Have RS lost their Faith in Hyde Sails?
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12634
Printed Date: 07 Jul 25 at 3:34am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Have RS lost their Faith in Hyde Sails?
Posted By: JVSAIL
Subject: Have RS lost their Faith in Hyde Sails?
Date Posted: 22 Jan 17 at 2:15pm
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Two of the latest boats to come from RS (the Aero and the Neo(Only just been reviled at the Dusseldorf boat show))
are using sails designed by North. Which makes one wonder if RS has lost their faith in the quality of sail that Hyde are producing? The new RS200 mainsail was a prime example of this, with batten protectors in the wrong place and spreader wear patches completely missing. Not to mention that some sails (even ones coming out now) have the old RS200 logo on and some have new RS200 logo on. For now at least the "old" RS classes are using the Hyde sails but how long before RS see the financial gain of having all their sails come from one sail loft and force the rest of the RS classes to change to North sails?
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Replies:
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 22 Jan 17 at 2:39pm
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More likely cost and who's paying their far east cheap labour the least...
There are also advantages to having two sail suppliers on the go, especially if (and I don't know whether this is the case or not) you own rights to the design and have the master files for the laser cutters so could easily transfer supply of identical sails from one to the other. |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 22 Jan 17 at 4:45pm
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400 sails have been badged 'RS Sails by Hyde' as distinct from having a Hyde logo for some time now. I'd not be surprised to see the 'by Hyde' small print disappear. |
Posted By: blueboy
Date Posted: 22 Jan 17 at 5:52pm
Reviled. As bad as that? |
Posted By: JVSAIL
Date Posted: 22 Jan 17 at 6:07pm
Well yeah actually! Forget my spelling, in my opinion it is a pointless venture (no pun intended). Why do we need something in-between a Quba and an Aero? |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 22 Jan 17 at 7:39pm
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The Q'ba big rig never seemed to catch on, so maybe this a good way of using the parts bin to try again? I like the concept, the Q'ba is a great hull shape but the mast and sail somewhat let it down. I fancy a go, certainly. ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 11:48am
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I have a different question, who here actually does have faith in Hyde sails? Nasty things and overpriced. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: Dougaldog
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 12:53pm
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"who here actually does have faith in Hyde sails" Well iGRF, it would be hypocritical of me to say anything else than "I do". I was reporting at the Fireball Worlds at Pwllheli and was very impressed with the suits of Hydes on display there. At the start, I could pick James Peters out by his rig - not to mention the fact that he was coming off the line with speed and height and whilst I accept he's a very good sailor, you don't do that with naff sails. I've seen some good suits on other Fireballs and a number of smart looking ones at the 505 Worlds last summer, More recently I was looking at a very smart suit of Merlin sails from Hydes. Now I have no connection to them or any other sailmaker, nor am I in the market for sails this season, but if I were, I would be giving them a very hard look. D
------------- Dougal H |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 1:11pm
| As long as a sail doesn't have the Nazi SS on it, then I don't have a problem; but as for Hydes... I wouldn't choose them personally, but not enough of a reason to not buy into a SMOD which does. |
Posted By: JVSAIL
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 1:16pm
Interestingly I do and I don't. They seem to make very good sails for classes were you are not tied to a single sailmaker eg 505's. But when they are the only supplier to the class eg RS's the quality of the sail on the whole seem to be sub standard. I would guess this is due to when they have competition they make better sails so that you choose Hyde whereas if you have no choice they are getting your money anyway good sail or bad sail.
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Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 1:28pm
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I have a Hyde replica sail for my Blaze (and before we get into the replica/ripoff debate it was a very considered decision and I also have two new class legal sails as well, and unused Sobstad 'BlazeX' sail and an new North 'Fire' sail) and it's very nice. It was about half the current price of a Class legal North 'Blaze' sail and doesn't look at all inferior. If I start doing any open meetings I'll probably sail with the Blaze 'Fire' rig so I couldn't justify the price of a new North 'Blaze' sail just for blasting around Holyhead bay (and used ones are rare as hens teeth).
