Race Management: personal handicaps

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personal handicaps

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Race Management
Forum Discription: For race officers and competiors to discuss the topic
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1380
Printed Date: 28 Jun 25 at 2:51am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com

Topic: personal handicaps

Posted By: gordon
Subject: personal handicaps
Date Posted: 16 Jan 06 at 5:02pm

Does anyone have experience and suggestions abouit seting up a personal handicap system for club racing?

We have small fleets, but mix from Picos to FF's...as it's not worth separating the fleet into fast and slow. We sail using PY. I can input the results from the last couple of years if this would help set the system up.

gordon

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Gordon

Replies:

Posted By: Garry
Date Posted: 16 Jan 06 at 5:33pm

The RYA website has information on setting up a personal handicap system based on PY scheme. Alternatively you could contact Ken kershaw at the RYA.

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Garry

Lark 2252, Contender 298

www.cuckoos.eclipse.co.uk

Posted By: iansmithofotley
Date Posted: 16 Jan 06 at 9:56pm

Hi Gordon,

I don't know much about 'personal handicaps' but I once made a note of these links, which I once saw, and might be of assistance:

http://www.threlkeld.org.uk/SailingIntro.htm - http://www.threlkeld.org.uk/SailingIntro.htm

http://www.threlkeld.org.uk/SailingCSFPeer.htm - http://www.threlkeld.org.uk/SailingCSFPeer.htm

Stuart Cresswell is an expert on the PY system and would be able to help. I have an email address for him if you need it.

Ian (Yorkshire Dales S.C.)

Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 6:54am

Originally posted by gordon

Does anyone have experience and suggestions abouit seting up a personal handicap system for club racing?

My suggestion is "don't". I did a couple of series using personal handicaps and thought it an exercise in complete pointlessness. I don't like golf either.

Seriously, just a personal view & your members may love it.

Posted By: Olly4088
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 9:20am

In my view its not a good plan. We had a couple of personal handicap races at our club.

You find that you will either make some one unbeatable or offend someone its a sketchy business.

You will always get someone that will win every race and someone that cant win for toffee but usually wins bla bla

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Phantom 1298

Posted By: gordon
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 10:07am

You all seem very pessimistic. Our idea is to award the traditional club trophies on a standard PY basis and then award an aditional prize for "most improved boat/crew" or something like that.

We have a few very good sailors who take the top places in every race they sail. We want to find a formula that will allow boats/crews lower down the fleet to have an incentive to compete and train. If we had more boats sailing we might consider a Gold and Silver fleet prize, but for the moment that would be too top-heavy for such a small fleet.

Gordon

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Gordon

Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 11:35am

Golf personal handicaps are just that. They mean one thing. Sailing personal handicaps muddle two different things, the boat and the people sailing it. I just found sailing under a personal handicap pointless. And generally in sailing, the same people don't win all the time. A good start, a couple of lucky shifts and the usual underdog can have his or her moment of glory.

Posted By: Garry
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 5:23pm

All you need to do is create a personal handicap for every sailor for the first series of the season and then create a personal handicap for the last series of the season (you do not use these handicaps in any races, just use the standard handicaps). Your most improved sailor is the one with the biggest difference between the two personal hanicaps, assuming you have roughly the same sailors and boats in each series. To complicated to explain the maths although the're fairly straightforward. You should be able to use a variation on the RYA personal handicap method. Essentially calculate everyones CTs then find the average CT round the course excluding any outliers. Then correct the handicaps so everyones CT = the average, you now have your personal handicaps. Repeat for the last series and subtract handicaps. You probably need to calculate the handicaps to a few decimal places to ensure adequate differentiation between entrants.

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Garry

Lark 2252, Contender 298

www.cuckoos.eclipse.co.uk

Posted By: Garry
Date Posted: 17 Jan 06 at 5:24pm

Oh - to correct for high / low boat PY bias use percentage improvement, rather than simple difference.

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Garry

Lark 2252, Contender 298

www.cuckoos.eclipse.co.uk