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Sailfest......

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11604
Printed Date: 12 Jul 25 at 3:35am
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Topic: Sailfest......
Posted By: iiitick
Subject: Sailfest......
Date Posted: 16 Aug 14 at 10:30pm
Well here we are on Saturday night and not many boats entered for Sailfest which is only a week away. In fact most of the boats entered are small fleets using it for their Nationals. It could be that there is a rush next week we know of at least two Bytes that are sailing but not yet entered. Last year it was at WPNSA this year at Calshot, even though it was meant to be an Olympic commemoration event sailing on Olympic waters. Perhaps that is the problem? Or perhaps it is the £69.00 entry fee (more for double handers)? Apparently there are various other activities available like climbing and cycling but my friends are going for the sailing not land based activities.

Last year there were 120 odd boats and they wanted more, this year so far less than 40 have entered. I enjoyed spectating last year and I hope it works out. Mind you there will be 4 x 18 foot Skiffs to admire!



Replies:
Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 7:04am
Or is it just the curse of the internet weather forecast and everyone's waiting to see what the weather is doing before they enter?
However all those I know who are away sailing that weekend are going to other events even though Calshot isn't far away.
We'll be at the cvrda nationals at Clywedog in mid-Wales. Others are off to Devon and Cornwall......


Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 8:13am
Is the internet a curse or a blessing? Three Bytes are going from my club all have booked and paid for accommodation. £69.00 entry, £85.00 hostel, £70.00 fuel. Plus a day off work and a long drive from (in our case) Derbyshire. I doubt the 'former boy' would bother if he was not defending his championship. 

Let us hope it is a fun weekend with good sailing!


Posted By: Null
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 9:34am
I have looked at going last year but remember cringing at the price!  Havnt looked since.


Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 12:07pm
It strikes me as a funny time of year, serious travelling dinghy sailors are more likely to be in class regattas, the rest of us tied up with family holidays and work commitments.

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Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 3:58pm
I agree.  I could be at Clywedog, the contender nationals plus several other places that weekend if it weren't for the fact I need to be at Hunts running kids camp.

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the same, but different...



Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 5:23pm
Originally posted by kneewrecker

It strikes me as a funny time of year, serious travelling dinghy sailors are more likely to be in class regattas, the rest of us tied up with family holidays and work commitments.

Of course that is a good point. For the classes having their Nationals at Sailfest then it is after all their Nationals. For others it is just a fun sail and a costly one at that!


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 5:37pm
Well I thoroughly enjoyed last years' event (to the point that it was the sailing highlight of the year for me) and am signed up again for this one. £69 for 3 days racing (8 x fleet and a long distance pursuit) isn't bad at all (IMHO) considering the facilities and extra events, coaching debriefs and socials.
We've again got 3 generations of our family racing each other, and camping/ B&B on site....
Forecast looks pretty good at the moment, ranging 12-18 mph according to the BBC over the 4 days.

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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 5:54pm
Yes we enjoyed last year as well but it worries me on behalf of the organisers that the pre registration is so low. Where are the hot Fireballs and Phantoms et al.


Posted By: Do Different
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 6:12pm
Can't really see that it's extra expensive in itself; of course though it is South Coast over a Bank Holiday weekend which does have it's own implications.

Went last year and enjoyed it, would go again for but for the fact that it was 50% further for us than Itick and there is an as yet untried Bank Holiday sea regatta much closer to home.   


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 6:14pm
It would be a massive shame for this not to be a big event like last years' as I think the concept is superb - a big, relaxed and fun yet competitive event that provides a "festival of dinghy sailing" atmosphere. No sign of the L4000s and Javelins that we were mixing it with in the Alto last year...

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Posted By: GarethT
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 6:30pm
You might be describing Fed Week there, but double the price.


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 7:22pm
I'd like to do Fed Week some time, but it's a week long event, not a Bank Holiday weekend, and this year clashed with the Laser Nats, so no good for the Yoof. How much was the entry, and where was the camping?

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Posted By: GarethT
Date Posted: 17 Aug 14 at 7:37pm
From memory, a junior singlehander was around £30 for the week. Not sure about camping options - we let him stay in his bedroom.

I wasn't trying to do a competitive A is better than B because....., just saying that Fed Week provided a 'Festival of Sailing' atmosphere, with lots of competitors and lots of different classes.


Posted By: oldarn
Date Posted: 18 Aug 14 at 12:36pm
Originally posted by kneewrecker

It strikes me as a funny time of year, serious travelling dinghy sailors are more likely to be in class regattas, the rest of us tied up with family holidays and work commitments.

Perhaps a good time of year with a bank holiday and being  in 'summer'? After all there was a good attendance last year. Perhaps being an earlier summer bank holiday weekend is also a  reason since this has made it clash with more other events such as nationals and sailing weeks. Will it not be a week later next year.? Calshot does seem to offer a range of other activities for non sailing members of families. Geoff and I, in the AltO, are looking forward to it. Oh, We must enter.!


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thefastexcitingrunningasymmetric


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 18 Aug 14 at 3:14pm
Look forward to seeing you there Mike

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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 18 Aug 14 at 6:09pm
It felt quite busy last year...120 odd? But I have an idea WPNSA wanted more, hence the move.


Posted By: Pabs
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 5:37am
Its the furball nationals which may be putting them of 

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Boatless and Clubless


Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 5:46am
Originally posted by Pabs

Its the furball nationals which may be putting them of 

And Cherub......


Posted By: Do Different
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 6:59am
Furballs were there last year as a circuit event which really boosted numbers. Phantoms as well in force but they seemed to take the huff a little because the sailing was in the harbour and not at sea; open water this year, any Phantoms?


Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 8:49am
A few people did grumble about the no sea thing but I think the organisers decided that it was better for the bulk of competitors to sail in the harbour where it was hairy enough at times (I am assured). No Phantoms as yet.