Intrestingly we have another Blaze racing the winter series at L&LSC, like me he's new to the class and has a Mk1 Blaze with a brand new North sail so I raced with the Hyde yesterday, I seemed to be quite a lot faster upwind but slightly slower downwind.
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Posted By: Cirrus
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 1:29pm
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I think some of the comments and implications concerning Hyde are frankly ill considered. Many, perhaps most, of the sails they produce these days are supplied on contract to trade customers who specify and approve the sails they order. If you are 'tied-contractor' you build to a specification developed under the control of the customer. Sure you may have had input to it but you don't ultimately get to decide what it requires. Good sails can be made on a controlled budget - but it is much easier if the working budget is higher. That is not to say cost-effectiveness cannot produce a very reasonable product and if every other boat in a SMOD class has the same it can't be all bad .... Always provided of course they have a long working life as well, and that my friends can be simply down to the material employed, Nothing necessarily much to do with the design or the build. It is bit like buying red wine ......... you pays yer money etc. |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 1:42pm
Well, I reckon this is how it goes. To my mind when you have multiple suppliers - competition within a class - its on performance and quality, and price goes up. But competition between classes tends to be much more on price, so for SMOD classes things like sails tend to be built down to a price. So if Hydes (and every other sailmakers) SMOD sails look more budget concious than their multiple supplier sails, this is, to my mind, means they're doing the job right. And of course "training" sails have only price going for them, so will be even more budget conscious yet. |
Posted By: Riki @ RS
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 2:32pm
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No we have not. Hyde Sails are a key partner for RS and world class. We buy thousands of sails from them a year We think its important, where there are suppliers of equal calibre, to 'spread out' a bit. Better for RS in terms of production flow, and better for the end user in terms of cost and quality.
------------- Riki Hooker Sales Director, RS Sailing www.rssailing.com |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 2:36pm
Very true. I have mostly had very long club racing lives out of the RS400's Hyde sails. The old mains particularly. A dacron jib ages like a dacron jib whoever you buy it from. However I have been unimpressed by the material in some spinnakers. I have ancient ones which have proved indestructible and lightly used, kept for best ones that really don't look good. But these are not the latest so I can't comment on what you'd get if you ordered one today. But a replica sail made from a brand name cloth would be a big temptation for PY club use. There is also the issue that over the years the 400 sails evolved, even before the vago-look facelift. The SMOD sails have little in common with a UK made championship fireball sail. That is implicit in the SMOD concept. It's a choice you make when you choose your boat. |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 6:51pm
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We have 9 year old Hyde Firefly sails, used regularly at times, less so at others, and they are still a decent shape despite being left on the boom or rolled in the boat most of that time. I like Hyde sails. ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 8:53pm
Well that would seem logical, but speak as I find I've yet to use a Hyde sail that is anything other than cheap crap sold expensively, RS500, Alto, RS100, Solution, all would be better served by a good UK builder, but then there probably wouldn't be a couple more margins involved. Lets currently look at my situation I need a new 8.5 for my Solution, £675 for a piece of crap, or considerably less for a full blown Technora lightweight or even less still for something made in the same material they'll use but with half decent battens and better patching and re-inforcing. Then consider if it were a full on race sail for windsurfing it would have cams even better battens be a lot lot more technical have at least one more margin and still be less. You dinghy world are consistently shafted over how much you pay for your rags and that is no mistake. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 9:21pm
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A 10.4M North Blaze mainsail is £850 (which I think is pretty expensive). A 2016 Gastra Vapour 11m Formula Windsurfing sail (a full on race sail) is $1300 so at present exchange rates that's well over a grand before you mess with taxes etc (most UK prices are the same in GBP as the USD price TBH). And it's 80% monofilm, a material that is 1/10 the price of technora. Sorry GRF but I think (and have always thought) that windsurfing kit was/is way more of a ripoff that dingy stuff. |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 9:52pm
| Formula kit maybe - it's at the bleeding edge of stupid. My Demon VG5 RB wasnt anything like that, and that was a piece of hand made in the U.K. design that bridged science, art and functionality perfectly. |
Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 10:10pm
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I bought several RS600 mains back in the day and all were excellent. In the RS700 quality seemed a bit more iffy. In the 700 I got a brand new main with the boat, but when I bought a new one 18 months later it was a totally different shape. In order to make it work I had to massively adjust my spreaders to pre-bend the mast more to take out depth in the middle of it. The third main I bought was the same as the second. So variance in the tolerances is clearly too much on One Design sails. Spinnaker's seemed ok. I had four in total and they all worked.
