Race Management: Changing crews...

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Changing crews...

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Race Management
Forum Discription: For race officers and competiors to discuss the topic
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5870
Printed Date: 29 Jun 25 at 10:44am
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Topic: Changing crews...

Posted By: Scooby_simon
Subject: Changing crews...
Date Posted: 26 Aug 09 at 2:50pm

Chaps (and Chappesses)

Where is the "standard bit" about no changing crews wityhout PRO/RO approval.

Is it in the SI's / NOR or RRS?

Had a quick look cannot find thr "right " place for this....

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Wanna learn to Ski - PM me..

Replies:

Posted By: iansmithofotley
Date Posted: 26 Aug 09 at 7:55pm

Hi Simon,

In Appendix L of the current ISAF rules, there is a draft set of Sailing Instructions named 'Sailing Instructions Guide'. The topic that you have mentioned is at 19.1. and states:

19. Replacement of Crew or Equipment

19.1 Substitution of competitors will not be allowed without prior written approval of the [Race Committee] [Protest Committee] [Jury].

So the answer to your query would appear to be in the 'Sailing Instructions' provided at any club, event, class rules, etc., etc.

Ian (Yorkshire Dales S.C.)

Posted By: Scooby_simon
Date Posted: 26 Aug 09 at 8:57pm

thanks Ian.

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Wanna learn to Ski - PM me..

Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 03 Sep 09 at 10:54am

Should this restriction not be in the NoR, because the NoR is supposed to contain all the information required to decide whether or not to enter?

The SI's are often not available until after you've entered.

In some classes, generally keelboats, it's quite common for scoring to attach solely to the boat and helms and crews may come and go during a series.

Entrants need to know what is permitted long before getting the SI's at registration.

In many cases class rules may deal with this.

Posted By: gordon
Date Posted: 03 Sep 09 at 1:42pm

All scoring under Appendix A relates to the boat not the helmsman. Indeed, except in the specific match racing rules, helmsmen aren't mentioned at all. The only requirement is that a person in charge be designated (rule 46). As any paid up member of the Crew's Union will tell you a helmsman should never be in charge§

If you have already programmed a crew change during an event before you receive the SIs and find that there is a restriction, you should inform the relevant committee immediately, in writing, giving the reasons for the proposed crew change. Except at the very highest level of competition I believe that permission will be granted.

Historically, I believe that the instruction was introduced to prevent boats changing crew in light of expected sailing conditions - having a light weather crew and a heavy weather crew for instance.

Gordon

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Gordon

Posted By: Timbo60
Date Posted: 14 Sep 09 at 11:22am

So, on that basis, is there any reason why crew & helm can't swap positions to suit the weather when sailing a double handed dinghy?

Tim

Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 14 Sep 09 at 11:40am

Originally posted by Timbo60

So, on that basis, is there any reason why crew & helm can't swap positions to suit the weather when sailing a double handed dinghy?

Not as far as RRS goes. There may be SI or class rules reasons e.g. helm may be required to be a class association member, crew normally isn't.

Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 14 Sep 09 at 12:06pm

Might run into technicalities as to whether it's the boat or helm that enters- or the combination of both. Having said that, I think helm/crew swapping over tends to mainly happen towards the back of fleets towards the end of regattas, and most people would I reckon not be too worried. It would be unusual for a team to be able to swap around like to any sort of real competitive advantage?

Most double handers though (I think) wouldn't specify which person on board has to be the CA member, more usually that at least one of the two is. I certainly know of boat owners who prefer to crew.

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Al

Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 14 Sep 09 at 1:17pm

I can think of class rules where the helm has to be a CA member. Not sure how common it is but it can happen.

Equally on longer yacht-type races it's common to have several helms. Even on something like Round the Island most boats will give the main helm a rest for a couple of hours.

Posted By: ColPrice2002
Date Posted: 14 Sep 09 at 6:58pm

The usual preamble states in accordance with the Class rules.

You do need to check them carefully. Normally (in the Dinghies I've sailed) there are restrictions about helm and crew changing places (with exceptions).

I think this is because a lot of dinghy racing (Open meetings, championships) have prizes awarded to certain categories (e.g. combined age over 100; best placed husband & wife; best placed non-married couple etc). If you change crews/helms, then it creates great difficulties with the awards.

Colin