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 8:53am
Yeah, a few grumbles after the 1st day, then no noises at all after the 25kts all day inside the harbour Sunday. One of the best days sailing I've ever had, that.

We're getting down there this afternoon... Look forward to seeing some of you there!

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Posted By: gordon1277
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 9:58am
Hi
I think the Phantom guys from Northampton and other inland clubs wanted sea sailing practice in waves prior to the nationals at Shoreham (which also had over 20 knots and huge waves) so they did not get the big wave courses and training they had signed up for.
This year we are at Stone so much smaller waves to play with more like a puddle!
Regards
Gordon
Phantom 1430

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Gordon
Lossc


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 10:21am
GJW Direct SailFest review :
http://goo.gl/z5Mz6b" rel="nofollow - http://goo.gl/z5Mz6b

With the 18ft Skiff,  Byte and ISO Nationals, handicap racing,  lots of shore side activities there will be plenty going on for all,  spectators welcome to drop in.   Calshot is great destination,  in addition to the activities centre there is the C16 castle and plenty of evidence of the former historic flying boat base.  The hangars themselves are some of the oldest in the world. 

Calshot is at the mouth of Southampton Water,  with a great viewing point.    It is Southampton Maritime Festival this weekend,  so we should a flotilla of historic boats passing the SailFest doorstep and a Hurricane and Spitfire fly past.  It will also be a busy weekend for Cruise Ships,  which certainly look very impressive at close quarters.  

Garmin will be on-site to demonstrate some of their products.

Yes entries are lower than hoped,  judging by promises various people are making looks like we will be around 50 boats.  Looking at other sailing events,  there is certainly a trend of later entries and also a yoho effect on numbers across years.  

In terms of entry fees,  not the cheapest nor the most expensive.   Important to look at the overall cost,  for SailFest we have a package of 4 days sailing, coaching from a multiple National Champion,   3 nights on-site B&B (2 people with sea views) and velodrome cycling for £371.    IMHO this is very good value.

Hope to see you all at the weekend


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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 10:28am
Originally posted by Bootscooter

Yeah, a few grumbles after the 1st day, then no noises at all after the 25kts all day inside the harbour Sunday. One of the best days sailing I've ever had, that.

We're getting down there this afternoon... Look forward to seeing some of you there!

We are drifting down on Friday, look out for two Bytes face to face on a trailer being towed by the 'former boys' 107. Stuffed inside the car will be two lads and a wizened old man......The journey could take some time!


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 11:30am
I shall be heading in a different direction to a picturesque lake in west Wales Liyn Clywedog) for another multi class event, the cvrda Nationals. With a £20 entry fee including camping, for 3 days sailing, we will put up with a lack of velodrome. There will be a multiple National champion there, who will give coaching tips if asked, though I don't think he is anywhere near the standard of your version!

I have a feeling people who go to either event will enjoy themselves - after all, they will be sailing!

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: Null
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 2:25pm

Good luck guys, i am sure someone else will see that as good value, but i couldn't justify £371 to my wife.  Let alone the £80 fuel.

Im sure people that attend will have a great time though.


Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 5:26pm
The trouble is that I can identify at least 4 national champions in the entry list, some of them multiple...perhaps they can coach each other? Team Combs is not interested in cycling or climbing, they are interested however in a good open water sail. As a spectator I am happy to absorb all the diversions on offer...bring them on! And my days will be complete if the lovely Brenda can pop me down a nice Pims about three o'clock.


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 6:05pm
I'm sure Mrs Boots will take a Pimms too!

My weekend's costing far less than £371 pp..... 3 x entries @ £69 each, 4 nights camping and 3 of us in the velodrome (because we've never done it before and we can!).

We've not had a proper holiday for 5 years (well, wife and daughter have just been to Lanzarote for a week, but that was my penance for buying the D-One ) because we can't afford to do that and support the Yoof in his ambitions, so this is what we do instead.

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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 20 Aug 14 at 6:34pm
Ah! Madame  Boot and Monsieur Tick......sipping Pims as the sun sinks below the horizon......


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 22 Aug 14 at 6:34am
Just had confirmation that there will be not one D Zero but two D Zeros on demonstration at GJW Direct SailFest

People starting to arrive,  heading over shortly for the coaching day with North Sails and Charlie Cumberley


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Posted By: Null
Date Posted: 22 Aug 14 at 7:43am
We'll boys and girls I will be there it appears!  Working on the d-zero stand on Sunday, baby sitting Holman.  Come and say hi, but please bring your cheque books.  You will need it!


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 22 Aug 14 at 1:14pm
Gizago?!?

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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 22 Aug 14 at 1:38pm
Originally posted by Bootscooter

Gizago?!?

you'll love it.  Maybe not enough to hang your kite up just yet, but if you don't find a thoroughly lovely little boat, I'll eat my hat!


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Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 23 Aug 14 at 11:10pm
Are results available anywhere? I can't find any on the Sailfest site, which is surprising for an organisation that promotes live tracking, etc.

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Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 24 Aug 14 at 6:49am
results :
http://sailfest.sailracer.org/eventsites/content.asp?id=39234&eventid=184531" rel="nofollow - http://sailfest.sailracer.org/eventsites/content.asp?id=39234&eventid=184531

1 ISO
2 Laser 4.7
3 Alto
4 Icon
5 Finn

Quite a breezy day in the end,  lots of tired and smiling sailors

Were available during the afternoon via the early report, now linked to main template,  sorry didn't to add earlier due to connection issues


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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 25 Aug 14 at 8:27pm
Hmmmm....Simon, Brenda and staff ran themselves ragged trying to make this event a success...but was it? Any criticism I may make over the next few days does not reflect on them but rather on the general circumstances.

I did enjoy myself however (as a spectator) Meeting Daniel Holman, the Massive Booterscooter clan!, Blaze 720 and others.

