Another 'vs' thread
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Multihulls
Forum Name: Dinghy multihulls
Forum Discription: For those who prefer two (or more) hulls to one!
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4060
Printed Date: 29 Jun 25 at 7:07am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Another 'vs' thread
Posted By: ellistine
Subject: Another 'vs' thread
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 1:32pm
| I'm at the investigation stage of buying a cat. I'm new to sailing, will be sailing out of Weymouth and probably won't be racing. I was heading towards a Dart 18 as it can be sailed both double and single handed. Somebody then recommended the Hobie 16 because of it's versatility ie twin trapeze, kite and that it can be sailed in a bigger range of winds. Is he right? |
Replies:
Posted By: Nessie
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 2:25pm
|
definitely
for fun sailing, not racing, the Hobie 16 offers un-rivalled grins it is also bullet proof compared to a Dart 18. Cannot necessarily be sailed in a wider range of winds, but is certainly more fun when the breeze is up, and far more fun in any waves or swell. you know you want one! The Dart 18 is the Ford Mondeo of cats The Hobie 16 is the Mk iii Cortina in full 70's Rally trim. The Mondeo will get you there (if you manage to stay awake) but the Cortina will leave you grinning from ear to ear, despite all the roll and squealling rubber! Get a 16 ------------- Nessie (I like cats, but i couldn't eat a whole one) |
Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 2:31pm
|
Loving the analogy! ------------- Finn GBR 657 - Blown It Laser 164635 Planet Earth: 30% Land, 70% race course! |
Posted By: English Dave
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 4:08pm
|
Indeed. Surprised a Hobie16 didn't feature in "Life on Mars" ------------- English Dave http://www.ballyholme.com - Ballyholme Yacht Club (You'd think I'd be better at it by now) Hurricane 5.9 SX RS700 |
Posted By: radixon
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 4:17pm
|
There are other 16ft cats also, so look at the Dart 16X or the 16CX from topper if it appeals The advantage with the D16 is you can reef the sail if you need to, something you may want to consider, and I don't know if the Hobie can but I am sure someone will know. ------------- |
Ha Ha that reply by Nessie (I will work this one out one day!!) was excellent.Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 4:21pm
|
So is a Rally spec Mkiii Cortina ok with just the driver or do you need your partner along side? P.S. I was trying to imaging flared wetsuits but I soon stopped. |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 4:49pm
|
The Dart 16X does appeal but it seems to get such a slating. To be honest it has everything I need. You can sail it one up (a bit heavy righting it), twin trapeze, kite, durable. I learnt to sail recently with Sail Laser and they have a 16x I can have a go on. I just don't want to get stuck on something that I might out grow a bit quick. |
Posted By: TornadoSi
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 4:57pm
|
We Import the Bimare X16 sounds like just the cat for you !! Check out Bimares websites to see if you like it !! http://www.bimare.net/17/x16.htm - http://www.bimare.net/17/x16.htm Simon ------------- www.northropsails.com |
Posted By: Nessie
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 5:03pm
|
i tootled about single handed on the 16 many a time. But it depends how
heavy you are. For righting as well. it's the scales, you know! - pun intended take the jib off and you're laughing. you will need two bodies when the wind is up, though. ------------- Nessie (I like cats, but i couldn't eat a whole one) |
Posted By: Nessie
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 5:04pm
|
the 16 main does have a reef point.
The halyard features a double lock - one for full sail, and the other for reef. (never used it though!) ------------- Nessie (I like cats, but i couldn't eat a whole one) |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 5:04pm
Now I know I'm new to all this but what's with the upside down pointy bows? My italian's not too hot so what other details do you have |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 5:06pm
|
I'm about 13 stone and the crew's about 12?????? |
Posted By: ASok
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 5:37pm
|
Dart 18 every time - but then I biased as I own one. They can be sailed in varying ranges of winds and have the best cat racing fleet in the country. I would suggest talking to Cat-bitz down your way and maybe arranging a test sail. For what its worth, the Hobie is great for surfing and running up beaches, but has limited appeal for me.
