Racing Rules: Rule 15

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Rule 15

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Racing Rules
Forum Discription: Discuss the rules and your interpretations here
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11935
Printed Date: 27 Jun 25 at 10:46pm
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Topic: Rule 15

Posted By: limey
Subject: Rule 15
Date Posted: 26 Mar 15 at 9:43pm

Having just read Mark Rushalls pre race rule explanation in Y & Y i wondered if someone could clarify something. The situation is as follows; i am lining up on starboard in the last minute before the start. As I'm close to the line i am virtually stationary with sails flapping- A boat approaches from behind and leeward and establishes an overlap. According to rule 15 he has to give me the opportunity to keep clear : However as a boat with a long narrow keel/centreboard i can't sheet in otherwise i will drift sideways and touch the boat to leeward ; and without any forward momentum i can't tack, So my only option would be to bear away but i can't because he is now occupying the space. So my question is what are my alternatives and what exactly entitlement does Rule 15 give me ??

Replies:

Posted By: Quagers
Date Posted: 26 Mar 15 at 10:47pm

Basically go head to wind as much as you can and wait for him to go away, if you genuinely can't sheet in or tack without hitting him then you are protected under 15.

Posted By: Presuming Ed
Date Posted: 27 Mar 15 at 9:08am

<Pedant point> He has to give you room to keep clear, not opportunity. Room & keep clear are defined. </Pp>

15 ACQUIRING RIGHT OF WAY When a boat acquires right of way, she shall initially give the other boat room to keep clear, unless she acquires right of way because of the other boat’s actions.

Keep Clear A boat keeps clear of a right-of-way boat (a) if the right-of-way boat can sail her course with no need to take avoiding action and, (b) when the boats are overlapped, if the right-of-way boat can also change course in both directions without immediately making contact.

Room The space a boat needs in the existing conditions, including space to comply with her obligations under the rules of Part 2 and rule 31, while manoeuvring promptly in a seamanlike way.

The other boat's status changes from clear astern, give way, to leeward, RoW. As he has acquired RoW through his own actions, 15 applies to him. If you don't have enough room to manoeuvre promptly in a seamanlike way, then he hasn't given you room (as defined), and has broken 15. You don't have to anticipate his acquisition of RoW.

Basically, you are completely, 100%, utterly bambi. See Q&A B6 Situation 3.

http://www.sailing.org/tools/documents/QABookletMarch102015-[18612].pdf

He should bear away as soon as he hooks you, to give you the room you need to keep clear.

You have two options: do something to try and keep clear: the application of 64.1.a should exonerate you if you fail to keep clear & there's a protest.

Do nothing, and trust to the application of 15 in a protest. Option 1 is probably safer.

Posted By: gordon
Date Posted: 27 Mar 15 at 6:00pm

You have to do something, as keep clear you must take some action to keep clear. If you take a seamanlike action, like sheeting in but slipping sideways, or bearing away to close hauled, or luffing as you sheet i, and despite this there is contact then the other boat has broken rule 15.

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Gordon

Posted By: Jon Meadowcroft
Date Posted: 29 Mar 15 at 10:00am

Disagree that you must do something.

The requirement is to keep clear. Otherwise the rule would say if the situation happened "you must do something"!

You might not need to do anything to keep clear. Certainly if you decide to pull your sails in in the knowledge that you will go sideways then you are not going to keep clear. This is about racing rather than being seamanlike.

The error was being early and you have to take the consequences. Essentially this is allowing the other boat to start, and anyone else to leeward of them. To avoid a collision because you think that you might touch you might volunteer to take a penalty. That is your alternative in my view.

Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 29 Mar 15 at 10:21am

The trouble with this rule is it does give licence to people to barge in. You see quite frequently at opens people who are late going into gaps that they can't even fit into and the windward boat has nowhere to go.

No, they have not given room and opportunity but how do you prove this? The windward boat is always going to have the burden of proof and in the rough and tumble of a crowded start line you'll be lucky to find a decent witness.

It doesn't give rise to protests very often, but it does cause a lot of general recalls.

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Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 29 Mar 15 at 10:55am

Originally posted by Paramedic

The trouble with this rule is it does give licence to people to barge in.

Is that a bad thing?

I must confess I really don't like way these days everyone hovers on the start line way before the start with considerably reduced control. I think I'd rather see boats travelling close to speed approaching the start line from a distance. Obviously under current rules this isn't really an option, especially in large fleets and even more especially one class fleets.

In mixed fleets you get problems with boats with big foils that will hold station, and boats with smaller foils that will simply stall out and go sideways.

I don't have an answer on how the rules could be rewritten to change things, but I think it would be a bad thing to strengthen the rights of the windward boat because then you'd be even more prone to have a packed mass of boats racked up for minutes before the start, all almost stationary and with minimal control, and that, I think, would be even worse than the current situation.

Posted By: Presuming Ed
Date Posted: 29 Mar 15 at 11:54am

<cough>Sail a keelboat</cough>

Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 29 Mar 15 at 3:59pm

The issue is that the boat sat on the line may be stationary and is under no obligation to react until the overlap is established......

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Paul
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D-Zero GBR 74

Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 29 Mar 15 at 4:40pm

Originally posted by jeffers

The issue is that the boat sat on the line may be stationary and is under no obligation to react until the overlap is established......

Yeah, and this is where I am a bit uncomfortable with the rules as they stand. I have no problem with the basic premise that when a boat gains right of way by her own actions she should give the other boat room to keep clear. But I don't like the situation where a windward boat, unable to actively keep clear due to her decision to come to a halt and lose the majority of control over course and direction, is protected from the consequences of that decision.

But as I say those are the rules, and I don't have a better option to offer. Besides changing that situation would be a significant game change and I imagine many, probably most, wouldn't like the idea.

Posted By: gordon
Date Posted: 30 Mar 15 at 9:09am

Jon Meadowcroft:

In this scenario a boat that was clear astern becomes overlapped so close to leeward that the windward boat is not keeping clear. Rule 15 requires the now leeward boat to give the windward boat a short time to remedy the situation by getting clear. At the end of this short time the windward boat must be keeping clear. The windward boat cannot do nothing. She has to make an attempt to keep clear otherwise, after that short time, she will be penalised for breaking rule 11.

The leeward boat must give the windward boat room to carry out a seamanlike manoeuvre, which may be to sheet-in and go forward, luff or tack.

The rule does not protect a windward boat - it protects a boat that was right of way boat from the actions of a boat that was a keep clear boat that has just acquired right of way.

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Gordon