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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 8:00pm
Mr Spoons, you are quite right about levels of competitiveness, and even in the same race, I'll judge whether someone is out to win or learning how to race, and behave differently. But ensuring you are on starboard when you meet another boat is hardly pushing any boundaries.
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423zero View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote 423zero Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 7:47pm
Sam S, try watching competetive Laser sailors to see rules abused and pushed to the limit.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 7:26pm
I do too, the trick is to assess the level of 'rule aggression' at the club/event you are taking part in and behave accordingly, I will be much less aggressive at a Wednesday night club race than I might at a National Championships because what would be considered fair at a Nationals might be considered a bit OTT at a club race. But I race for fun not to win an Olympic Gold. Paul Elvstrom nailed it when he said "You haven't won the race, if in winning the race you have lost the respect of your competitors." Nobody is going to lose the respect of the other competition in the ACWS by pushing the rules to the limit (though they would if they , say, used an foil or other piece of equipment they know to be illegal).
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 7:07pm
I'll use rules to my advantage every time I race, as will those I'm racing against. That is the game. Otherwise, it is simply either sailing in company or a drag race.
Match racing will take that to the next level, as they don't have to worry about their position in a fleet. 2nd is last. Using the rules to win is sportsmanship. Abusing them is unsporting.
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 6:54pm
But the point is that they are simply 'tactics', nothing dirty about them, all the teams have the same opportunities to use the rules to their advantage as Ainsley did to beat Robert Scheidt and secure an Olympic gold in the final race at Sydney 2000.
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Sam S View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 6:34pm
I totally agree. I am not against the rule, only the abuse of it in what I call dirty-tactics.
Sam
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 6:20pm
Gently now, my namesake is a newb here and may not have any racing experience. Sam S, I'm not a fan of the 'win at all costs' attitude we see in so much sport these days, and am a huge believer in sportsmen 'doing the right thing' (I was the guy who re-rounded a touched mark even if nobody saw me touch it.....). But, the rules are the same for everybody and at that level they all have an intimate knowledge of them. Would you describe it as 'bad sportsmanship' in a football game for a defender to step up field causing the opposing forward to be offside as he receives a pass? Much the same thing IMHO. And, while I didn't see the incident in question, the ROW rules are even more important (if that's possible) in these big fast AC boats due to their lack of manoeuvrability.

It's well worth reading Eric Twiname's brilliant book "Start To Win" or at least the chapter/s relating to rules and protests. He wrote much sense.
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Sam S View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 5:59pm
The 'Port-Starboard' rule was implimented for give-way purposes, not to screw up the other boats chances of winning. That is like allowing tripping in a soccer game. 
I agree with the rule, but not when used to stiffle your competitor. This aught to be a gentleman's sport.
Sam
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ClubRacer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ClubRacer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 5:37pm
both boats want to be in the same place at the same time the only way to be in that place is to prevent the other boat from being there

Sailing has always been about who can use the rules to their advantage, no sailor in the world has ever won a championship event without having to out smart the other boats on the course and this is exactly the same. Keep the others boats behind you and you'l always win 

to come out with comments about it being un-sportsman like and not pure sailing is completely ignorant 

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Sam S View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam S Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 05 Jun 17 at 5:05pm
Using the rules to your advantage is IMHO 'bad sportsmanship'. 
Just because you can 'trip up' the other team to 'win' your race, does not mean that you won on an even footing. And that is my point.
If the race is about the skill of the team at sailing their boat the fastest, then we have a true representation of a team and boat.
Sam
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