Boss with Carbon Hull???
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Banter
Forum Discription: For all those non-sailing related discussions
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1572
Printed Date: 15 Aug 25 at 2:20pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Boss with Carbon Hull???
Posted By: Jon Emmett
Subject: Boss with Carbon Hull???
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 3:47pm
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According to the latest press release the Boss features a carbon hull!!! ------------- http://www.amazon.co.uk/Be-Your-Own-Tactics-Coach/dp/0470973218/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1312565831&sr=8-1 - |
Replies:
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 4:00pm
| Well there's indisputably lots of carbon in the hull... |
Posted By: Isis
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 5:43pm
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Organic carbon maby?
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Posted By: Olly4088
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 5:45pm
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Yeah it is true the boss does have a carbon hull. as shocking as it sounds
------------- Phantom 1298 |
Posted By: carshalton fc
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 7:40pm
yer but that is the only way it will weigh less than a lorry ------------- International 14 1503 |
Posted By: Olly4088
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 7:42pm
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This is true if not a little harsh. I quite like the boss what else is wrong with it
------------- Phantom 1298 |
Posted By: carshalton fc
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 7:53pm
never sailed one but u can pick up an old 14 for about £2000 same price as a second hand boss and that will have all the stuff that a new carbon boss will have on it.  ------------- International 14 1503 |
Posted By: Guest
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 8:48pm
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I guess the interesting question is; what is the hull weight, or the all up sailing weight. Last time I helped drag one up the beach it felt pretty substantial ... Rick ------------- |
Posted By: BOABS
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 8:51pm
| saw the same press release which called it a skiff! that made me laugh more than the carbon line. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 23 Mar 06 at 10:55pm
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According to the Y&Y racing classes guide, the hull weight for the boss is 85kg. Although im not too sure how reliable the numbers are considering it says the mirror's main size is about the same size as a musto skiff main.....hhmmmm |
Posted By: Alex C
Date Posted: 24 Mar 06 at 12:37pm
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Topper have always advertised the weight as 85kg. Although I seem to remember reading another thread where this weight was questioned......??? ------------- |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 24 Mar 06 at 12:41pm
Well i suppose once u chuck up that monster rig, a couple foils, some racks and the rest of the rigging, the weight starts knocking up to something a bit more like the boss we all know and..... know.  Doug |
Posted By: 49erGBR735HSC
Date Posted: 24 Mar 06 at 8:25pm
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Carbon mast and carbon racks don't weigh that much, in fact the wings are super-leight as my mate had to repair his............. ------------- Dennis Watson 49er GBR735 http://www.helensburghsailingclub.co.uk/ - Helensburgh S.C http://www.noblemarine.co.uk/home.php3?affid=560 - Boat Insurance from Noble Marine |
Posted By: redback
Date Posted: 24 Mar 06 at 11:02pm
| Apparently the Boss is pretty much unbeatable downwind in sub planing conditions. |
Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 25 Mar 06 at 8:32am
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Still going to get their arses handed to them on a plate by a Thames A rater! Anyway the whole point of skiffs (and I do not agree that a boss is a skiff...) is racing them when planing!!! ------------- http://www.amazon.co.uk/Be-Your-Own-Tactics-Coach/dp/0470973218/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1312565831&sr=8-1 - |
Posted By: les5269
Date Posted: 25 Mar 06 at 8:52am
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I don't remember a Boss beating a 5000 in these conditions.The 5 is pretty quick as well in these winds ------------- 49er 531 & 5000 5025 and a mirror(now gone to mirror heaven)! http://www.grafham.org/" rel="nofollow - Grafham water Sailing Club The greatest inland sailing in the country |
Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 25 Mar 06 at 3:54pm
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By the definition of old (most dictionarys) the boss is a skiff. By the new 'like and Aussie racing dinghy' definition, it is a Skiff. By your own 'racing while paning' definition it is a skiff for much of the time. I am no Boss fan, but I feel some people are being negative about the boat here because what? It is a little bit slower than the one you sail? Why not bash the topper or Ent? At the end of the day, NO SMOD's are at the limit of development and having fun on the water should not be defined by a relative concept of speed. |
Posted By: 49erGBR735HSC
Date Posted: 26 Mar 06 at 12:15am
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We always saw the Boss as slow older 14s, the boats could never keep up with the 5000s in all conditions but maybe that was just in Scotland? ------------- Dennis Watson 49er GBR735 http://www.helensburghsailingclub.co.uk/ - Helensburgh S.C http://www.noblemarine.co.uk/home.php3?affid=560 - Boat Insurance from Noble Marine |
Posted By: Bumble
Date Posted: 26 Mar 06 at 6:45am
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Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 26 Mar 06 at 5:38pm
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I am sorry if it appears I have been too negative regards the Boss. It just seems a shame in a way we have so many small classes in the UK (where you struggle to get half a dozen boats at the Nationals).
I just feel it is better racing for everyone if we sail the same class (certainly a higher standard of competition)... rather than lots of different classes!
I guess my point is why sail a Boss IF you could sail, for example an RS 800. ------------- http://www.amazon.co.uk/Be-Your-Own-Tactics-Coach/dp/0470973218/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1312565831&sr=8-1 - |
Posted By: Alex C
Date Posted: 26 Mar 06 at 5:44pm
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Well for starters you can buy a secondhand Boss for a fraction of the cost of a secondhand 800 and get similarish performance. And as far as buying new, the RS800 was introduced quite a few years later.
