Hi all,

Wondered if any of you have had someone try to pull a fast one on you when selling a boat.

Just advertised my hurricane on a well known catamaran web site's classified section. I have had a contact from a lady who's english is not brilliant but apparantly lives in bristol.

She has offered the asking price after seeing some pictures of the boat and is going to post me a bankers draft for the amount. Her personal assistant will then pick the boat up once it has cleared.

I know how the normal scam works where they send you loads extra then ask you to repay the difference, just can't see how this one works??

Just got a bad feeling but we will see what happens! 

Total Scam,

She's also interested in my Inter 17 !

It's a variation on the usual stolen bankers draft / western union thingy.  I'm bored at home at the moment so I've asked here to come and see the boat!

Notice she says she is from Bristol, but the email address is Yahoo.com.au !

Scam, same mail received here, of course that is unless she wants to buy at least 3 boats.

A 5.9, T and inter 17 she must have money to burn !!!!!

Same thing asked her to phone to discuss and to come and see the boat.

Pity really, would love to sell the Hurricane, need some new bits for the Tornado

any idea how it works?

had a chat with the nationwide. Allegedly once the bankers draft has been cleared 3 to 5 days then the money is yours.

I know of two different ways this scam works.

1: get your draft, hand it over and take the goods. once you have the goods, tell the bank that the draft is lost or stolen and they will stop the draft. Hey presto you have the money and the goods.

2: send a draft for loads more than the value of the goods in error  . ask the person to pay you the money back and then stop the original draft.

Just not sure how she will make on this one. Especially with my Hurricane. Only one green one like it in the world. You could never sail it in the UK ever.

Drawn of false accounts / other peoples accounts.  You get the "Money", they get the goods (and then sell them again V PDQ.  Owner of the account / Bank reclaims the £ and you have nowt.

Basically money laundering etc.

This advice from the Friday-ad.co.uk site:

Quote:

Classified Ads Scams

There are several different scams to watch out for but all are basically to do with overpayment for your goods. In a classified advertisement scam, a scammer responds to an advertisement for anything: a car, a bike, a computer, furniture ... anything that is being advertised at a reasonably high price.

Scam 1 - "Overseas Buyers..."

The scammer will express an interest in buying the item that is for sale. However, the scammer tells the vendor that he lives abroad, and that he would like to send the vendor a cheque to cover the cost of the item, plus an additional amount to cover the cost of shipping the item overseas.

If the vendor agrees to this, the scammer sends them a cheque or a banker's draft for the total amount. The vendor pays the cheque or draft into their bank account, and the bank clears it immediately, making the funds available in the vendor's bank account.

The scammer then asks the vendor to get in touch with the shipping agent immediately in order to arrange the shipment overseas. The vendor does so, and the shipping agent (another scammer) asks for their fee up front. They usually ask for the fee to be sent via Western Union to enable them to collect it immediately. As the scammer's cheque or bank draft has been cleared by the bank as soon as it was paid in, the vendor agrees to this, and sends the shipping agent their money.

The vendor is usually then contacted by the scammer, who asks the vendor to send the rest of the money back as he no longer wants to purchase the item. There is usually a hard-luck story attached: one common story is that the scammer's son or daughter has been involved in an accident or is seriously ill, and the scammer needs the money to pay for their hospital treatment. If the vendor agrees, they transfer the rest of the money back to the scammer, again probably via Western Union.

At this point, the vendor is unaware that they have been scammed. They remain unaware of this until the scammer's cheque or bank draft completes the bank clearing process - which can take days or even weeks - and the bank finally finds out that it is a forgery.

Scam 2 - "I've sent you too much money..."

Another one works when the person who has agreed to buy your goods says a mistake has been made and instead of (for example) £100 the cheque has been made out for £1,000 and would you cash the cheque and send back the difference.

The cheque will clear into your bank, only to be stopped/refused weeks later. At this point, the Banks/Building Societies will take the full cheque amount back out of your account. Not only will you have lost the goods, you will be out of pocket for the amount of their original cheque (£1,000) and the amount you passed on as the difference (£900).

Scam 3 - "Someone owes me money..."

