Laser Building/Builders
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12371
Printed Date: 07 Jul 25 at 7:39pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Laser Building/Builders
Posted By: JimC
Subject: Laser Building/Builders
Date Posted: 23 Apr 16 at 5:05pm
|
Looks as if Lasers are going to be built in the Far East. See this:
http://us12.campaign-archive1.com/?u=03f9cad9b1e0946205195ce4a&id=f07db184a4&e=174790523f" rel="nofollow - http://us12.campaign-archive1.com/?u=03f9cad9b1e0946205195ce4a&id=f07db184a4&e=174790523f An Interesting paragraph is this one:
I (and others) presume that's a mistake and they mean resin infused, but if so it reveals quite a level of ignorance in management... |
Replies:
Posted By: Daniel Holman
Date Posted: 23 Apr 16 at 7:57pm
| Yep that release is laced with US business school parlance and displays a complete lack of understanding of the golden geese that they continue to strangle. |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 24 Apr 16 at 2:10pm
| Seems I maligned them. There are now techniques of injection moulding for glass fibre. Means a serious investment in tooling I think. |
Posted By: Daniel Holman
Date Posted: 24 Apr 16 at 2:28pm
|
Resin transfer moulding? A la Aero. Means a change to laser construction manual which sounds dodgy but A and B mould tools in aluminium is easily amortisable when you are doing 2000ish laser 1s a year with a colossal profit margin, and driving the manhour element down to maybe 10 - cheap in China for the time being! |
Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 25 Apr 16 at 12:00pm
| It sounds like they're only doing it for the Sunfish, z420 and CFJ (whatever that is) |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 25 Apr 16 at 1:08pm
| AIUI z420 and CFJ are heavy detuned versions of the 420 and Flying Junior. The US market is strange! I get the impression its driven by the US college sailing market, in which it seems the boats are not maintained by the students, but instead by college employees. This means the college employees have a strong motivation to select boats that even the most ham handed students have trouble breaking. |
Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 1:39pm
This is exactly correct; this pretty much represents dinghy sailing in the USA. There are a few pockets of performance dinghy sailors as we would know them but they are few & far between and are the odd ones out. When you leave college you go into keelboat sailing; after all dinghy sailing is just for poor people who cant afford a keelboat ... As for injection moulding 420s etc sound odd; the only injection moulded boat I know of is the Topper. The rest are roto moulded. I have never heard of injection moulding with glass fibre so it sounds wrong to me... maybe for small items like this. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBhkLuXZzCc |
Posted By: piglet
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 2:00pm
| If the reinforcement goes in with the resin it's injection, if the reinfocement is placed in beforehand it's infusion. |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 2:06pm
if you hung around SA you'd probably be surprised by the numbers of Aeros being sold over there.... several hundred on the west coast apparently. And definitely one in Texas....
|
Posted By: iiiiticki
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 2:57pm
| Was not 'injection' not going to be the build process for the 'Project X' ? |
Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 3:51pm
Yeah right ... just like all the RS100s sold in the UK that never turned out for anything ... http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/class/RS100/attendance |
Posted By: PeterG
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 3:57pm
|
Yeah right ... just like all the RS100s sold in the UK that never turned out for anything ...
Not turning up to nationals doesn't mean no one is using them - who knows they might even be taking part in handicap racing  ------------- Peter Ex Cont 707 Ex Laser 189635 DY 59 |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 4:01pm
pah, what are talking about.... there was almost double figures at the RS100 sprints last weekend.
 |
Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 4:07pm
The point is there were claims of significant numbers of boats sold... where are they all. Yes the nationals is only one metric but I am sure JimC can tell us how many PY returns were done.
|
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 4:22pm
|
with respect to JimC, it's available for even the ill-informed like me to look up.... 725 in 2015 across both rigs (excludes the third rig no one knows exists and doesn't have a PY anyway) The D-One got less than 30% of that number at 215. For comparison, the MPS returned 601, and the 700 got 749; so arguably, in handicap racing returns, the RS boats are still like-for-like more popular than alternatives from other yards. they're a brand that ride the zeitgeist though... and with the asymmetric bubble finally burst, it's no surprise that the Aero exceeded all the above with a combined 1132 from the 7 & 9 rig. Unarigs are back en vogue... with a vengeance. |
Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 4:25pm
Perhaps because they don't get any fleet racing so are consigned to PY ...
|
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 4:28pm
Numbers are on the Published PY list. The 8.4 is in the same sort of region as the Vareo and RS600, the 10.2 near the bottom of the list a bit below the D-One. Certainly appears as if the worlds isn't madly enthused about sit-out singlehanders with kites. The RS700 and then the Musto Skiff still appear to be the most frequently sailed spinnaker singlehanders. |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 4:28pm
point taken...
 |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 26 Apr 16 at 4:30pm
you would be well within the realms of acceptability to crow 'I told you so' at this juncture Jim...
 |
Posted By: getafix
Date Posted: 29 Apr 16 at 6:23am
| numbers of returns shouldn't be miss-used as an indicator of whether or not a certain design / rig type was "right or wrong" - by that metric nothing much has happened that is "right" in dinghy design or rig development since the Optimist, Mirror, topper and L*ser came out |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 29 Apr 16 at 10:19am
Think you're the only person saying "right or wrong". As an index of activity its useful. Activity is only one index. By turnover (=activity) McMorons is the most popular restaurant chain in the country, but they sure as hell don't sell the best food. |
Posted By: turnturtle
Date Posted: 29 Apr 16 at 10:38am
they don't sell the worst either, not by a long shot.... nutritionally and ethically speaking. Taste after all, is personal preference.
|
Posted By: iiiiticki
Date Posted: 29 Apr 16 at 11:53am
I have been a supporter of McD's as long as they have had a presence in this country. They are not evil purveyors of death. In moderation they are just food like any other food and they have their place in the World specifically when travelling from place to place. Try some other affordable food for travelers!
|