Would I get them to make a set of sails for a non one design? Yes but last time I asked they weren't interested in classes they weren't already supporting. Interestingly I have a friend who has his Hanse 301 decked out in Hyde laminate cruiser/racer sails and they are a thing of beauty. ------------- OK 2129 RS200 411 |
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 23 Jan 17 at 10:30pm
I deleted the bit about my Demon VG5 as the post was getting too long. Brilliant bit of kit, I still have the most recent one of the three 7.5 Raceboard VG5s I owned over 20+ years of racing Raceboards. I bought the first one in 1995 lightly used, sold to a mate when I replaced it with a new one (I was keen back then), and then did the same again to buy the one I still have. Then I bought that first one back as a spare a few years ago in very well used condition. In the end I gave it to the guy who bought my Equipe 2 last October for £20 just to get him started. It still set well and I reckon I could have won races at regional level with it. All big windsurfing sails (Demon excepted) are way overpriced IMO..... As are many dinghy sails.
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Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 7:21am
| You can always set up your own sailmaking business if you think there is an easy living to be made. |
Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 8:16am
I agree, Hyde dacron sails (red boat logo) used be a bit heavy but they used to last for ages and ages, far better than anything available today.
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Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 8:58am
Or make sails for your own use. I'd love to have a go, but it's easier to buy used sails from the big spenders. |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 10:02am
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The problem is unless you've used actually decent sails, it is difficult to comment and perhaps a bit unfair of me to highlight the issue, perhaps it's best to leave y'all in your reverie, but suffice to say there are better sails and sailmakers out there you just have to look, oh and ignore the silly class association 'dick'tat. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: Cirrus
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 10:42am
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The problem is unless you've used actually decent sails .... Well that comment is a tad patronising to say the least. Says more about the writer would be one conclusion .... How the hell would you know what others might have used previously. As for the comment about CA's keeping order - well not ideal to a small minority but the alternative model has proven far far worse. What exactly did happen to board racing in this country ? The bunglers involved in the day managed to trash a very viable branch of the sport in just a few years.... I'd argue that is exactly why you are now flailing around in a dinghy and not still standing up on your ride with the a load of old fossils continually banging on about "what THEY are doing so wrong" .... In the dinghy world YOU always have a very very clear CHOICE... If you don't rate any class because of its restictions then move to one where YOU have more freedom to spend money on whatever you want and with whoever you want .. or even to make something yourself that the rest of us will soon be gagging to buy ... er that is only a highly qualified maybe btw.  |
Posted By: JohnJack
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 10:56am
| I had a set of Hydes for a GP14 I used to own. Very decent set of sails. Lovely shape to the main which held through a blow or two and genoa wasn't too shaby. Red stitching too so really stood out |
Posted By: Fatboi
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 11:09am
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Always made decent sails when I have used them. Both in quality and longevity. May have required slightly different set up to another sail, but thats the case with all makes! Different set up doesnt mean worse!! Richie Lovering seams to make his 15 and 505 go quickly with them, so cant be too much of a problem and when Mike was there the amount of work and effort he put into the RS sails showed. I think they make some great one design sails!
