Just a thought but I'll throw this into the pot and see what brews.

Going upwind is fine but I do miss the reaches downwind. Now, if it's blowing stink then downwind is great but in light or marginal conditions it can be a bit, er dull. I am not arguing that it diminishes the quality of racing - finding the side of the course with the wind and getting the best VMG balance between speed and depth is a real challenge.

It's just that I bought a cat to go fast and the fastest route for my Hurricane SX is a (true wind) reach. It's also one hell of a battle to keep the boat pointing high while staying upright. Where the wind is too much to do both you are faced with the decision of going low with kite up and then dropping it to race for the mark or taking the high route and hoisting later.

We all race like this every week at club level where the cans are fixed. And I was raised on triangle/sausage courses where you had proper gybe-marks. Anyone like to argue the case FOR upwind/downwind courses, thrill-wise?

(By the by - having read all the SCHRS posts, I believe that the Spitfire is the biggest bandit, numbers wise)

Agree with your view of the Spitfire, Dave. - 'nuff said.

Don't agree with the 'boring' up/down wind comment though. For 'older' cats designed pre-assymmetrics, I can see where you're coming from. The older boats were designed for all points of sail and reaches were invariably the thrill ride that we all remember. However, the modern generation of cats just don't go that well on a reach due to a combination of design factors. They're optimised for up/downwind work and it's the only way that they stand an earthly on h'cap.

The SX is an oddity though, because it's now not optimised for either style of course - and yet it still does really well round the cans or on an assy course. Maybe we're missing a trick or two here?

Club racing round the cans with the F16, I have a very tough time holding my time, but get a fluke of a wind direction that gives a decent up/downwind blast and it's horizon time! And you gotta love that! Having to think about downwind shifts, looking for pressure and getting the gybing angles right gives me a real buzz. Boring it most certainly is not!

At the multi lario on Como they sailed a rectangular course mile long true windward leeward legs but with about 1/2 mile broad reaches at either end absolutely blistering and bloody good fun (while keeping tactical downwind sailing rather than just reaching) if a bit tricky for the PRO to change the course if the wind moves. Not sure you'd be able to fly your kite on an SX on a broad reach above a 3 anyway

P.S. spitfire isn't biggest handicap bandit (you can increase the spinnaker by a full SqM and it doesn't alter the handicap ) then it would be ! We' ll see how they look in the spring once beam is put into the equation I'm thinking that is one number sure to go down

you can have your reach on the way out to the course

but a reach during the race, maybe a bit of a procession? and in light winds thats even worse.

nahhh afraid I like windward leeward too.

Maybe my Spitfire has it about right! not as heavy as your SX and not too light like your F16

" and not too light like your F16 "

How so? How can a boat be 'too light'?

Tell you what - let's suggest to all those cutting edge designers of C Cats, Skiffs etc. that they've got it wrong, they actually need to put weight into their boats!!

Have to say that after a weekend open of windward-leeward, or indeed sausage-triangle, I'm lusting after some real-world sailing on club courses.

Those open meeting courses just seem so artificial to me - feel I might just as well do them on Virtual Skipper, and I enjoy just being able to focus on boatspeed sometimes, not always having to look for shifts to tack/gybe on every leg.

Also, trying to weather a mark on a tight reach with the kite up is a significant skill totally untested by w-w/l-w courses.

It is if you get a big gust and "need" to bear off 30 degrees when on the rhum line....

Medway, I'm with you. Also, my total crew weight is around the 29 stone mark which makes the reaching with spinnaker a little more acheivable, even if both me and crew are trapesing aft of rear beam.

It need not be processional, Gary. The boat able to go highest will probably go fastest and then blanket the boats to leeward.  Loads of luffing! In fact I had exactly that experience against a 2-sail Hurricane a few weeks ago. I had bags more speed but not enough power to go below him and not a chance of going above him. Fortunately he was so preoccupied with me that he didn't spot a gust and flipped.

Last Sunday was club racing round the cans and two of the three legs were reaches one broad, the other close. The Toppers had a general recall, the Lasers started 6 minutes ahead of multis and so, by the time we got to the close reach all the boats were fighting on the same patch of water for the same clear air. Rock and Roll!

Trapezoid courses can be fun.

And Jalani, if your boat T-boned mine, mine would barely be scratched while yours would be a write-off. (I'd still put in an insurance claim though).

Classic misconception.

Heavy does not equal strong and light does not equal weak. But, let's not find out. OK?

seem to recall a discussion followed by a forum discussion (not here oops) that the spitfires had the better of the conditions and punched through the waves better than the f16 coz they were a bit heavier!.

point taken i like light too

I like light too. It's just that I'm not. So to be competitive I need a heavier boat.

If I was 11 stone and my crew even less then I would probably get a Spitfire. Never seen anything tack like it!

But the Hurri suits me fine. Cheap as chips, hard as nails, great in the big stuff, flat-towable and great class association.