This one works when you are contacted by someone offering to pay for your item in full. They will say that they are living in a different country but that someone in England owes them money. They will offer to send you a cheque for far more money than the actual price and then ask you to send the difference with the goods.

Again, the cheque will clear into your bank, only to be stopped/refused weeks later. At this point, the Banks/Building Societies will take the full cheque amount back out of your account leaving you out of pocket amount of their original cheque, the amount you passed on as the difference and any goods you have shipped.

In summary...

In all of these cases (and there are many more), at this point, the vendor is unaware that they have been scammed. They remain unaware of this until the scammer's cheque or bank draft completes the bank clearing process - which can take days or even weeks - and the bank finally finds out that it is a forgery.

You should, therefore, be extremely suspicious if:

• Someone responds to a classified advertisement you have placed and wants you to ship the item abroad, without even having seen the item. ....................... We therefore recommend caution when dealing with anyone based outside the UK.
• They offer to pay you the amount of the item, plus the shipping costs, and ask you to arrange the shipping and pay the shipping agent yourself.
• DO NOT be reassured if you receive a cheque or a banker's draft and your bank clears it as soon as you pay it into your account; it may still be a forgery, and if so, you will lose out.
• Someone sends you a cheque or bankers draft for your goods, then asks you to return the money to them for whatever reason, via an instant cash transfer service such as Western Union or MoneyGram. Cash transfers made using these services are instant, meaning that the scammer can get his hands on your money well before you find out that the cheque you received is forged.

Let's be careful out there........

What Ive done before is tell them to use your work email address to contact them and create a email address that looks like its from the serious fraud office or similar agency. 

Give em a scare!!!!

Always good for a wind up!!

Hmm, i wonder if there is anyway to scam the scammers. Could you not just accept their bankers draft, put it in the bank and wait for a couple of weeks before releasing the goods, and just ignore any requests to send money back. I'm not totally au fait with the sale of goods act, but i think only if the goods have been falsely described in the advert are you under any obligation to return the money, so whats the worst that can happen?

If the money does magicaly stay in your bank and the "assistant" never turns up you could be in with a bit of cash.

and pigs will fly , if this would work the scammers would scam themselves .

old saying ,if it sounds too good to be true, doesn,t  end with , "might be " !

The money won't!

At best it will simply be reclaimed (directly) by the issuing bank / FI and you will just see the dosh disappear.  At worst, the hevies arrive and "ask" for the dosh, and the boat, or you get wrapped up in a money laundering investigation, and that is really something you don't want ! 

Or you find yourself being extradited to the US

Funny,

No further correspondence.  

And I so thought I had sold my boat

seems she isn't so keen on actually talking to you.

Just a thought

Why not ask them to send money by "western Union " or F*k orf .

Because westerm union is the most un-secure method of moving money around.  If anyone (and I mean anyone) offers WU, reject it.

I was quite impressed though when i got one of these Nigerian Princes actually hand writing a letter to me in person, explaining their difficulties, and if i was able to help them by sending a bit of money to release their huge stack of cash that was sitting in switzerland, they'd repay me hundred-fold or something along those lines.

It went straight into the rubbish bin of course, but still i was surprised somebody had bothered to hand write two pages rather than copy and paste an email.

As a matter of interest, a scammer will never want the goods themselves.

They can't get rid of a racing dinghy for anything like a worthwile amount of money if they can't advertise it... even if they knew what it was.

well the scammer might be a sailor

I just thought if the scammers used western union as a way of getting you to send money to them, it was a way of transferring loot without recourse,if so  they would bolster their way out of using it to send to you.

Was really just another way of sorting wheat frum chaff , but these scams are pretty obvious unless you are an eternal optimist !

Nope.  WU allows the clawback of the cash very easily, you end up having something paid for (that is easy to re-sell like phones, PC's etc) via WU, and then a few weeks later the money gets taken back.  Avoid WU at all costs.

Looks like I´ve got another one. Guy called Adams from West Germany, wants to give me 8000 via western union.

Just by coincidence guess where I am today....... West Germany, so I've given him my office number.