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 5:37pm
I have eyes in my head, and have studied sails of all description for forty years now, will that do? I was also fascinated on returning to the dinghy environment relatively recently to note how little progress had been made since I left this world, in the days it supplied me high performance rigs of my early period which were CYT on needlespar masts. You of all people with that joke of a sail on the Blaze needed a lesson in rig design, which I'm sure North would have eventually delivered, al though nowhere near as efficient as Holmans rig for the Punk it did improve on those joke Elvstrom and Sobstadt things that were actually supplied in this century. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: Hornet
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 7:47pm
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I don't think there should be any question about whether Hyde build decent sails and whether RS have lost faith because at the end of the day Hyde build what ever the Customer ( in this case RS) ask them to and to a price that RS are willing to pay. The problem as in the 400's case is that the sails are expensive in the region of £1800 for a full suit which wouldn't be bad if they lasted but they don't. At £761 for a mainsail that I have had from new and only twelve months and I will have to replace it as the leech has gone and the sail is cracking, this is a poor quality sail and poor value but I don't blame Hyde as they are probably being told to use a material that's a £1 a meter by RS who want to make a big profit margin and get you to buy sails often! I wouldn't mind if I could get 4 years, but £761 a year is poor especially when you are adding a kite and jib every two years, it makes you wonder if they want people to race these boats!!!! |
Posted By: Cirrus
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 8:05pm
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....... with that joke of a sail on the Blaze needed a ... etc Bit confusing ... Not sure quite exactly what point is being made now. But if you say so - whatever 'it' is obviously must be true ... we bow to your superior intellect - that so few in our midst are capable of understanding or appreciating ! 
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Posted By: JVSAIL
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 8:06pm
It's the same for the 200, the old mainsail would last about 4/5 seasons (mines in it's 5th season and still going strong). The new 200 sails just don't last (mines just about done 2 seasons of championship sailing only and it's need replacing). Don't get me wrong the new sails look nicer and have helped the class appeal to more people they just don't last like they used too. |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 8:17pm
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I do remember the original grf incarnation banging on about how windsurfer sails were so much better and how dinghy sail designers were so far behind, without ever a thought that maybe, just maybe, the 2 forms of transport have different needs. Seems nothing has changed.
One thing I will agree with, though, the original Blaze sail was truly shocking, like it was made by someone who had seen a picture of an 18foot skiff sailing, drawn what he remembered a couple of weeks later on a fag packet and then got the YTS lad to cut it out. ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 24 Jan 17 at 8:34pm
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I'm still using white sails for the 400. The main was secondhand when the previous owner got it, I'm sure it would let you down at a Nationals, but it's probably cost me well under £1 per race already and has many more club PY races in it. The jib has probably done the equivalent of a full season, say 40 races? Not used in strong wind if I can help it, and we avoid letting the jib flap like the plague. It's not new any more. This time next year it will probably have the vibrating leach syndrome in more than F4. When I think it's my biggest problem, I'll replace it. An awful lot of classes where free choice of jib is allowed, you see a lot of white Dacron. |
Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 8:06am
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The simple fact is that those at the top of the sport - or with aspirations to be - have to buy new sails every year, and this has been the case for decades. I, like many, remember the days when we used get three-four years out of a main but i think that while the laminate material has changed and got lighter it has also got stronger and more resistant to cracking. Dacron is pretty much as it always has been. We talked about a dacron main to use at the club a few years ago but decided against it as all the patterns rely on laminate cloths. As I said before the physical life of my 199x Hyde sail was astonishing but it was rather heavy and in those days I was quite new to the sport. The main things that have changed about my perception of how long my sails last are my ambitions and perception of what a knackered sail is! |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 10:03am
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Clearly different folk have different perceptions about what is good about a sail and being the by and large bunch of impecunious tightwads that populate the dinghy fraternity, good = last long time no buy another. There is also the classic we're all sailing the same so it doesn't matter, so you get fed a diet of highly priced but cheaply built sails built for longevity and performance isn't necessarily the prime directive.
So when a connoisseur of fine sailcloths comes along then he (or she) is bound to be dissapoint. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 10:30am
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Cheaply built and long lasting suits a lot of people. Cheaply built, highly priced and short-lived has a lot less appeal. |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 10:48am
Gosh no, there are all sorts of grades and things. The last dacron jib I bought was such a rigid filled and heat tempered cloth that it split along all the inevitable foot/clew creases before the main body of the sail was significantly out of shape. Presumably the cloth was designed for classes that ban mylar, and it brought the same longer-competitive-life-before-stretch to the party that mylar has, but at the price of similarly early complete disintegration. |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 10:55am
you'd have thought so wouldn't you? But there we are again, the Laser, or more appropriately, it's gawd-awful sail specification, defying sense, logic, modernity and reason!!!
