stuck in irons, it could be a good thing. But I believe that's realy more to do with the hull than the length of the lower battens. The interesting part of the new sail is really the long top battens and how well that works with the mast to improve gust response. But the big question is why wouldn't you buy a Musto instead, if budget allows for shiny new sails?
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