What are the odds he doesn't call

There may also be another one signing himself the CEO and MD of CENTRUM COM INC.  Can't understand why the CEO of a major multivitamin company would want in an old merlin that needs some restoration. Let you know what happens

have had many scammers while trying to sell my hurricane and at one point had some dutch girl trying to buy my boat as well as 2 others at the same time-worthwhile asking other people on boats and outboards site if they're having easy offers as I think they just go down the list, percentages game, some body'll do it some time if they're desparate enough. 

hey Groupie bet Adams didn't call you, if he did can you sell him my hurricanethanks

P.S. Hurricane 429 for sale

No , funny enough no call

So same thing Hurricane 5.9 Sail no 485 is still for sale!!! Lovely boat green hulls, fast , competitive, well maintained etc

I've just had one of these guys say they want my old British Moth. I'm at the point where I just want rid of the boat to free up some space and i'm looking for someone to take it away for free. What have I got to lose??

I'm not planning on co-operating with them. Just thinking about how I can scam the scamers!

You're obviously not stupid so this might seem obvious but I'd suggest as a minimum that you don't give them any personal information and certainly don't send them any money. I doubt any scammer will want the bother but I guess it's possible they may have some way of getting back at those who string them along.

Otherwise, I would do exactly the same as you for curiosity's sake. Be careful and let us know what happens.

I spoke to the police to see if they could do anything. Their response was that this crime happens too much for them to anything. Well, that makes loads of sense!

"I'm sorry sir, we're not going to investigate your wifes murder because there's been too many people killed this month"

I'm going to call the fella saying I can't get to the bank (for whatever reason) to pay in the draft, and could he arrange another method for transfer of the funds. Tee hee.

Electronic, bank to bank transfers are the only form of payment we accept.   Under £5000, I will take cash from the buyer, face to face.  Even that can be iffy.

If you have time, have a look at http://www.whatsthebloodypoint.com - www.whatsthebloodypoint.com   

Also, here is a guy trying to sell his 59er

http://www.whatsthebloodypoint.com/mails.php?scamno=11&mailno=1 - http://www.whatsthebloodypoint.com/mails.php?scamno=11&m ailno=1

oooh and another one. Harold Kewell this time, wonder if he is a relative of the footballer

Real trip up on this one apart from the standard freight forwarder rubbish, was that he wanted to know the mileage  and the freight forwarder would sort out the DVLA paperwork.

Polite message sent back advising him to look at the website just to get an idea of what he was trying to buy, just before telling him to p*ss off.

Goodday seller.
   My name is Marris Williams.I am deaf and dump with a son(mark).I came
across your Hurricane 485 "The Green Machine"    advert  through searching
machine today. i will like to know  your least price and it full details.Pls
forwards some recent pictures  to me.
      I right now i am your country  for a visit and i will leaving by
thurday this week and i will like to come over to your location for
inspection and  also round up with the transaction before i leave.awaiting
your immediate response.
regards

Marris

This one is a bit sick, jump straight in there for the sympathy vote. Oh ok every thing will be ok because you are disabled and you've got a child.

Not very pc, but I asked him to call me on my mobile

be a real bummer if it wasn't a scam

Woooooow that's uncanny Marris wants to buy my boat as well that's two people fighting over both our boats ... not

I wonder who has the lowest mileage !

and the least impaired.

If you sell yours to Harold, I'll help Marris. I've always had a soft spot for disabled scammers

Just wish there were some proper buyers out there. I am going to get a genuine buyer soon and I will tell them to p*ss off if I'm not careful.

Marris is back. Tell you what, he's had to rush to Japan and his mate has to go work offshore, only got a cheque for double. Really needs the hurricane urgently and his shipper is ready to go.

will spend some time considering my answer

Good day sirs,

i hopes you family is well and your catermerangs are in low mileage.  I am writing you to ask for you to humply accipt the sum of 10 zillion groats that is locked awy in our class association funds in Lagos, Weymouthshire.

And when yous are board reading my letter, pleas look at this intersite on the webnet.

http://www.419eater.com/ - http://www.419eater.com/

Asuming you of best intentshuns at most times,

Dr. Fron Talobotomoy (A.R.S.E)