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Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 12:33pm
The genuine laser sail is overpriced, but for someone like me, the total cost per year is not so bad. Say I buy a boat for £2500, intending to keep it 4 years. Maybe I'll buy 2 new sails, keeping the best one for regattas. So about £200 a year? Maybe the depreciation is similar? When there's only one sail it's not so painful. And I might well get a replica for PY racing of course. The sail budget for racing a Laser at a higher level is probably no worse than anything else? If, like me, you are pretty careful what you spend on your boat, the availability of good secondhand sails is worth taking into account. It comes and goes with the 400, but I've had some bargains. I'd guess something like the Spice, there really are no choices other than getting a bespoke replica made? Once nobody is racing a class seriously, nobody sells on year-old sails. Or even usable sails. So the punter is left with a sound hull which would be worth about a grand if he bought two grands worth of sails. Even my 400, a complete new suit would be 2/3 the value of the boat? |
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 12:56pm
Very true, I might have buy a 'training spinnaker' for the Spice this year as my two genuine ones are 'strong wind' and 'knackered'
There is no class sailmaker for Spice anymore ('cos there is no class as such) so I'll buy what looks the best price/quality compromise. |
Posted By: Cirrus
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 12:57pm
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Back to the point .... well it is worth a try once in a
while If the customer specifies and buys sails ‘you’ would not buy
yourself well just maybe it is because it is not targeted at you or your needs.
Car producers generally produce a range of
models .. that cover a wide range of customer
needs – and pockets. You - the customer –
have choice ! Not a bad thing really
when all is said and done. If you want
to not buy from one sailmaker, well don’t !
If your class limits the sail design or supplier - you have plenty of choice to sail something
else. Don’t moan about the class – after all you have already exercised YOUR
choice when you got into that class. It is simply a ‘set menu’ or ‘a la carte’ choice – don’t waste your time grinding on about the restaurant that is simply offering a set menu. (btw - they probably don’t need you either !) |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 1:14pm
to extend the analogy (for no purpose other than forum titter - tatter), surely you are allowed to whinge at the management when there's nothing but chain restaurants left in your town to choose from because they've put all the independents out of business? I certainly wouldn't want to have to drive to Borough Market just to get a decent Burrito....
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Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 1:32pm
| The chain restaurants haven't put the independents out of business. 'Twas the customers who went to them who did that. |
Posted By: Cirrus
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 2:46pm
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Twas the customers who went to them who did that. Exactly ... you makes your choice and ..... Moaning rights don't always come as easily afterwards ! But then I can't totally agree with Jim - the SMOD movement started way back with the Mirror and Laser and to a lesser extent later on with the Topper - were these classes the thin edge of the wedge as well ? I'd argue as readily that these classes and later still the RS ones maintained dinghy racing at affordable mass market levels... Want an example ? .... it perhaps needed the ISO etc to keep the Fireball 'honest' surely (ie to exert downward pressure to remain affordable as an overall package)... If you don't have these competitive and market influences this sport can get to be run by a small racing fanatic elite - who always tend to want 'better' kit as well as telling the rest of us what WE should be doing. Just look at what 'they' managed in such a short period with board racing. Against all odds they snatched 'fast decline' from the jaws of 'wild success' as quick as something very quick.... They are probably still wondering what went so wrong - well they would I guess. Real choice in most markets can be crude and result in some unforeseen outcomes (or ones YOU simply don't like).... the alternatives are however generally far worse. We have plenty of choice in dinghy sailing and classes for just about every type of sailor and personality. Enjoy. |
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 3:11pm
I have only two words to say about the decline of Windsurf racing "Formula Windsurfing" a blind alley if ever there was one......
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 4:07pm
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Windsurfing still has big classes, they just don't sail on your ponds, and here in the UK they lost interest in the RYA and getting dubious service from racing at sailing clubs so went UDI. It is only this country that killed windsurfing at club level, it's still alive and very well in Holland, Sweden had a resurgence with the Kona Class, the Techno class has huge fleets in France and the RSX Globally is still working.