------------- |
Posted By: English Dave
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 6:35pm
|
At your weight you are probably too heavy for both boats - if you were racing. The D18 will hold your weight better than the Hobie. I'm personally not keen on either boats but they represent a cheap entry into cat sailing. But cat designs have come on a lot in the past 30 years and the more modern boats are faster and better mannered. You can put two trapezes on a D18. The mast is no weaker that the Hobie. Just not class legal, that's all. ------------- English Dave http://www.ballyholme.com - Ballyholme Yacht Club (You'd think I'd be better at it by now) Hurricane 5.9 SX RS700 |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 19 Mar 08 at 9:09pm
|
From what I can work out, a lot of the modern cats that are a sensible price for a first boat seem to be rotomolded. Would love a stealth but I'd never get it past the GF |
Posted By: TornadoSi
Date Posted: 20 Mar 08 at 12:37pm
All modern designs are heading this way, Capricorn,Nacra and A Class all use swept back bow shapes to a varying degree, keeps the buoyancy low down and as forward as possible to maximise the overall lenght. In short keeps the platform stable and minimises pitching, pitchpoling !!! The X16 is a very versatile boat it is very light, can be sailed by 1 or 2 people, the boat can be used for pleasure saling, training or racing. The class is really taking off in France and Italy and we think is the ideal boat to fill the gap between the rotomoulded boats and the likes of Dart 18 / Spitfire etc ------------- www.northropsails.com |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 20 Mar 08 at 1:26pm
| How much? |
Posted By: TornadoSi
Date Posted: 20 Mar 08 at 1:47pm
|
Ellistine you have PM ------------- www.northropsails.com |
Posted By: Catsrule
Date Posted: 20 Mar 08 at 5:37pm
|
Nacra 500 is what you want. Can be sailed one handed or two handed, kite or no kite, can be used for crusing or racing, and no boards to worry about. And they're very quick both upwind and downwind.
Heres the nacra uk website: http://nacra.chararty.com/home.php - http://nacra.chararty.com/home.php and theres loads of pics of them sailing in the gallery
Here is one out at weston sailing club, i'm was crewing on it in these pics and man was it fun. I helmed it aslo and they do go. ------------- There's no such thing as bad day on the water!! |
Posted By: English Dave
Date Posted: 20 Mar 08 at 11:30pm
|
Don't forget guys, that Ellistine has just passed his RYA Level 1. And if his GF won't let his wallet near a Stealth then the X16 and N500 are probably also out of the question. Spending £1200 on a D18 will get him in the game and give him a flavour of it all. It's not as accomplished a design as the more modern offerings but it's still quicker than 95% of monos and quick and easy to rig. ------------- English Dave http://www.ballyholme.com - Ballyholme Yacht Club (You'd think I'd be better at it by now) Hurricane 5.9 SX RS700 |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 21 Mar 08 at 8:05am
|
Exactimondo! That's brought me back on track. I was even starting to look at some of the monohull options - Vago, RS500 etc. Having said that, when you start looking into the costs it seems the mono's are cheaper all round what with the cost of parking and insurance etc. |
Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 21 Mar 08 at 9:34am
If you're going to compare cats and monos on an internet forum, you'll want this:
and this: 
and this: 
I'd back the Dart 18 option too, it's a good, simple, solid, quick boat. |
Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 21 Mar 08 at 4:26pm
|
Ellistine,
If you seriously want a catamaran that can be sailed on your own or with your girlfriend, and shes controlling the purse strings, I would heavily endorse what English Dave has said and get a Dart 18. If most of your sailing is going to be singlehanded then I'd probably suggest going for the Dart15 instead but they are slightly harder to come by. Regarding the costs, its a myth that cats are more expensive. A Dart 18 will cost between £1200 - £2500 for a clean example that will let you develop your sailing and be competitive at club level, and if you find yourself mastering it, it will be equally competitive within the national fleet. If you find a club which has a healthy Catamaran fleet then chances are you will pay no more to keep it in the compound than any of the dinghies. Insurance is probably cheaper on a speed for speed basis than dinghies, mainly due to the simplicity of the boat, I know for certain that you should get change from £200 whereas most RS600 sailors would be lucky to get much change from £300, and new covers from the Sail Register are pretty good and cheap. The boat is simple enough to sail but challenging to really excel in, and has great fleet support including a good association which publishes regular magazines featuring helpful hints. Regular coaching sessions are run by the association and the parties are legendary. What part of the country are you in and where will you end up sailing the boat ? |
Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 21 Mar 08 at 4:32pm
|
Sorry just read the original post, and noticed your in Weymouth.
Still Id go for the D18. |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 21 Mar 08 at 7:23pm
|
Thanks craiggo. All very useful. |
Posted By: ellistine
Date Posted: 21 Mar 08 at 7:25pm
|
and level 2. Some credit please!
|
Posted By: English Dave
Date Posted: 21 Mar 08 at 10:10pm
Whizz-kid! Pah. ------------- English Dave http://www.ballyholme.com - Ballyholme Yacht Club (You'd think I'd be better at it by now) Hurricane 5.9 SX RS700 |