Rudder Blade, broken? Wanted
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Repair & maintenance
Forum Discription: Questions & tips on the subject
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6490
Printed Date: 15 May 25 at 12:39pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Rudder Blade, broken? Wanted
Posted By: RS400atC
Subject: Rudder Blade, broken? Wanted
Date Posted: 26 Feb 10 at 2:15pm
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I need to conjure up a lifting rudder for another boat. In the absence of anything that exactly fits being available secondhand, I'm interested in getting hold of an old blade, perhaps even snapped, and experimenting with carbon and epoxy.... Any dead RS400 blades out there? Any better ideas? Cheers, |
Replies:
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 26 Feb 10 at 3:45pm
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Is it for another RS400?
------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 26 Feb 10 at 4:30pm
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No, not for another 400, a development class so I can concoct my own stock to take a reinforced blade, it does not have to meet SMOD rules! No prizes for guessing the class, I'll post photo's if it works well and hide and change my user name if it doesn't! The 400 blades are light and seem to be a reasonable section to be going on with. They are not ever so strong, and I've seen dead ones go in the bin, no use at the time because it would be hard to mend one and get it back in a standard stock. An old fireball blade or similar is another possibility, needs to be fairly deep, that's all.... Cheers, |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 26 Feb 10 at 5:02pm
[FX:sound of jaw dropping]They are? |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 26 Feb 10 at 5:15pm
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I meant light relative to 70's mahogany swathed in fibreglass, rather than light in an absolute high-tech carbon kind of sense. Seriously though, what should a top class rudder blade about 120cm long weigh?- hard data seems elusive! Cheers |
Posted By: oldarn
Date Posted: 02 Mar 10 at 3:25pm
Try DEM Foils on 07889159309 They have all sorts of spare/old foils ------------- thefastexcitingrunningasymmetric |
Posted By: Jamesd
Date Posted: 02 Mar 10 at 6:33pm
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Try nick, he broke one a year ago. may still have the bits. 400 rudders snap
at the stock all the time, i have seen 4 go in the last year including my own. someone must be too lazy to repair it. whats the class? |
Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 02 Mar 10 at 11:06pm
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Im guessing its for a Cherub?
Much as I love my 700 and loved my 600 before it, the one part of the RS boats that I hate is the foils. If you have a chance try and get hold of something a bit more sorted. Fireball/Scorpion rudders are good but possibly to long (makes downwind sleigh rides a bit twitchy), or an MPS rudder (difficult to find a secondhand one I imagine). As Jamesd has said the RS foils seem to have a fairly predictable failure mode. They crack just below the stock, moiture gets in, temperature cycles and freezing cause the glass to delam and eventually it snaps. We lost two this year at my club, one on an 800 and one on my 700. Part of the problem is that the foils are pretty much the same section across the RS range although there are two lengths to suit the various boats. The section is not ideal for the faster boats in the range, and the construction method is not robust enough (foam filled glass). So my recommendation is only to use one if you can get it cheap or free. Sorry Nick P ! |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 03 Mar 10 at 2:54pm
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No not a cherub, a Merlin!!! I'm guessing I need a fairly long rudder due to half of it being out of the water when the boat heels at all? I agree that RS foils are not as strong as they could be, they're also quite hard to mend if you want to re-use it in a standard stock. Having said that, my 400 rudder hit a submerged mooring very hard the other day and survived, with just a lump of gelcoat missing. But the broken ones I have seen are quite light on the glass and heavy on the gelcoat IMHO But an extra layer or two of glass or carbon might make a reasonable foil fairly easily. Or it might make a right mess. Cheap or free is exactly what I had I mind, might spend more when I understand more about the boat. I haven't sailed it yet! |
Posted By: Merlinboy
Date Posted: 03 Mar 10 at 3:01pm
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They are also Bloody expensive to replace! My mate hada carbon dagger board and case fitted to his Canoe for loads less the the cost of a 300 board! It also weighed less then a third of the weight! ------------- |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 03 Mar 10 at 3:38pm
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Cost tends to be insurance xs for most people. I think a 400 blade is £300 IIRC, a little bit more than a Winder Merlin blade. Quite a few man hours to make on manually from scratch, as well as the IP of knowing how strong and what shape etc. To be fair to the RS400 you have to consider the whole costs over the period you own it, on that basis I can't complain. |
Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 03 Mar 10 at 10:06pm
| For a Merlin, I would go with a winder Fireball or Scorpion rudder if you can get hold of one. |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 14 Mar 10 at 9:33pm
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Check your PM. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: radixon
Date Posted: 15 Mar 10 at 8:34am
 ------------- |
Posted By: sten
Date Posted: 15 Mar 10 at 9:09am
| why not get a merlin rudder blade? some one must have a spare old design blade they would sell cheap try posting on there class association site. |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 15 Mar 10 at 9:38am
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I would have thought so too, but the only one I found was promptly lost by Parcelforce. There seem to be several other Merlin owners who've only got fixed rudders also wanting lifting ones. Very frustrating! I think I've sorted a blade to get going with, but I'm still interested in a stock or complete lifting rudder, as I've lost a lot of DIY time thinking I had a solution sorted. |
Posted By: timeonthewater
Date Posted: 15 Mar 10 at 1:23pm
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Had a 400 rudder on my Merlin..they're a little too short for anything over a
force 3, when you're healing, and trying to keep the rig under the boat downwind. Big difference trading up to a Winder blade, lighter and longer, and enough "bite" when needed, due to the shape and profile. The 400 blade was ok for light medium winds though ------------- Too many toys..not enough time |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 15 Mar 10 at 3:03pm
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I was hoping to keep the boat under the rig! :-) What design of Merlin? Are all Winder Merlin blades the same? The lack of a website or any real info is a bit of a wind-up for a fairly expensive product. I should have gone to the dinghy show, but went sailing instead. I suppose with a raking rig I will have new things to get wrong, so might end up needing some serious input from the rudder. We're keeping the 400 for windy days! Cheers, |