Two poles better?
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7644
Printed Date: 14 Jul 25 at 3:24am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Two poles better?
Posted By: NickA
Subject: Two poles better?
Date Posted: 10 Mar 11 at 8:03pm
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Went out in my mates new mk IV Osprey last weekend. Nice boat. Lots of string, but all of it well organised. This one is rigged with two manually launched spinny poles. Anyone know what the advantage is supposed to be? Twin poles which are permanently attached to the spinnaker tacks and fitted with self launchers I can see the point of. But two manual poles doesn't seem to have any advantage over one single ended self launching pole. Any ideas? Should he scrap one pole and invest in a launch mechanism (spiro etc)? Also, what's the procedure for gybing with two poles - presumably:
------------- Javelin 558 Contender 2574 |
Replies:
Posted By: SoggyBadger
Date Posted: 10 Mar 11 at 9:17pm
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It's all down to personal preference. When I used to race Ospreys I used one single-ended pole at a time when most people were using double-ended poles. The advantage of having two single-ended poles is that the crew never has to reach around the mast to fish the one pole out after a gybe but I'm not convinced you'd save much time really. I suppose the ultimate would be twin self-launching poles with twinning lines but the more string there is the more there is to go wrong which is why my personal preference is for a single pole. ------------- Best wishes from deep in the woods SB |
Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 11 Mar 11 at 9:42am
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Nick, We are in the process of fitting a twin Spirro and twin carbon poles to our 505. They don't seem that common over this side of the atlantic, however most competitive boats have them in the US, if you look at some of the videos on Youtube you can see how smooth and quick the gybes are with a twin launching system. We certainly can not wait to get the system fitted to our boat (although its BLOODY expensive) I think the secret to having a smooth system is using a 'Lazy Guy' system. Basically you have a sheet and a guy. There is loads of info on Sailing Anarchy. The parts for my system should be with me Mid-April, once i have set my boat up with the system i will happily send some photos. Twin launching poles seems to be the latest must have gadget for 5oh sailers, although as i understand it various twin poles systems have been around in the fleet since the 70's.
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-_xSnN2TuqKw/TWcs0lmGuUI/AAAAAAAAELw/ruzPgp5wPww/s1600/IMG_3755.JPG">
 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nys-EoL2D64&feature=player_embedded - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nys-EoL2D64&feature=player_embedded
Is a great video showing some gybs with a twin pole system. ------------- |
Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 11 Mar 11 at 12:25pm
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Very nice! Even has port and starboard coloured launch ropes .... I guess launching the wrong pole is a sure fire way to go swimming! ------------- Javelin 558 Contender 2574 |
Posted By: Mike Holt
Date Posted: 11 Mar 11 at 11:38pm
| Gybing with the twin pole integrated sheet and guy set up is ridiculously easy. |
Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 25 Mar 11 at 7:12pm
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Wow (youtube vid), you'd have trouble gybing an asymetric faster than that. Lot of string tho. ------------- Javelin 558 Contender 2574 |
Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 26 Mar 11 at 7:01am
| There's good articles on twin pole setup and spinnaker handling in the library of the Merlin Rocket class assoc website. I haven't seen a twin launcher before but am now tempted for the Merlin. |
Posted By: timeintheboat
Date Posted: 26 Mar 11 at 8:39am
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That does look a very neat system especially on the white spinny boat where the helm seem to do the pole leaving the crew to get on wire. How is pole height controlled? the pole seemed low on both boats.
------------- Like some other things - sailing is more enjoyable when you do it with someone else |
Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 26 Mar 11 at 9:03am
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Pole hight is controlled the same as a single pole system, the rope is just spliced into a Y shape. As i set the system up on my boat i will add stage by stage guide on my blog and post the address up here. I should have all the kit early April. Thre is no doubt that the twin launching poles are quicker and smoother then our current single pole method. Especially with idiots like us in the boat. ------------- |
Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 17 Jun 11 at 10:34am
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Right i now have the system set up on my boat, a few more tweaks are needed but essentially i am now ready for the nationals next week. I will get some photos and possibly a shore side video of the system up over the next few weeks. One thing i will say is from the drills we have been doing its so so sweet. The kite stays filled whilst gybing (i know it should with single pole but easier said then done) With the separate guy and sheet system you literally pull out the new pole and hit the wire probably 5 seconds between gybes. we were previously probably 20 seconds at best (if we are honest) but probably 30 seconds by the time we had stopped fecking about. Down side is almost certainly the cost, i have not fully calculated how much i have spent on the system but early fag packet calculations suggest around £750-800, which is obviously not cheap. We will see if its worth it next week at the nationals, bit worrying as i have not used the system in anger yet, i am sailing with a new helm with a complete new set of sails (from a new maker) so quite a few variables to go wrong. ------------- |
Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 17 Jun 11 at 11:44am
 ------------- -_ Al |
Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 17 Jun 11 at 11:46am
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Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 17 Jun 11 at 6:52pm
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Found a small advantage in twin poles the other day. On a run to run gybe if you let the main sheet out too early, the single (now leeward) pole gets trapped between the boom and the shroud. Then, when wrestled free, launches out sideways. Meanwhile, the osprey that launched this post has gone single double ended pole. PS: Ruscoe: isn't there some kind of "scientific method" thing in which one changes one variable at a time to see which thing is actually making a difference?  hope it all works!------------- Javelin 558 Contender 2574 |
Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 20 Jun 11 at 10:44am
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Well, we had a quick sail with the twin poles to make sure it all worked before the nationals (This week) and i am pleased to report it all worked chuffing well. New sails are super sweet, although require some different settings to find the sweet spot.
All in all very please with the twin poles, the launcher is a super bit of kit, well made and certainly worth the money. the separate guy and sheet system is very slick and makes launching and gybing sweet, quick and easy. A couple of small issues to iron out, but its certainly usable in its current set up.
Photos, Video and description will follow shortly.; ------------- |
Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 28 Jun 11 at 8:55am
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Well twin poles held up at the nationals (unfortunately some other bits did not) I must say this system is awesome. Single pole boats (be it launcher or standard push out) were loosing around 4 boat lengths (at least) ever gybe. Its simply unreal, alas even twin poles can not stop your brand new kite popping a seam on the last day, or the dog sh*t Selden goose-neck (two months old) breaking on the second tack 2 miles out on the penultimate day. ------------- |