 


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 25 Aug 14 at 11:40pm
I'd say that last year's event was a massive success partly because of the superb weather, and this one was (albeit on a smaller scale) despite it.
Whilst it wasn't perfect, I love the fact that we had fun racing in an ad-hoc style when conditions made it impossible to go with the planned programme, and I got to sail a Finn!
I loved the fleets mixing and the general atmosphere of the event, and much kudos should go to the SailRacer Team who worked tirelessly along with the RO's Team, the Activity Centre and Calshot SC to make things happen as smoothly as they could.
The venue wasn't perfect, but the facilities were superb, though I'm not sure 100+ boats would work there...
Ultimately, it would be easy to pick holes (in any event or venue) but if we'd had hot sunshine and F3s every day nobody would care about doing that...
I'll certainly be looking to go next year

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Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 7:56am
Despite the many challenges we were dealt,  it has been very satisfying to have the number of people who have come and said they thoroughly enjoyed SailFest 2014.  We saw a massive cross section of sailors from OnBoard Feva sailors in their first away event,  through to multiple champions and Olympic medallists in 18ft Skiffs,  all smiling.

As mentioned,  as the weather changed we adapted the schedule.  It was great to see all the demo sails and people swapping boats,  with Iso sailors in Altos,  Laser helms in D-Zeros etc.  The Icon fleet giving an exhibition of the Icon Match Racing.

We were able to deliver four days of coaching,  racing,  socials, demos, activities and workshops etc,  with accommodation and meal packages to bring everyone together.  We have lessons to take on-board,  but it was great to see all the support and enthusiasm from the various organisations involved in SailFest.

It was good to meet a few of the people who hang out here and chew the fat,  even though not always quite sure which forrumite you were actually talking to.  


Back to drying out all the kit



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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 7:59am
Well yes, Booter but.....was it a good idea to have the racecourse so far away on the other side of Southampton Water and across a major shipping lane? When the boats got there they experienced some exciting racing but then they had to get back home, not easy for the slower boats and scary for the less experienced crews. No one said, "Only the most experienced should apply".

The after sailing activities were largely ignored because most sailors were just too tired, although I know that the Booter-clan enjoyed them all!

The casual racing on Sunday after the main event had been called off may have been fun for some but the Byte class requested those races because it was their Nationals and they needed more than three races. There seemed enough space for more than two marks and the Bytes had presumed that they would have a start of their own...what a surprise when six Iso's et al piled onto the short line! A young man sailing a D Zero demonstrator called water on the leading Byte when he was not even racing!

It seemed to me that one reason for no 'official' racing on Sunday was that the racecourse was so far away. Had the course been set nearer racing was perfectly possible (as you chaps proved). Calshot Activity Centre is not a sailing club, it has a sailing facility. Calshot Sailing Club is further back down the spit and they sail local to their own club.

I think the event needed more people to give it a 'buzz' but could a lot more boats have been handled? I wonder. I do think that the Sailfest staff ran themselves ragged and made every effort but circumstances were against them.




Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 8:06am
Sorry Simon I wrote the above without reading  your post. I am John Saunders who you spoke to regarding the Byte class. I would hate to hide behind iiitick!


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 9:54am
Course area - ideally this would be close to the slipway but given the tides for the weekend,  and with some near record low waters there was only really one viable sailing area that could be used across the whole day.  

Looking at the GPS data it was around 1.7 miles to the start line from the slipway,  this compares to other coastal venues like HISC,  Weymouth,  Plymouth,  Falmouth etc,  and all these have scope to race even further away up to to several miles.

Although we were able to put some short course racing through the moorings off the slipway, we ran out of water as we got nearer to low tide,  so not possible to fit in a third race.  The top mark was stuck in the mud when we went to recover it,  and the mark layers had to walk out to it......,  that cost me a few beers. 


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Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 11:12am
Originally posted by iiitick


The after sailing activities were largely ignored because most sailors were just too tired, ...


It's a sports event ... you are meant to be tired after ... but a few amber recovery drinks usually gets people going again ...


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 11:30am
Originally posted by 2547

Originally posted by iiitick


The after sailing activities were largely ignored because most sailors were just too tired, ...


It's a sports event ... you are meant to be tired after ... but a few amber recovery drinks usually gets people going again ...

We saw sailors from several classes (including some of the faster boats) give the Veledrome Cycling a go,  also Brenda managed to take time from the race office to do a few laps.  

Other sailors were seen burning calories in the bar,  something for everyone at GJW Direct SailFest 


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Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 11:36am
Spot the athletes




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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 3:33pm
It is Simon and Sailracers duty to say encouraging things about the event and it is not in my nature to be critical. Therefore I will not argue or get involved in an unseemly wrangle with such nice people. I have made my point. Did the Monday pursuit race go ahead by the way? Not many boats in the boat park when we left on Monday after (very good) breakfast!

Thank you very much for sending the photographs, that was really kind.


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 4:29pm
Originally posted by iiitick

Did the Monday pursuit race go ahead by the way? Not many boats in the boat park when we left on Monday after (very good) breakfast!


The North Sails Long Distance Pursuit Race was binned due to lack of even short distance visibility in the awful Bank Holiday Monday Weather.

But given we had plenty of prizes,  a top race team, North Sails coaches and some keen sailors,  we re-invented the day into the North Sails Short Course Regatta with Cameron Tweedle (Finn) winning from Tim Keen (RS300)




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Posted By: blaze720
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 4:54pm
It is always a bit easy to find fault ...after an event.  The weather simply did not play fair for enough of the time on this occasion.  If anyone can suggest perfect weather dates with certainty more than a few days in advance then they should not be wasting their time here, they should be selling the service and making their fortune.   The planned sailing area is the same as used by Warsash for championships and I could not see any real  fault in that either ...

