How I learned to forget bandits & enjoy fair play

Originally posted by Medway Maniac It's clear that you touched on the adjustment at local level giving rise to, in effect, personal PY's. Given the general dislike of personal PY's expressed in an earlier thread, I'm surprised Grumph felt that this was compensated by bandits having their noses put out of joint.

They are talking of introducing personal handicap dual scoring next year, he also indicated that they do have a windspeed formula in the system but the feeling is that it would be pretty impossible to use, where would you set it, given the humber of events where the wind starts of at one point and finishes at another and where do you measure it?

Crossed in the post Mike. Thanks.

I think IGRF may be thinking that  'Sailracer'  'Sailjuice' and 'Great Lakes' are in some way one and the same thing in whole or in part. 

The  'Sailjuice' Series groups together a number of traditional winter handicap events (plus a couple of newer ones) in a series with their ‘Sailjuice’ name on it ...... 'Sailracer' (now don’t get confused) are often found adding trackers and providing a web based entry system for the SJ events ... and the events themselves (run by the host clubs note !) use the 'Great Lakes' handicap numbers.  The  GL handicappers  are NOT ‘Sailjuice’ ... or  ‘Sailracer.   Get it ?

Well that's how I see it anyway  !  Someone correct me if wrong ...

I too would like to see a better handling for 'new' classes led by the RYA.  Measurement based assessment is however very difficult to justify ... who decides on the weighting of each factor for example ?   Measuring for handicap assessment assumes every aspect of each design is primarily there for maximum speed ....  and it gets extremely over-complex if dealing  with some factors such as hull form.  Assessment simply has to be results based ... in some form.

The GL approach has got Icon closer to a reasonable handicap number ... and relatively quickly imo (2-3 years).  Answer for new classes ? – Race at your clubs, race in the major handicaps, accept in the short term an (inevitable) tough number ... it can and will change.  Today my club races Icon off 990, last year its GL number was 1000.. this year this was  adjusted slightly because of the issuing of an EN figure of 969.  So this year the GL number is also 990... in time I expect the ‘official’ EN/PN to be somewhere between 990 and 1000  as well (and certainly not the current 969 !).   It is not a major problem anyway if our clubs make the changes they should do anyway and most, if not all, of our ‘away’ handicap racing is under the GL approach.    

Anyway Friday now ...  Blessed relief.  Time to forget all this B*****s  and get back  into Icon sorting mode after a long enforced gap... Starting this Sunday I also need to remember to talk to a crew (remember ‘nicely’) and not crash tack etc without giving notice.    Now that is much more important.  

If you can do something similar !

Mike L.

So, genuine question. Is the 100 a single class now with one PY, or is it as it always was - two classes with 2 PY.

With regards the PYAG, I respect the work they do greatly. But the process need not, should not, stop at the number crunching. Why can't these purely data based numbers the be passed to a committee of grey beards to approve or modify. Not on subjective taste but PY should be a forecast for the next year, not a record of the previous one. So if the I14s take some lead out, or Merlin's use a longer kite pole, or Blazes switch to a carbon mast, or 200s adopt a square head mainsail why not be proactive and set an adjustment when the rule change occurs. An estimated change is better than no change at all.

But well done GRF for organising the briefing and Bas for actually entering the lion' den!

Originally posted by Null Originally posted by Medway Maniac To speak up for the Great Lakes people, they seem to have taken onboard my comments about the unsuitability of using the class-recommended V3k handicap for the Laser 3000.  3ks of any hue can now attend SailJuice with a fair chance.   Did they not allow the V3k to use the L3k number in the past.  I remember D&D nearly winning the bloody mary off a frankly mental PY