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PY changes for 2014 |
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andy101
Posting king Joined: 11 Jan 11 Online Status: Offline Posts: 176 |
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Topic: PY changes for 2014 Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 4:36pm |
Seems like common sense.
There have been discussions in recent years of a split between water types and I took it from the comments of those involved they weren't confident they had enough data to provide it on an 'official' basis but pointed clubs towards making local adjustments. However, in many clubs this is to much of a can of worms so greater guidance from the Governing Body is required. As the number of on-line returns is increasing each year surely the point will be reached in the very near future when there is enough confidence in the data to provide this?? |
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iGRF
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6496 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 7:02pm |
Spent most of my show lobbying the various manufacturers and they're agents, for my SBHRS system, driven by formulas set by the people who actually build the boat, and fixed. Only changed if there is a change to the physical specification of the boat and not open to tinkering by committee and computers every year.
That would at least minimise their risk, so if they are trying to sell me a craft for 5 to 10 grand at a given handicap, I'm not going to be wandering around the following year with a long face, knowing the class I bought into last year is now dead in the water, not because anything changed on it, just because a group input data from a sailing environment different to mine or even that which the designer and manufacturer may have intended the craft to be used on when gauging the handicap rating. Nothing would stop clubs carrying on with the absurdities of the current system, but at least there would be a common sense guideline written in stone that purchaser of a given craft could point to and insist if necessary it be adopted. Not one of them disagreed that it would make sense. |
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GybeFunny
Far too distracted from work Joined: 27 Oct 09 Online Status: Offline Posts: 403 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 8:10pm |
Of course they didn't disagree - the customer is always right and they were hoping you would buy something! |
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Harris3489
Newbie Joined: 01 Mar 14 Location: Wirral Online Status: Offline Posts: 2 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 8:42pm |
yes some have benefited and some have lost but it is all pretty irrelevant as asymmetric boats will loose to symmetric boats on a windward-leeward course regardless of which sails its handicap better. the pys system is designed around sausage triangle courses so any deviation from this means the handicap system is irrelevant unless these type of course is used, now obviously no course will be entirely even on port and starboard tacks but some are horrifically skewed particularly on club races where mark positions are fixed and therefore limiting
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Medway Maniac
Really should get out more Joined: 13 May 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2788 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 8:45pm |
How do you reach that conclusion, given that the data is of all manner of races fed back by clubs? What percentage of clubs always sail sausage triangles? Very few, I'd suggest; ours almost never.
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Harris3489
Newbie Joined: 01 Mar 14 Location: Wirral Online Status: Offline Posts: 2 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 8:49pm |
"What percentage of clubs always sail sausage triangles? "
hardly any, that's the problem |
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iGRF
Really should get out more Joined: 07 Mar 11 Location: Hythe Online Status: Offline Posts: 6496 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 9:07pm |
Quite obviously, judging by your earlier comments regarding the Alto & 505, tell me, do you ever sail upwind to the point you have to tack? |
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Medway Maniac
Really should get out more Joined: 13 May 05 Location: United Kingdom Online Status: Offline Posts: 2788 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 01 Mar 14 at 9:20pm |
Lots of proper beating on the Medway, often inshore against the tide. But nothing like the beating you'd get if you ever dared show your face up here.
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Rupert
Really should get out more Joined: 11 Aug 04 Location: Whitefriars sc Online Status: Offline Posts: 8956 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 02 Mar 14 at 7:18pm |
I'm puzzled. How can the PY system be designed around Olympic courses if hardly anyone uses them. The majority of courses used would probably be all over the place club mark courses. Hopefully, with all the results, every point of sailing has been covered.
And no, a boat that can't sail down wind won't beat one which can. W/L courses for asys are deliberately designed to be tactical, not fast, and mixing the 2 types of boat in handicap racing doesn't work that well, really. |
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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yellowwelly
Really should get out more Joined: 24 May 13 Online Status: Offline Posts: 2003 |
Post Options Quote Reply Posted: 02 Mar 14 at 7:23pm |
Agreed- although some smaller kited asymmetric boats can blur that line- 200 being the best example imho
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