Dinghy development: Am I making progress? RS600

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Am I making progress? RS600

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11749
Printed Date: 09 Jul 25 at 6:56pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com

Topic: Am I making progress? RS600

Posted By: dohertpk
Subject: Am I making progress? RS600
Date Posted: 08 Nov 14 at 7:37pm

Hi all,

I've had my 600 a year now and have no way to gauge my progress. 20 knots of breeze is about the limit of my ability and I've yet to work up the nerve to take her out in more. It's very disheartening to rig her up and then have to take her apart again and downgrade to a Laser when the breeze gets too fresh. What kind of winds do others sail these kind of boats in (600s, 700s, Mustos)? I know I should probably MTFU and just push her out in more breeze, but I worry about monopolising the rescue boats at our club.

Thanks as always,

Peter

Replies:

Posted By: Paramedic
Date Posted: 08 Nov 14 at 8:20pm

i think a steady 20kts is pretty windy personally, and heading into this time of year i'd say is about the point where the enjoyment tends to start to be overridden by survival, depending on the rest of the weather of course.

i would temper the disheartenment with the though that of all the people in the country who sail in all classes i bet less than 5% would be able to take a 600 out and get round competantly in more than 20 knots.

i'd suggest that the time to mtfu is about april/may next year, in the meantime consolidate what you've learned and maybe push it a bit on the odd friendly day that we might get.

boats like 600s are very rewarding when you get it right but can be singularly soul destroying when it goes less than well!!

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Posted By: dohertpk
Date Posted: 08 Nov 14 at 8:31pm

Thanks for that - I do love the boat so it's very frustrating to have to leave her in the dinghy park. I've been watching Youtube vids of people throwing Mustos and 700s round in 25 odd knots, but maybe they have years of experience?

Posted By: rich96
Date Posted: 09 Nov 14 at 8:15am

A true 20knts is almost Force 6 - that's a lot for any dinghy - let alone a 600

The 600 is way more twitchy than the 700 or Musto so don't be too hard on yourself.

Much better to leave the boat ashore when you are not totally confident - no point breaking it or yourself or, worse, getting worried by it

The best way to get confident in those conditions would be to sail (not race) and practise without the pressure of other boats around you. Get competent in the boat handling.

But - don't forget that there are lots of us who would struggle in our own boats in that breeze - you aren't alone !

Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 3:32pm

Dude, just get yourself a Farr 3.7 and revel in proper wind!

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http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 3:58pm

Originally posted by Jack Sparrow

Dude, just get yourself a Farr 3.7 and revel in proper wind!

Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 5:07pm

Blimey, worrying about not being a true man coz you can't sail a 600 in 20+ knots? By then I'm wimping out of sailing much more stable boats - though the Minisail is just coming into its own.

Unless you are referring to forum wind speeds, of course - that is what the MPS and 700 sailors who are out in 25 knots are measuring by, most of the time. And I'll be happy in my Lightning in 30.

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686

Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 6:07pm

Thing is when I was learning to sail 20 knts wasn't that much wind. It was a 'beginners gale' not a gale for someone that can obviously handle a boat well enough to sail a trapeze boat. Which means he ain't a beginner! Boats have got more and more over canvased and more and more unstable in the search of speed. And more and more people find it difficult to sail them when theres a decent bit of wind around.

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Posted By: dohertpk
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 6:11pm

Well it's not so much worry as frustration at having to leave her in the dinghy park and rig up a Laser. I hope to separate the mast soon so I can rig the baby sail and take her out in F6 and above. I had considered a Farr 3.7, but I'd be at the heavier end of the suggested sailor weight. Besides, part of the great appeal of the 600, apart from the speed, is the challenge of learning to sail the thing. It's not the capsizing that's the issue in the breezy stuff - unless I'm doing something stupid the only capsizes I usually have are to windward and, more often than not, a water start is possible thereafter. What I really struggle with in 20knots+ is getting stuck in irons. I sail in a harbour with a lot of leadmine traffic - it can be very nerve wracking to find yourself going backwards while a fleet of yachts bears down on top of you.

Posted By: rich96
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 6:24pm

Why would you want to go out in a 600 in a proper Force 6 ?

Are you sure that you really mean Force 6 ?

You would really have to be a properly properly ace 600 sailor to do that

This weekend we had gusts of maybe F6 and that was enough to blow over very well sailed Wayfarers !

Posted By: dohertpk
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 6:32pm

Well I sail in Dublin Bay and if I can't take her out in more than a F5, then the amount of time I get to spend in the boat is radically reduced, at least in the Winter. I absolutely mean a F6. We are lucky enough to have two very reliable sources of real-time windspeed in Dublin Bay. The first is a twitter feed from a weather buoy:

https://twitter.com/DublinBayBuoy

The second is from an anemometer on the harbour wall:

http://www.dlhweather.com/current-details/

Apart from anything else, I'd like to improve as a skiff sailor, and, for me at least, part of that means being able to handle the 600 in a blow. I'm used to handling Laser 2s, Vagos, Fireballs and Laser in 20 knots+, and I'm really just wondering if something like the 600 can be sailed in those kinds of winds.

Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 7:48pm

A 'proper' skiff sailor would be using a Number 3 rig- in singlehanded trapeze boat terms, that means a nice flat cut radial sail on the right platform- a Farr 3.7 :-)

Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 8:04pm

In a proper F6 drop the stump out, roll the foot of the sail up and off you go. You should be able to hang on to that up to about 30mph.

Posted By: Chris 249
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 8:12pm

Originally posted by dohertpk

What I really struggle with in 20knots+ is getting stuck in irons. I sail in a harbour with a lot of leadmine traffic - it can be very nerve wracking to find yourself going backwards while a fleet of yachts bears down on top of you.

Since you've got a specific handling issue, are you starting to tackle it by asking specific questions to 600 sailors (ie what are the specifics about the way they handle this situation - for example have they found that the vang setting is critical in this situation?) and then setting specific times to practice on the specific problem? Even when I was learning the Laser I had days when I stuck it in every high-wind open-water gybe, until I rang up my brother (ex national Laser team sailor) who spotted the problem over the phone and cured it straight away.

Good on you for not wanting to monopolise the rescue boat, but can't you make an arrangement with them to go out earlier or later on days when the wind is right, so that you can just concentrate specifically on your own problem and solve it while they keep an eye on you? In this sort of boat, being committed can really, really count and that's hard when you have your understandable concerns about leadmines and rescue boats.

It sounds like you're trying to learn boathandling in a race, which is problematic in this sort of boat (or at least, problematic in the International Canoe which is the only comparable thing I've sailed). The family was away when I bought my Canoe, so for two weeks I just went out sailing every day on a small uncrowded waterway after work and fell into until I could handle it.

As others have noted, from a historical viewpoint and perhaps from a design viewpoint as well, the whole "one-rig skiff" idea is an aberration. A one-rig skiff misses out on the thing that historically

made skiff sailing practical for the typical club sailor, which is the ability to change down from the big rig.

Posted By: dohertpk
Date Posted: 10 Nov 14 at 9:14pm

Chris; these are all excellent insights, thank you. I'll put a note on the 600 forum. I actually haven't entered her in a single race yet. Our club sails tend to just consist of pottering around in the harbour or outside in the bay. I spend most of my time practising tacks - as far as I'm concerned, Saturday afternoons are for tacking!