In fact for trying out boats the 'apres' sailing  (ie post cancelled) sail on Sunday was very good.  Close in and just plain playing around.  For example we loaned one of the 'match racing' Icons to a couple of youngish 18' skiff crew who had broken their ride on Saturday and we had fun chasing around both windward/leeward and across the wind for well over an hour with them ...   nothing like trying something new is there guys !

Brenda / Simon L of Sailracer have some photos somewhere ...

Mike L. 




Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 5:12pm
18 Foot Skiff Sailors enjoying one of the Icon Match Racing boats




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Posted By: cad99uk
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 5:37pm
Has the new Icon builder been revealed?


Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 6:21pm
Originally posted by blaze720

It is always a bit easy to find fault ...after an event.  The weather simply did not play fair for enough of the time on this occasion.  If anyone can suggest perfect weather dates with certainty more than a few days in advance then they should not be wasting their time here, they should be selling the service and making their fortune.   The planned sailing area is the same as used by Warsash for championships and I could not see any real  fault in that either ...

In fact for trying out boats the 'apres' sailing  (ie post cancelled) sail on Sunday was very good.  Close in and just plain playing around.  For example we loaned one of the 'match racing' Icons to a couple of youngish 18' skiff crew who had broken their ride on Saturday and we had fun chasing around both windward/leeward and across the wind for well over an hour with them ...   nothing like trying something new is there guys !

Brenda / Simon L of Sailracer have some photos somewhere ...

Mike L. 


The last thing I want to do is offend anyone by my comments but I thought that when I suggested a race at Calshot after cancellation it was so that the Bytes could complete their Championship. Three races was not really enough. They did expect a start of their own at least. Great fun yes but rather a sad end to a Nationals. I thought Saifest was a good idea last year and I did this but somehow it never seemed to come off. There were however many things that I personally enjoyed as a spectator and I thank the organisers for that.


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 7:10pm
Originally posted by iiitick

 
The last thing I want to do is offend anyone by my comments but I thought that when I suggested a race at Calshot after cancellation it was so that the Bytes could complete their Championship. Three races was not really enough. They did expect a start of their own at least.

But what about all the other sailors there ?,  at 11 boats the Bytes were the largest class but not the majority and two other classes were also hosting their Nationals 




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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 7:26pm
11 boats for the Byte Nationals? Blimey, the Minisails had 12, for goodness sake...

So much for the boat being chosen as a pathway class. People have voted with their feet.


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 7:47pm
Did I miss a report of the Minisail Nats on Y&Y?

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Posted By: Null
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 7:50pm
Tick, it was lovely to meet you finally in person. I loved your passion and commentary of the byte racing.  In fact I had a good day considering.  Really great to catch up with bootscooter and the boy, great guys always game for a laugh.  Really great seeing The boy growing into being a great yachter!  Bootscooter so passion and commitments to his kids sailing is really inspiring, I just wish I was as selfless as he with my kids development in the sport.




Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 7:56pm
Originally posted by Simon Lovesey

Originally posted by iiitick

 
The last thing I want to do is offend anyone by my comments but I thought that when I suggested a race at Calshot after cancellation it was so that the Bytes could complete their Championship. Three races was not really enough. They did expect a start of their own at least.

But what about all the other sailors there ?,  at 11 boats the Bytes were the largest class but not the majority and two other classes were also hosting their Nationals 


Well yes, but the 18's never even rigged and the Iso chaps seem to have been happy to decide their Nationals on three races. All I am saying is that the Bytes expected a start of their own as they did on the Saturday. I am trying not to argue!!!


Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 8:06pm
Originally posted by Rupert

11 boats for the Byte Nationals? Blimey, the Minisails had 12, for goodness sake...

So much for the boat being chosen as a pathway class. People have voted with their feet.

Rupert. I believe in the class, I believe that if I can enlighten others it will be better for them. I feel quite Evangelistic on the subject. More than half the fleet were women who love the boat. The Hartleys father and son came down to see us with a new boat which had interesting tweaks. They are full of enthusiasim, we are full of enthusiasim, we will succeed......just you wait.....fatties!

And...surely Minisail gets the nostalgia vote? 


Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 8:34pm
Originally posted by Null

Tick, it was lovely to meet you finally in person. I loved your passion and commentary of the byte racing.  In fact I had a good day considering.  Really great to catch up with bootscooter and the boy, great guys always game for a laugh.  Really great seeing The boy growing into being a great yachter!  Bootscooter so passion and commitments to his kids sailing is really inspiring, I just wish I was as selfless as he with my kids development in the sport.


Nice to meet you as well....you are taller in real life...but then everyone is taller than me these days! I think I saw the future this weekend, love the Icon and love the D Zero.


Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 9:13pm
That weather doesn't look too inspiring, if you had folks saying they enjoyed themselves in that, then I reckon you pulled it off Simon

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Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 9:23pm
Originally posted by kneewrecker

That weather doesn't look too inspiring, if you had folks saying they enjoyed themselves in that, then I reckon you pulled it off Simon




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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 9:39pm
Originally posted by iiitick

Originally posted by Rupert

11 boats for the Byte Nationals? Blimey, the Minisails had 12, for goodness sake...

So much for the boat being chosen as a pathway class. People have voted with their feet.

Rupert. I believe in the class, I believe that if I can enlighten others it will be better for them. I feel quite Evangelistic on the subject. More than half the fleet were women who love the boat. The Hartleys father and son came down to see us with a new boat which had interesting tweaks. They are full of enthusiasim, we are full of enthusiasim, we will succeed......just you wait.....fatties!

And...surely Minisail gets the nostalgia vote? 


It gets the "boat for £50 vote...


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 9:41pm
Originally posted by Medway Maniac

Did I miss a report of the Minisail Nats on Y&Y?


