Re-Decking a Phantom
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Repair & maintenance
Forum Discription: Questions & tips on the subject
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=5783
Printed Date: 15 May 25 at 12:57am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Re-Decking a Phantom
Posted By: hollandsd
Subject: Re-Decking a Phantom
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 12:32pm
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Does anyone have any useful information on how to re deck a phantom, the starboard gunwhale decking has started to delaminate and the foredeck is shot and i was wondering how difficult it is to do? Many Thanks Dan ------------- Laser 184084 Tasar 3501 RS600 698 RS600 782 |
Replies:
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 12:58pm
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Hi Dan, I'm fairly sure someone in the classics forum has done this recently, if not try the class association site. I am just off to resurrect the Phantom Menace... ------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: Merlinboy
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 1:22pm
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It should be fairly easy Dan, Most phantoms of you boats age have flat decks can you get the old deck off whole to use as a template? I put a hole in the side deck of my pld phantom (921) and although i had it profesionally replaced i think i could of done it fairly easily myself. ------------- |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 2:15pm
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Redecking is one of the best and most straightforward "first serious" boat jobs... Its easiest if you are going to replace the outer gunwhales at the same time, and although it costs a bit more in timber to do that it also makes for a much more satisfying job because it all looks so bright and new...
The lazy man's alternative is to glue the ply over the gunwhales, which isn't as pretty and leaves the ply edge exposed. Doing that you take the existing gunwhales down flush with the deck beams. What I don't like to do is to try and preserve the existing gunwhales, because you need to cut the ply precisely to fit, and its hassle hassle hassle. Basically rip off the old decks, then with a surform and decent chisel get all the old glue and remaining plywood off, finish by sanding smooth for a decent new gluing surface. Cut ply roughly to shape with a few inches all round. Apply thickened epoxy, staple ply down to the deck beams with a staple gun. When cured remove staples, fill staple holes and attach new gunwhales. Now varnish, stand back and admire with joyous feeling of achievement! Getting a really nice varnish finish might be the most difficult bit - at least for me. Too much carbon dust in my garage! |
Posted By: hollandsd
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 2:51pm
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what wood would be good for the gunwhales and also what is a "surform"? Dan ------------- Laser 184084 Tasar 3501 RS600 698 RS600 782 |
Posted By: timnoyce
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 3:46pm
One of these... Could try your mums cheese grater if you're feeling brave. I assume you do still live at home to have access to the cooking utensils to have such a number of boats! ------------- http://www.facebook.com/bearfootdesign - BEARFOOT DESIGN Cherub 2648 - Comfortably Numb |
Posted By: hollandsd
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 3:49pm
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i have got a few of those. i think i may give it a go, will have to find somewhere dry to do it, will have to wait till the moth is finished though. any more advice? Dan ------------- Laser 184084 Tasar 3501 RS600 698 RS600 782 |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 04 Aug 09 at 3:55pm
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a Surform is a kind of planing tool I guess...
http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=surform&meta=&aq=f&oq = Timber for gunwhales... Umm, it depends I think, I am not your most aesthetic of builders, and tend to pick whatever is both cheap and light. Pine (white), maybe with a mahogany capping (red) I guess... No doubt there are plenty of alternatives, and proper wood boat builders can ship in now! |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 06 Aug 09 at 6:25pm
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Jim's right about not leaving the gunwales - once I did, and never again. The posh boats (Solos, Merlins and the like) often use Sycamore for the gunwales, as it is very pretty. Spruce would be the lightest, and cheaper. Mahogany, or similar, the most durable. The class may have rules on hardwood/softwood in construction. Main thing is to get stuff with straight grain, or it snaps when you bend it. If you have no access to a planer/thicknesser, get it cut to size when you buy it, but it would be cheaper is if know someone who has one, of course. ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: tmoore
Date Posted: 06 Aug 09 at 8:13pm
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Excuse my hi-jacking Dan. Seemed pointless to start a new thread. We have an enterprise sat at the bottom of the boat park. It has a hole in the floor and a hole in the side (just forewards of the starboard shroud). Other than these the wood looks good (although some water damage). How hard would this be to repair in order to get another boat on the water for the club. Im reasonably competent with tools and woodworking etc but never done anything on wooden boats. Cheers tom ------------- Landlocked in Africa RS300 - 410 Firefly F517 - Nutshell Micro Magic RC yacht - Eclipse |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 06 Aug 09 at 9:57pm
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You need to look over the whole boat really carefully. Sometimes what looks ok is actually rotten, often hidden under layers of paint. You also need to work out what you'd have to spend on parts etc. There are lots of cheap Ents on ebay. Sometimes it's just cheaper and easier to get one of those. I am the voice of one who has had her fingers burnt doing up what appeared to be 'otherwise sound' (usually by my own heat gun  )------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 06 Aug 09 at 9:57pm
| Two holes and water damage - so probably rot... That doesn't sound like a great candidate to me... Its probably a week or so's work, unless there is rot, in which case the sky is the limit. I'd look for an alternative I think. |
Posted By: tmoore
Date Posted: 06 Aug 09 at 10:02pm
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No worries. It was not for my use. I was planning on restoring it for use as a club boat. Thanks for saving me wasting my time. ------------- Landlocked in Africa RS300 - 410 Firefly F517 - Nutshell Micro Magic RC yacht - Eclipse |
Posted By: hollandsd
Date Posted: 08 Aug 09 at 8:23am
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i have got access to a thicknesser, that should make it a lot easier, someone borrowed the boat yesterday and it sank on the way in... I think i now need the same signature as wings too many boats too little time.....
------------- Laser 184084 Tasar 3501 RS600 698 RS600 782 |
so it looks like it needs new decks sooner rather then later and i will remove the shoddy fibreglassing the orevious owner did in the cockpit.Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 08 Aug 09 at 11:20am
Oh dear, that doesn't sound like good news... I wonder if you have leaks anywhere else... At least when you have the decks off is the perfect time to deal with bouyancy tank leaks becuse you can get at both sides of the failed join and make much better repairs. |
Posted By: Merlinboy
Date Posted: 08 Aug 09 at 2:17pm
The problem with Older wooden phantoms is they are built very light, my boat was 921 and had been looked after all of its life but the plywood was falling to bits (probably cheap ply) if there is a fibre glass repair in the cocpit i would check for rot. ------------- |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 08 Aug 09 at 2:58pm
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Yes. In my dinghy source book it lists the weight of the phantom as 54kg, which is stupidly light for those days. ------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: hollandsd
Date Posted: 10 Aug 09 at 7:10am
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well, i will replace the deck and strip all the old paint off and try to lose some weight from it. Got to finish the moth first.
------------- Laser 184084 Tasar 3501 RS600 698 RS600 782 |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 10 Aug 09 at 10:13am
| FWIW I find myself having to redeck my vintage Cherub, so I shall document that up as an on line reference in redecking which I can point people at. It won't help you though as the target completion date is next spring: it will be done very much "when I feel like it"! |