Windsurfers,rather like myself, do have a 'thing' about authoritarianism, OK you lot live with it and let yourself be serfs to RYA authority, let yourself get hauled up before the disciplinary committee for sailing 'too fast' through the moorings, let your kids get abused at squad training. That's fine, your choice, mine now I'm old enough to tolerate the predictability of dinghy world stupidity, but it won't stop me trying to open your eyes to when you're being 'worked' over. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 4:22pm
In the UK the biggest fleet is now Techno's with 49 achieving a ranking in 2016 followed by 34 Raceboards. Only 7 RSXs and 7 FW completed enough events to get a result. I won't say "I told you so" 15+ years ago 
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Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 4:36pm
fair point - but these things tend go with notions of critical mass and quite often, some chain restaurants aren't playing on a level playing field... e.g. corporation tax, business rate relief, franchising and licensing etc It's as if, someone like a World Restaurant Council, decided to promote just 5 different restaurants- awarding the best diners with gold, silver and bronze lollies for clearing their plates quickly; knowing full well most of us could only afford one option.... it kills the indies. I've seen Demolition Man, I really don't fancy only eating out at Taco Bell in the future. [TUBE]gpRzusd9Yi8[/TUBE]
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Posted By: Cirrus
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 4:39pm
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The 'board racing' segment effectively killed itself way back at a peak of
success - aided by UKBSA, the board 'press' and a manufacturing oriented elite
who constantly changed what passed as the sport - It had very little at all to
do with the existing sailing clubs who generally rather appreciated the additional
income - despite the urban myth circulated that most clubs not being
interested in boards. Mass participation in board racing died ... too easily done and encouraged by those who should have known better - but did not. |
Posted By: Fatboi
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 4:48pm
| I think the Finns are ok, with over 300 boats at the masters worlds last year and over 200 boats at the worlds in 2015... |
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 5:04pm
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And raceboards are experiencing a bit of a resurgence too (though they'll never achieve pre FW levels). I was pumping around courses on typical regional inland events into my mid 50's and didn't stop because of the pumping but due to personal circumstance changing. There are still pockets of 7.5 RB with reasonable club racing up here in the NW, (I would not be racing 9.5 RB, far too much like hard work). I'm definitely not advocating unlimited dynamics in dinghies though (but I'm now in my mid 60s and have lost some fitness in the intervening years......).
I do agree that the UKBSA/IYRU shot the sport in the foot several times over the years and I was never a fan of the RYA when it came to their windsurfing policy.
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Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 5:33pm
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Boardsailing also just plain old went out of fashion. It became something that 30-somethings did and the 20-somethings went and did other things instead. Most people I knew who were very keen to spend all their cash on boards in the late 80s and early 90s were not at all interested in racing or competitions. For most of the board buying public it never was anything like dinghy racing. The board racing club at Southsea were seen as a weird minority by most of the youngish single blokes with boards on the roof of their car at the place I worked. (Not far from Hayling.) A windy afternoon would cause half the blokes in the office to take a half day holiday, then come in the day after talking bollux about how monstrous it was. Fun times. It partly just burned itself out as people got competent, got bored of simply sailing around aimlessly and only wanted to go out in progressively more wind. At its peak, it was nothing like dinghy racing for 90% of the participants. More like skiing perhaps, except most people have their skiing rationed and never get enough to get bored of it? |
Posted By: Sam.Spoons
Date Posted: 25 Jan 17 at 6:03pm
| That's probably right, fun times indeed. Only 10% of the windsurfing club I was a member of for best part of 25 years (and chairman of for 13 of those) raced. Despite that we did produce two olympic hopefuls (both training partners of the sailors who did go on to make it to the Olympics), one 'nearly pro' wave/freestyle sailor, a Raceboard World and multiple National Champion (and a kitesurfing Masters National Champion, though I'm not sure I should add that). Racing declined and stopped at that club as a consequence of FW becoming the new game in town. |