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Posted By: 49erGBR735HSC
Date Posted: 26 Mar 06 at 5:48pm
People may sail the Boss instead of the 800 because it's a much cheaper boat and also they might be enthusiastic about their class. The best way forward for the Boss may be to hold a joint class association with the 5000 because the boats are similar on handicap. Once the classes are stronger, they could then choose to seperate or keep on growing together. ------------- Dennis Watson 49er GBR735 http://www.helensburghsailingclub.co.uk/ - Helensburgh S.C http://www.noblemarine.co.uk/home.php3?affid=560 - Boat Insurance from Noble Marine |
Posted By: Jon Emmett
Date Posted: 26 Mar 06 at 5:52pm
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Yes I understand the cost issue (hence why I said IF) but to my way of thinking it is it not much fun racing against 2 boats when you can race against 52! Do you honestly think the BOSS (or the fiver tonners) will ever feature in the "50" club in the future? At some point or another the boats will stop be raced actively IMVHO. Simply because there are "better" designs out there to be enjoyed! (Survival of the fittest...) ------------- http://www.amazon.co.uk/Be-Your-Own-Tactics-Coach/dp/0470973218/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1312565831&sr=8-1 - |
Posted By: les5269
Date Posted: 26 Mar 06 at 7:32pm
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Did they ever ? ------------- 49er 531 & 5000 5025 and a mirror(now gone to mirror heaven)! http://www.grafham.org/" rel="nofollow - Grafham water Sailing Club The greatest inland sailing in the country |
Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 9:28am
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It can be done with small classes. The blaze only has around 250 hulls built and they are regularly in the 50 club (57 last year I think). I think that the smaller assy classes need to do something along the lines of fastsail. It takes a lot to organise but as many people have seen the level of publicity it generates is amazing. I do wonder how much this publicity affected the new Osprey builder (whether or not he would be building if it was not for the Fastsail publicity and hence greater interest in the class). ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: Chew my RS
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 11:43am
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49er wrote "People may sail the Boss instead of the 800 because it's a much cheaper boat and also they might be enthusiastic about their class. The best way forward for the Boss may be to hold a joint class association with the 5000 because the boats are similar on handicap. Once the classes are stronger, they could then choose to seperate or keep on growing together." I am a big fan of the Fast Sail concept and would love to see it expand to other boat genres and to the way we organise club handicap racing in general , e.g. medium performance singlehanders (Byte, Streaker et al), single wire "skiff" (ISO, L4000), two-man hikers (RS400, 59er, Tasar etc), twin wire skiff (L5000, 49er, Cherub, RS800, Boss, I14). The PY system is much fairer when applied to similar boats like these, but struggles when having to equate a Topper, Tornado and Fireball. This is also precisely the reason I advocate a series of new formaula classes - see New Development Class thread. If Topper and Laser had worked together rather than competing against each other, the Boss and 5000 might still be selling well (albeit, now as a Boss Mk 4 and Laser 5006). Sailors get the latest developments and the manufacturers get to keep sales going by launching new designs without fragmenting fleets. Another example of this is the new Red Eye boat. It might well be 'better' than a Solo (it should be, otherwise why make it?), but how many people will actually leave an existing class to get one? |
Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 12:15pm
Exactly, it Red Eye boat is a good little boat. If it succeeds will depend on how it is marketed and if they can prise people away from their current boats. I chose a Blaze over the solution purely because the Blaze is established (and it looks cool too). ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: russell
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 2:34pm
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I raced against 2 solutions this weekend at the Exmoor Beastie. They look really nice, fast and light. I don't think they are really aimed at the Blaze market, more like the - too small for a Phantom, don't want to be seen in a Solo - market. ------------- Russell Phantom 1330 59er 090 |
Posted By: Olly4088
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 2:37pm
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oh russell little dig at the solos there now now ------------- Phantom 1298 |
Posted By: Calum_Reid
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 3:05pm
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solo sailors at our club get nothing but digs. Even from a guy who sailed an ent til he was 72. His exact words were 'I thought they went out with the arc' ------------- 
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Posted By: Calum_Reid
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 3:12pm
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ellie delete some PM's
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Posted By: russell
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 3:20pm
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ex Solo and proud eh Olly. I think they should do like the 59ers and minimum weight - Solos with minimum age! ------------- Russell Phantom 1330 59er 090 |
Posted By: Olly4088
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 3:41pm
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come on now people be nice. The solo is a good boat. And yes I am an ex solo sailor and proud of it. I dont need carbon and funny girly coloured kites ------------- Phantom 1298 |
Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 3:45pm
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The Blaze weight ranges from flyweights down at around 65 all the way up to lardy (Phantom) boys at 100+. It has a very big weight range and is not a struggle even when the wind gets up (aside from slightly high sheet loads). The solution I think is to encourage the heavier Laser sailors (Solo Sailors and Supernova sailors) into a Phantom training camp. They will then be fed copious amounts of beer, pies and curry until they can hold a Phantom down..... Just my opinion. Still think it is a good little boat. Were it more established I would have bought one! ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: russell
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 3:55pm
But you may as well have them the price you pay for them! solo's that is ------------- Russell Phantom 1330 59er 090 |
Posted By: russell
Date Posted: 27 Mar 06 at 3:58pm
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I think its a great boat and definitely fills agap between Phantom/Blaze and Solos etc. I wish Andy and Kev all the best with it. ------------- Russell Phantom 1330 59er 090 |