Yup

http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/news/177535/Minisail-Nationals-at-Whitefriars


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 10:28pm
Originally posted by Null

 Really great to catch up with bootscooter and the boy, great guys always game for a laugh.  Really great seeing The boy growing into being a great yachter!  Bootscooter so passion and commitments to his kids sailing is really inspiring, I just wish I was as selfless as he with my kids development in the sport.



I only do it cos they love it so much! And I'm NOT about to sell the D-One to fund a Finn yet!!*




* although I admit that it may come to that eventually

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Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 26 Aug 14 at 11:23pm
Oh, and another thing.... how many times have you been to a regatta and had to pay a king's ransom for that awesome picture of yourself that you see displayed in the clubhouse?

Really great of SailRacer to a) take so many great quality pics of the event, and b) stick them up online.

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Posted By: gordon1277
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 8:53am
Hi Simon
Interesting that you did not sail Sunday, at 9am we had southerly at Lee on Solent very light but by 12 we had a NNW of about 8 knots.
Can I suggest moving the event to another bank holiday being mid late August many classes have there Nationals or are about to early September so you are reducing your potential takers. Late May might be worth a shout.
Good luck.
Gordon


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Gordon
Lossc


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 9:10am
Originally posted by gordon1277

Hi Simon
Interesting that you did not sail Sunday, at 9am we had southerly at Lee on Solent very light but by 12 we had a NNW of about 8 knots.
Can I suggest moving the event to another bank holiday being mid late August many classes have there Nationals or are about to early September so you are reducing your potential takers. Late May might be worth a shout.
Good luck.
Gordon

Gordon 

The Race Team set up station near the Meon Shore,  and for quite a bit of the morning were recording more tide than wind.  Early afternoon when we gave up on that idea,  we were able to set-up some ad-hoc racing near Calshot Slipway which had a bit of breeze,  but a falling tide so ran out of water later in the day.  With 20:20 hindsight we probably should have made that call earlier,  but with the range of boats (18ft Skiff to Feva) we had to fit in needed a big course area.

Moving dates certainly under consideration,  any thoughts on Whitsun Bank Holiday/Half Term ?


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Posted By: balladsailor
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:09am
It seems to me that the ' problem' with SailFest, is that it cannot be 'all thIngs to all people'.  A great concept, to have a festival of competition, coaching and additional events for all levels of ability and experience.  
Having sailed at WPNSA last year and again this year at Calshot, I think The Sailracer team should be congratulated for trying to do something a bit different!  This year was particularly difficult with both the weather and disappointing take-up. 
We were able to treat the weekend as a superb family get together, with good racing,  though the only times I got ahead of the grandchildren was when they capsized!!!
As Simon has said, 20-20 hindsight can be useful, and I am sure he will be using that to tune next year's event.
To club sailors who don't travel very often, this could be THE event to go to, without some of the perceived issues that are associated with some large class championships.
Many thanks again to theSailRacer team and sponsors for a great weekend!


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:19am
SailFest should consider a venue with on-site camping so you can get the real festival feel and camping makes it much cheaper.

Perhaps a big inland venue would work which could support multiple courses and camping.


Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:22am
Originally posted by 2547

SailFest should consider a venue with on-site camping so you can get the real festival feel and camping makes it much cheaper.

Perhaps a big inland venue would work which could support multiple courses and camping.

That's how the http://nationalwatersportsfestival.com" rel="nofollow - National Watersports Festival works, except it's obviously not 'inland' as that would be utterly rubbish....  some folks pussy out and go and find a B&B to get a decent night's kip... EmbarrassedLOL

There's a new kite surf brand there this year- I've no interest in the product, but apparently the guy on the stand is a famous yachtsman from Kent.  


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Posted By: Null
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:42am
I think somewhere like Paignton would be an excellent venue for Salesfest.  Loads of cheap B&B's, great sailing water, stuff for the non sailing members of the family to do.  With a big green area for displays etc.  I think it would be really good to have some big chandler's and manufacturers supporting the event.  I could be something really quite special as an event, i hope it gains the right momentum going forward.


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:44am
Originally posted by kneewrecker

Originally posted by 2547

SailFest should consider a venue with on-site camping so you can get the real festival feel and camping makes it much cheaper.

Perhaps a big inland venue would work which could support multiple courses and camping.

That's how the http://nationalwatersportsfestival.com" rel="nofollow - National Watersports Festival works, except it's obviously not 'inland' as that would be utterly rubbish....  some folks pussy out and go and find a B&B to get a decent night's kip... EmbarrassedLOL

There's a new kite surf brand there this year- I've no interest in the product, but apparently the guy on the stand is a famous yachtsman from Kent.  

That looks like a proper festival of sailing ... perhaps SailFest should annex the NWF ... add some dinghies into the mix.


Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:47am
It needs the RYA to shift the Dinghy Exhibition to the early summer (a june weekend, during term time when families want to make the most of the being outdoors, but aren't 'on holiday' elsewhere). 

Then actually combine it with some bloody sailing.... I never understand you guys who go to the Dinghy Exhibition.  Why would you lose a sailing pass to trudge around an exhibition hall in North London?  Now if those stands were at a 'Big Event' e.g. Sailfest, now that would surely be a far better footfall, and also provide a fantastic demo opportunity for gear & boats.  


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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:50am
Originally posted by 2547

Originally posted by kneewrecker

Originally posted by 2547

SailFest should consider a venue with on-site camping so you can get the real festival feel and camping makes it much cheaper.

Perhaps a big inland venue would work which could support multiple courses and camping.

That's how the http://nationalwatersportsfestival.com" rel="nofollow - National Watersports Festival works, except it's obviously not 'inland' as that would be utterly rubbish....  some folks pussy out and go and find a B&B to get a decent night's kip... EmbarrassedLOL

There's a new kite surf brand there this year- I've no interest in the product, but apparently the guy on the stand is a famous yachtsman from Kent.  

That looks like a proper festival of sailing ... perhaps SailFest should annex the NWF ... add some dinghies into the mix.

