Race Management: How may OCS boats make a general recall?

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How may OCS boats make a general recall?

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Race Management
Forum Discription: For race officers and competiors to discuss the topic
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6834
Printed Date: 28 Jun 25 at 6:20am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com

Topic: How may OCS boats make a general recall?

Posted By: ellistine
Subject: How may OCS boats make a general recall?
Date Posted: 14 Jun 10 at 11:06pm

50% of the fleet had an individual recall tonight.

Can that be right?

Replies:

Posted By: JohnW
Date Posted: 14 Jun 10 at 11:18pm

How many were racing?

If the race team can clearly see who is and who isnt OCS then I dont see a need for a general recall.

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Posted By: Lukepiewalker
Date Posted: 14 Jun 10 at 11:19pm

Depends on circumstances. If you can identify all the boats which started legally then you can justify an individual recall rather than a general.

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Ex-Finn GBR533 "Pie Hard"
Ex-National 12 3253 "Seawitch"
Ex-National 12 2961 "Curved Air"
Ex-Mirror 59096 "Voodoo Chile"

Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 14 Jun 10 at 11:28pm

There was one now almost legendary incident in an RYA Olympic selection trials back in the 70s where the Race Officer could readily identify the only three boats out of 30+ that weren't over the line and DSQd *all* the others...

Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 5:26am

Q: How may OCS boats make a general recall?

A: More than you can identify.

Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 8:04am

That all makes sense. It was 5 out of 10 boats so probably
easily identifiable.

I just didn't know if there was some sort of limit before a
general kicks in.

Just a shame we didn't know about it till crossing the line
an hour later!

Still, it was a good sail non the less.

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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 8:30am

Potentially it could be less than five boats even in a bigger fleet, if the race officer can see a boat is over the line but can't eaily identify it- that's (part of) why at major regattas you get a bow number, but also why people in big fleets, especially one-desin, will tend to have white hulls and no jib graphics. In a small handicap race, there's a lot more chance of the race officer being able to identify the boats.

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-_
Al

Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 11:01am

They had 3 general recalls in a row under a black flag at the Fireball Worlds, never seen that one before!

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Needs to sail more...

Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 11:03am

What happens in that siuation? if you're OCS under black flag and there's a general recall, are you allowed to try for the next attempt to start? presumbaly yes, as the starters can't identify all OCS boats?

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-_
Al

Posted By: Roger
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 11:06am

Originally posted by alstorer

What happens in that siuation? if you're OCS under black flag and there's a general recall, are you allowed to try for the next attempt to start? presumbaly yes, as the starters can't identify all OCS boats?

Not if the RO identified you, isn't that the point of a black flag?

Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 11:22am

Originally posted by alstorer

if you're OCS under black flag and there's a general recall, are you allowed to try for the next attempt to start?

Nope. If they've identified you and posted your sail number then you'll get a DNE if you go for the next start. If they haven't notified you according to the SIs you might be able to get the DNE rduced to a BFD under redress if you're lucky.

That's the point of the BFD/not allowed to start bit. It speedily winnows the fleet down to a size where they can identify every fair starter.

Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 15 Jun 10 at 12:58pm

Do remember that the black flag catches any boat that is OCS (ie in the triangle formed by the start marks and the WW mark) in the last minute of the sequence (making it easier for the RO to identify offenders).

If you were past the start line but were in theory over but the 'wrong' side of one of the marks you can go back and restart (as long as you did not cross the line if that makes sense).

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Paul
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D-Zero GBR 74

Posted By: Andymac
Date Posted: 18 Jun 10 at 7:29am

Originally posted by ellistine

Just a shame we didn't know about it till crossing the line
an hour later!

Shouldn't there have been an individual recall signal by the race officer? unless of course it was started under the black flag.

Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 18 Jun 10 at 7:53am

Originally posted by Andymac

Originally posted by ellistine

Just a shame we didn't
know about it till crossing the line an hour later!

Shouldn't there have been an individual recall signal by
the race officer? unless of course it was started under the
black flag.

There was and one boat did go back so I thought that was
that. To be honest I was pretty sure we weren't OCS when
the gun went off.

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Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 18 Jun 10 at 8:46am

Originally posted by ellistine

There was and one boat did go back so I thought that was that.

Its always wise to look back and check that the flag goes down after the boat retsurns. That way you know that there aren't any boats yet to come back.

Posted By: Strangler
Date Posted: 22 Jun 10 at 5:48pm

I have come across continental ROs on several occasions bottling out by putting up the postponement flag at 2 secs to the start instead of a general recall. Anyone else found this? Don't think any were under black flag. Whats the advantage?

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Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 22 Jun 10 at 6:34pm

They chucked out who they could see was over. Then started again! They couldn't get the numbers of all that were over, so the general recall was applied. After a few times people didnt push the line and they got the race away luckily.

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Needs to sail more...

Posted By: ChrisJ
Date Posted: 23 Jun 10 at 12:06pm

RE:>> continental ROs bottling out by putting up the postponement flag at 2 secs to the start instead of a general recall.

Sometimes (often? usually? occasionally?) the fact there is a need for a general recall is down to the Race Officer - e.g. too short a line or a biased line due or a wind shift that hasn't shifted back again.

In these cases, sounding a postponement, resetting the line, and starting again is entirely sensible.