Waiting for the stragglers?
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Race Management
Forum Discription: For race officers and competiors to discuss the topic
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6905
Printed Date: 27 Jun 25 at 12:09pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Waiting for the stragglers?
Posted By: ChrisJ
Subject: Waiting for the stragglers?
Date Posted: 06 Jul 10 at 6:14pm
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Is this a good race officer or a bad one?? "the race officer did the civilised thing and signalled a short postponement to allow the stragglers to reach the race area before the warning signal".
Discuss!
Personally, I feel that one a start time is posted you should get there at that time. If you are late, the RO should NOT wait for you (UNLESS all boats are late). If some can get there, then all could get there. There may be local variations to this: for example a queue on the slipway waiting to launch. But in general: waiting for the stragglers mean that those who planned their launching correctly are hanging about getting cold, wet and exhausted while waiting for those that didn't do their planning correctly.
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Replies:
Posted By: ASok
Date Posted: 06 Jul 10 at 9:16pm
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Agreed - race at the published time. Get organised and leave the slip in plenty of time if it will be busy. I'm not perfect and have been late on many an occasion, but am willing to take it on the chin if I'm late. There is nothing more annoying that sitting out there waiting for others to join the start. If RO's were stricter then people would start to get there on time ------------- |
Posted By: bert
Date Posted: 06 Jul 10 at 9:31pm
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Start on time every time - the stragglers will usually learn to read a watch evenually. After all I have been known to be late but I can`t really blame you or the RO for not waiting. can I? No throught not ------------- Phantom 1181 AC-227 IC 304 blaze / halo 586 |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 06 Jul 10 at 11:43pm
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Depends completely on the circumstances...
Unexpected traffic jams on the way to the club - wait. Light airs and ridiculous time to reach the start line - wait and send the safety boat out to give people tows. The job of the Race Officer is to provide good racing for all the competitors: its not to play some kind of schoolmaster yah boo serve you right game... If half of them aren't there then the fun of the race is diminished for the rest anyway. I'd much rather the RO waits 5 minutes and have everyone there rather than have the race/series/whatever compromised because half the competitors are missing. Its supposed to be a sailboat racing competition not a getting-up-early-and-boat-rigging competition. One person, on the other hand, well that's probably just tough. |
Posted By: ASok
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 8:01am
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I don't think its about getting up early and rigging to win a series. The race times at club level are either fixed permanently for an inland club or published months in advance for a coastal club. You can then plan to be there on time or not. I'd agree that unforseen issues on the beach or really light airs meaning that the majority are struggling, would need to be viewed and a delay might be in order.
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Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 8:11am
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We get this a lot at Hunts. The RO waits to sound the signal until people are on the water. In reality the sailors are generally waiting for the signal to launch (especially when it is windy) as the start line is generally just off the shore. I always try to start on time, as starting the first race late has a big knock on effect on the following races. ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: A Seabadger
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 9:09am
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Surely it depends on circumstances.
As a club we are trying to be friendly and encourage people to race. After all we are ment to be doing this for fun. I wouldn't postpone for 1 or two boats but often for various reasons most of the fleet can be running late. ------------- I don't suffer from insanity...I enjoy every moment of it. |
Posted By: bawbag
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 9:53am
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as said above depends on circumstances .
but
I've been to many regattas that it is impossible to get to start area in time left between briefing and start , especially venues with small slip access to water sometimes you cant even get on the water in time ! and thats with even attending briefing in pervy rubber kit and boat fully rigged.
but as for sunday morning hung over late arrivals (me ) tough ,thats what the discards for innit ? |
Posted By: Captain Morgan
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 1:09pm
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I absolutely agree with you JimC - We had one RO who set a line about a mile away from the clubhouse, which was a beat in about 3-5kts of wind. There was about 3-4kts of tide going in the opposite direction. The RO let the stragglers in the Laser fleet start late (>10mins. after the start), but then marked other stragglers DNC, some of whom started in front of the Lasers! Better judgement and common sense from Race Officers sound like the order of the day. |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 1:19pm
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Some places make you wait to be released from the beach. If the time between release and getting all the boats launched (maybe 1 or 2 at a time) and to the start area is insufficient, this is hardly the competitors' fault. If, however, a couple of people failed to wake up and are late, you just get on with it, surely. Anything between would have to be on a case by case basis. "Start and be damned" seems a very short sighted approach.
------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: ASok
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 1:47pm
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Yes, but if you're on a coastal club where people have been to great lengths to set start times depending on tide availability and people still can't be on time, then I think the RO should just start and leave people out. An attitute of 'the start will slip, so we can leave it an extra 10mins' just gets worse and worse. On the other hand there is nothing more frustrating than the RO not getting to the start and set up at the published time
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Posted By: bawbag
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 3:22pm
| you can always request redress if you don't make the start because of the race committees actions , as would the case of them not leaving sufficient time from launching to start time to get there in the prevailing conditions |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 4:17pm
I submit that should be a policy decision for the club AGM, not an individual RO making rules on the fly though. If the majority of the sailors want to start late and have a short race then why on earth shouldn't they... Who are we running the races for? |
Posted By: gordon
Date Posted: 07 Jul 10 at 5:31pm
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Redress can only be granted to a boat who's score has been made worse "through no fault of her own". I would suggest that the RO can get his redress in first by delaying the start when he judges that the competitors are not at fault for arriving late. For instance, I sail out of a tidal harbour. Predictions of the time at which boat's can launch are not always accurate... On the other hand one race officer went out, started first race on time, waited 4 minutes, noted that there were no starters so closed the line. He did the same for the second and third races and went back to harbour. There he found a few competitors rigging their boats (nearly an hour after scheduled time of first gun)... Next time he was RO boats were on time. Gordon ------------- Gordon |
Posted By: SymBoy
Date Posted: 08 Jul 10 at 12:55pm
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For open events it can always be difficult to predict how
long it is going to take to launch and get to the start area, especially if it is your first visit, so a little bit of latitude is needed. Perhaps during pre-race briefing, a bit of advice should be given by RO. For club racing there is little excuse. What would help would be an earlier warning signal (10-15 minutes before) as reminder that "this race is on time". If I hear the first hoot whilst in the changing rooms, I know I may as well sit out the first race.... However, at my club I have heard more complaints about the racing being started on time than late. |
Posted By: Late starter
Date Posted: 10 Jul 10 at 5:10pm
| More often than not common sense will point the way. Competitors are sometimes inclined to wait til they see the RO and team go out to the start. So if I'm on duty I make sure that me and my team are in place a few minutes early. Not rocket science, but more often than not it works! |
Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 10 Jul 10 at 5:19pm
The racing is run for the benefit of the competitors. If a significant proportion are late, there's usually a reason for it. Postpone. This argument applies when the start line is a significant sailing time away from the launch, not from a club line. |