I contacted Allan Cross (the organiser) about running a 'special dinghy fleet' this year doing some slalom racing.... my interest wained when I realised I wouldn't actually have one (yet).  

If Rodney and/or the RS boys are reading- my idea, which wasn't discounted by Allan the way, was to get an invitational for RS Aeros, D-Zeros and Lasers (8.1s welcome)... no PY, one fleet- run what you brung.   The Aeros would have killed it, y'know, not needing launching trolleys or anything. LOLWink

Maybe 2015?  (Anyway, this isn't meant to distract or take the thread O/T... someone start a new one if there's interest, or they just want to rubbish the idea please)


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Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 12:02pm
Originally posted by 2547

SailFest should consider a venue with on-site camping so you can get the real festival feel and camping makes it much cheaper.

Perhaps a big inland venue would work which could support multiple courses and camping.

We had camping at Calshot with more people choosing that option over the on-site B&B.  On the Saturday the Skiff sailors entertained us and the locals in the bar during the quiz which had some interactive elements involving cucumbers.  Sunday's more formal meal seemed to be enjoyed by all.   

As mentioned by others the weather and lower numbers than last year made for some challenging decisions.  With a bigger entry we could have run two course areas.


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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 12:05pm
Don't get me wrong, I think Sailfest was/is a great idea. Simon, /Brenda and co. made every effort, they are charming and helpful people. It is also a great idea to gather minor classes together for Nationals but it will always be an addition to the normal run of open events and championships. Of the about 50 boats, 12 were Bytes (in Nationals). 10 Iso's (in Nationals). 6 18' Skiffs (in Nationals) and 2 Alto's (in Nationals). Plus the Booterscooter lot in a total of 5 boats!

I know I have grumbled about the Byte problems but the real culprit was the weather so forget about that. How about a 'Festival of Classes'? There are many small Nationals turnouts out there, FD, Europe even Ruperts Minisail! Perhaps a less isolated venue with easier courses for smaller boats, hell! you could even have the FOM!


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 12:11pm
The problem dinghyists bring to an event is their heavy demand for space for trolleys and trailers plus as you've spotted, the windsurfers & kities like to party a bit, you know stay up late rather than a curry and off to bed. Also we get that unique thing you don't to our events.. Wimmen and the last thing we would want is an influx of beer mat coated buttocks, spots, ginger hair, beards, socks in sandals and wood botherers, to damn us by association with their imagery.

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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 12:17pm
Originally posted by iGRF

The problem dinghyists bring to an event is their heavy demand for space for trolleys and trailers plus as you've spotted, the windsurfers & kities like to party a bit, you know stay up late rather than a curry and off to bed. Also we get that unique thing you don't to our events.. Wimmen and the last thing we would want is an influx of beer mat coated buttocks, spots, ginger hair, beards, socks in sandals and wood botherers, to damn us by association with their imagery.

good point.... it was a duff idea.   LOL

Anyway, I've got my racing attire sorted for this year, something a little more action hero to match my new board.  Last year I was a Heineken bottle, bobbing along on a barn door of a thing. (That one made an appearance at the FOM once if I recall... Wink)


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Posted By: boatshed
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 8:09pm
Originally posted by iGRF

the last thing we would want is an influx of beer mat coated buttocks, spots, ginger hair, beards, socks in sandals and wood botherers, to damn us by association with their imagery.


You forgot smocks.  


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Steve


Posted By: L123456
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:23pm
How can you host a national water sports festival without dinghies there????


Posted By: GarethT
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 10:25pm
They haven't got swimming or fishing either!


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 27 Aug 14 at 11:29pm
Originally posted by L123456

How can you host a national water sports festival without dinghies there????


You do it, by not having a book full of crap rules, don't make folk wear buoyancy if they don't want to, encourage women to participate, have parties, laugh, joke, don't take things to seriously, then you sail really fast, jump high, do tricks, try out kit, have night sailing sessions, all on entirely different kit, with no illogical handicap system telling you half an hour later that even though you got back to the beach first, someone who finished half an hour later beat you because a bunch of old buffers sat around a table somewhere and decided his board was slower than yours on account that some guy had been sailing it half cocked around a puddle near Lunnon.

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Posted By: iiitick
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:00am
Originally posted by iGRF

Originally posted by L123456

How can you host a national water sports festival without dinghies there????


You do it, by not having a book full of crap rules, don't make folk wear buoyancy if they don't want to, encourage women to participate, have parties, laugh, joke, don't take things to seriously, then you sail really fast, jump high, do tricks, try out kit, have night sailing sessions, all on entirely different kit, with no illogical handicap system telling you half an hour later that even though you got back to the beach first, someone who finished half an hour later beat you because a bunch of old buffers sat around a table somewhere and decided his board was slower than yours on account that some guy had been sailing it half cocked around a puddle near Lunnon.

It all sounds rather silly to me. Are people drunk and then sick? Do they slap each other on the back and say what fun it was? When it's all over do they go back to jobs in Swinton Insurance or Halfords?


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 7:29am
It has been very encouraging to receive all the positive comments from competitors across the various fleets at SailFest 14,  but also the enthusiasm from the all organisations and sponsors that were involved.   Importantly juding by comments on forums such as this one and social media,  there is clearly interest in the SailFest concept.

This year compared to last was particularity challenging for a variety of reasons,  it was great to see all the various stakeholders pulling together to make SailFest a success in the difficult conditions.  

Again with 20:20 hindsight we may have done things slightly differently,  but ultimately SailFest delivered four days of sailing,  3.5 Nationals Championships,  multi class racing,  demo sails,  coaching,  shore side activities and displays,  accommodation packages and socials etc

There are various debriefs under way with the representatives of all the organisations involved and looking at plans for 2015,  so keep the ideas flowing.  


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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 8:33am
Originally posted by iGRF

Originally posted by L123456

How can you host a national water sports festival without dinghies there????


You do it, by not having a book full of crap rules, don't make folk wear buoyancy if they don't want to, encourage women to participate, have parties, laugh, joke, don't take things to seriously, then you sail really fast, jump high, do tricks, try out kit, have night sailing sessions, all on entirely different kit, with no illogical handicap system telling you half an hour later that even though you got back to the beach first, someone who finished half an hour later beat you because a bunch of old buffers sat around a table somewhere and decided his board was slower than yours on account that some guy had been sailing it half cocked around a puddle near Lunnon.


Parts of that sound like a semi decent class Nationals, but without a decent element of competition.

With no handicap system, surely the person willing to spend the most just buys his way to victory? Assuming he can windsurf a bit. And without some rules, isn't it like playing chess where you can move the pieces where you like, when you like?

Night sailing sessions, no BAs, on kit you are unfamiliar with, having had a skinful over the evening?

Last Firefly Nationals I went to was more than 50% women - can these piss ups say the same?


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 9:16am
Originally posted by Rupert


With no handicap system, surely the person willing to spend the most just buys his way to victory?


So how would he do that? What board would he buy? If it's windy, he'd need a small fast slalom board if it isn't he'd need a big volume long board with a massive sail, the event is next week you have to enter now, which one are you going to choose? (Taking the question seriously which it isn't and nor is the event, it's a fun out to a buoy and back dash last I remember, I've never done it, personally I like a bit of structure to my racing which is probably why I'm here in dinghydom.)

The event is a festival, a get together, annual rally, meet up, have a bit of a sail, watch Pro Sailors, see next years new kit, go to clinics, hang out, party, sail old kit in fancy dress, gender swap, that yellow welly turned up as a beer bottle, a bit like the FOM which you could turn into a similar event if you wanted..

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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 10:12am
In answer to Rupert's question re competition, it's simple.  The fleet is split into the 'National Fleet' - pros, semi-pros and amateur slalom racers; then you have the 'Freeride Fleet' for everyone else- there are category prizes like master, grand master, first woman, first youth, vintage kit etc.  There's even a fancy dress prize for first one in non-standard sailing kit... I'm aiming for that this year.  Both start together, the National Fleet do an extra lap- they will be picking up the back markers of the Freeride fleet when they finish, so in reality, the fleets start and finish together.  It's very clever race management.  

The National Fleet runs on the standard UKWA slalom rules- basically I think the kit has to be production kit (so no special customs) and there is a width limit on the boards and a max sail area.  The sort of kit I'm talking of is, for arguments sake, as highly tuned and tested as the 20 grand Merlin or latest head-tuner in the Moth fleet.  It doesn't suit your average pleb like me... it might be quick in the right hands, but it lacks comfort and control, meaning it's dead slow for someone who just grooverides around and fancies the competitive element of the NWF.  You also need to be sh*t-hot at rig tuning- slalom sails have a very narrow wind range, it's not uncommon for sailors to rig up three sets even with a stable forecast.  I'm not dissing this, in fact I wish I was good enough to participate, and who knows, one day I might be. A full slalom set up is going to set you back between £10 and £12k new, although anyone good enough to justify that kind of spend is probably on a trade deal anyway.  

They also observe a tighter rule set- mainly for safety, than tactical usage like a dinghy race.   Coming into a mark at 35 knots is not something for rules nerds to throw their crap about in.  I think a similar attitude seem prevalent in any Moth racing I've seen- they just seem to play sensible at marks.  

The freeride fleet is open to all, and all boards are welcome- anything from the 1970s to the slalom gear above if you want to spend 'megabucks', but heed the warning above, spending that kind of money is not necessarily going to result in the performance gain you might think.  Last year was won by a guy on 1980's longboard equipment- he sails inland near Milton Keynes.  It is utterly fun, but lacks the structure we would think is essential for 'proper racing' in dinghydom.  Last year I was in the water at the gybe mark- middle of the pack there was no way anyone was going to get around cleanly and on hindsight I should have held back and/or rounded around the outside... but my timing was poor and I ended up in the drink with 20 other sailors, booms, sails and upturned boards everywhere.    

So what happened?   I've been in wing mark pile-ups in dinghy events and the language is ripe, the red flags are getting pulled out of those camera film cases and everyone gets really wound up and argumentative- it's just not fun, not unless you are mentally retarded and like that sort of thing.  When faced with that situation, I've just hoped I've not been tthe poor sod who appears to have drifted to outside of all this.... you'll be up before the beak for not 'giving water'  (which in itself sounds like a Victorian medical sample.)

But at the NWF everyone laughed, we helped each other to make sure no one took a boom on the bonce, I even held the tail of one fine young women's board so she could get on and uphaul cleanly.  She had a nice bottom, does admitting that break Rule 2?  A guy I know called Steve 'popped' the head of my sail to speed up my own uphaul process.  He then gave me some pumping tips back down the next leg.  I know, I know, I should have retired... outside assistance, rule 41, but he beat me and we had a laugh about how knackered we were from it.

The prizes are donated by the industry- and the best prizes go to the Freeride fleet.  I saw one guy win a £700 sail last year just for winning one race sponsored by that loft.  He said a big thank you, but he gave it to the kid who won the U21 category.... cue jokes about no one wanting that brand, but in truth it was just a very generous gesture, and demonstrates the goodwill at the event.  

So it's a different vibe from dinghy events- which in itself doesn't make it better or worse, but it's certainly a festival of sailing.  

How can it be a Festival of Sailing without dinghies?  Hmm, you really need to ask???




 


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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 10:17am
Originally posted by boatshed

Originally posted by iGRF

the last thing we would want is an influx of beer mat coated buttocks, spots, ginger hair, beards, socks in sandals and wood botherers, to damn us by association with their imagery.


You forgot smocks.  

'smocks' are in themselves fine attire, but make sure you get one with an integrated head covering.  

Oh, and call it a hoody, before someone laughs at you....


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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 10:57am
You make it all sound lovely, YW. Of course, the masts fall over, you have to pump to be anywhere (sounds like Solos, that last bit...) you spend 10 minutes sorting you and your mates out at the mark, so making the racing meaningless (but you still have to pump and get knackered), and there is no room for tactical thinking.

Hmmm, think I'll stick with old, fuddy duddy dinghy racing, frustrating as it is at times, but I do agree that there are aspects of the windsurfing scene that could make the dinghy one more fun, especially at club and small open meeting level. 3 processional races in a day is not the most exciting of prospects, but the WW/LW courses that are put on instead in some places really are tedious - reaching is fun!


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 11:03am
I don't think it was meaningless at all, certainly not for the guys who were at the front.  The question is, if you are the standard of sailor who is doing well to even be in the pack at the mark, then what happens when the pile ups occur?  Do you want to join in the Mister Shouty Man game and got to the kangaroo court to 'prove you were in the right'?  Or would you rather laugh about it and get away as cleanly and safely as possible without concerning yourself with an extra tack and gybe as a 'penalty'?

Anyway, as I said, it's a different vibe- not necessarily better or worse.  I'd imagine the 'serious racer' would probably be in National Fleet anyway.... and sponsorships are won or lost in that.    


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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 11:07am
Originally posted by kneewrecker

   Do you want to join in the Mister Shouty Man game
 


Sadly, once I'm out there, I am Mr Shouty Man. It is a character flaw that I'm working on, and I'm better than I was 25 years ago, but it is a slow process...


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 11:42am
Over the last year we have been working with the Techno Windsurfer Class,  including their Euros in Garda and Worlds (400+ boards),  France.

Having come from more a Dinghy and Yachtie background,  attended/organised 00s of events quite an open opener to see how other types of water sport operate.   They have a main stage,  with music and DJ,  party games and shore activities as they wait for the perfect wind,  then short races and back ashore for more partying.  

Not suggesting this would work at an event like SailFest but certainly some good ideas that could fit,  even for those in smocks.  


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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 11:47am
Simon, get yourself this... it's a total bargain, and would probably do well at the NWF if there's light wind.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mistral-Malibu-windsurfer-complete-possible-use-as-paddle-board-too-/261572252411?pt=UK_Sporting_Goods_Windsurfing_CV&hash=item3ce6ebd2fb" rel="nofollow - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mistral-Malibu-windsurfer-complete-possible-use-as-paddle-board-too-/261572252411?pt=UK_Sporting_Goods_Windsurfing_CV&hash=item3ce6ebd2fb


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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:04pm
I wouldn't want to pee in your pool, but that Mailbu was never a 'beginner' board, it was designed as a 15kts+ racing fun board unfortunately just as the world discovered short boards were faster, so, it would not perform that well in light wind.
It would not be that easy to sail either, being quite narrow and lowish volume for it's length, not saying don't get it, they're quite fun in a breeze, but don't think of it as anything that would be advantageous to race with these days. From memory 190 ltrs or thereabouts, certainly not much more

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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:10pm
And In answer to Rupert, quite frankly from what I now know about this sport, it's bloody disingenuous calling windsurfing out on pumping. It's is no different than Sir Bens activity and a lot of other rocking, ooching, roll tacking and general kinetic encouragement I've seen in dinghy sailing.

So that's total bollox now, and that's official.

And there was me thinking it would be an easier activity to retire to when in point of fact at times it's harder work, pumping a sailboard is easier than pumping a dinghy.

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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:13pm
Yup, they didn't learn from windsurfing, and started allowing pumping in some sailing events or classes too. Bad news. Glad to say that there are still some classes who will call you on it.

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:20pm
Well there are classes surprisingly in Windsurfing where they'll call you on it. The Kona, biggest global amateur class ignored by the RYA is a prime example.

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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:38pm
I remember mention of that class before - sounds like a sensible way to go.

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: GarethT
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:43pm
Going way off topic now, but why is pumping bad?
 
Is roll tacking bad too?


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 12:59pm
Roll tacking is simply a way of getting a boat from facing one way to facing another without losing speed in between. Pumping is using human power to make the boat go forwards (hence "air rowing" as a description in windsurfing). It puts a huge emphasis on upper body strength and endurance in a sport that is traditionally a balance between fitness and experience. Currently, I know sailors who have been doing this sport for 60 years and are still able to compete at National level and do well. Add in pumping, and that whole side of things would be gone for ever.


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 28 Aug 14 at 1:00pm
Originally posted by GarethT

Going way off topic now, but why is pumping bad?
 
Is roll tacking bad too?

It's bad because Paul Henderson says so, so there....  

regarding windsurfing, specifically the Kona Class, Joachim believe(s/d) that one of the reasons why recreation race boarding went out of fashion was the free and liberal use of pumping. 

They handle this through the SIs, not the Class Rules:

1.3. Pumping: RR 42 and RR 67 will apply, which means that repeated rig movements to increase or maintain speed are prohibited as specified in these Sailing Instructions.

So much as some of us might deride the RRS, whilst citing windsurfing as a light hearted alternative, the Kona Class is much more like dinghy racing than slalom / master blaster stuff.  This entire ethos of Kona is so off-key with the majority of windsurfers here, yet it also got rejected by the establishment when presented here to the RYA- which is odd, as up until recently, there really was no 'controlled class' alternative for course racing once the kids dropped off T-15 but found that A-Levels were more important than 'almost' getting to go the Olympics (if it wasn't for the other 10 sailors above them).

It's stuck between a rock and a hard place.... nice shape board though, and once you get the pimped up full carbon (non-class legal) version, and then put a decent sail on it, it's a wonderful cruising toy.

http://vimeo.com/99573440" rel="nofollow - http://vimeo.com/99573440




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