knees up sweekstake
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11498
Printed Date: 14 Jul 25 at 11:43am Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: knees up sweekstake
Posted By: maxibuddah
Subject: knees up sweekstake
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 12:10am
I know that this is a bit cruel on jimbo, but knowing his previous record, comments on another thread, and of course trying reverse psychology to get him to keep Dan's finest bit of design, how long do you think that he will keep the boat before complaining that spreadsheet racing isn't for him? This is of course just for fun.
Mark, if you wish to call this online bullying and delete the thread without recourse please do so
------------- Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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Replies:
Posted By: rodney
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 6:54am
I am going to stick my neck out here and say 5 years plus
I think that after a lifetime of searching he has, at last, found true love That's not to say that he won't either trade it in or sell it and buy a newer D-Zero in the course of time..... After all there is the Masters fleet to consider when he gets old(er) and wrinkly(er)!
OH! It's called a D-Zero, that's what you get for having fat fongers 
------------- Rodney Cobb
Suntouched Sailboats Limited
http://www.suntouched.co.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.suntouched.co.uk
[EMAIL=rodney@suntouched.co.uk">rodney@suntouched.co.uk
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Posted By: getafix
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 7:37am
Reckon a year or so, he stuck out the Soslow for that long? And I think GRF gave up on the 100 first?
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Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 8:00am
No Rodney, it's what happens when you have fat fingers and several glasses of wine and an over zealous auto correct on your phone....
I sincerely hope jimbo does keep the d-zero a very long time. It's a fantastic and serious looking boat that deserves a great shot at making it amongst the dinghy park detritus. If only I could be arsed to lose enough weight equivalent to igrf I would probably get one.
------------- Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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Posted By: Thunder Road
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 8:22am
Originally posted by rodney
I am going to stick my neck out here and say 5 years plus
I think that after a lifetime of searching he has, at last, found true love That's not to say that he won't either trade it in or sell it and buy a newer D-Zero in the course of time..... After all there is the Masters fleet to consider when he gets old(er) and wrinkly(er)!
OH! It's called a D-Zero, that's what you get for having fat fongers  |
I guess in life finding the right boat is like finding the right dog, a companion for life, and that makes a D-Zero a black Labrador 
------------- Finn GBR16 Thunder Road.
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Posted By: Null
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 8:34am
I am going to suggest he will keep it. Jimbo changes boats because previously he is sold an image, promise, perception. The 100 was meant to be some kind of big fleet world beater (he isn't the only one who has bailed) the solo he bought for local fleet racing (we all told him he was too fat for it...we were right) the Vareo fell to bits, the phantom he sold as like it or not when you won in one people pointed at you and said it was the handicap (they were right) the cherub...stupid idea.
The ideal boat up until recently for Jimbo was a laser! It can sit and rot for 45 weekends of the year and he can pull it out of the nettles to trudge round a lake when he feels like it, with brilliant residuals, zero maintained etc. However we all know he thinks they are sh*t boxes. So when a modern, faster, more pimp version appears! Bingo perfect, not to mention at its current price is very cheap. His previous boats would of had an almost £10k (not all but nearly) weight sat on top of his concious. (Not sailing depreciating)so he sells, at £5500 I dare say he can afford to let that sit there. Not to mention the fact the boat is useable in any uk sailing location.
So I say, give fat lad a break. He was sold dreams and marketing ideals.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 9:59am
He'll keep it right up until the minute we meet on the start line both in the same boat and he gets to witness the divided cheek wetsuit climbing inexorably away from him up wind and then again when it laps him..
------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website
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Posted By: iitick
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 10:00am
If the 'perfect' boat, car, house, wife, husband was produced would we keep it, him, her forever or would our mind wander into other possibilities? I think it would. This D Zero thingy looks pretty good to me and if I was as wealthy as the rest of you I might buy one to 'see me out'. But then I said that about a BMW I owned a few years ago. My wife seemed a good life time investment forty odd years ago but I have been searching (unsuccessfully) for an updated version since about 1980. We will always desire change or advancement. If all our dreams are fulfilled we have nothing to turn to except drugs.
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 10:17am
when you come from Essex, you understand it's impossible to be bullied by someone who doesn't like Stella....
As for the D-Zero, and boats in general, it all comes down to whether they deliver on expectation. If they don't, I see very little reason to work through the hard times- it's a lump of plastic, not a marriage and I've nothing to prove to anyone, not through leisure activities anyway. I've had my main boat for 5 years now, I scrubbed it at the weekend and despite not using it much, it still delivers on everything I expect from it. Even the engine started on first pull.
Now, here's the rub.... expectations can change. It's the reason I sold my MPS, we had a child on the way. Compared to most blokes in the same position, at least I kept sailing. But Russ's right, I didn't much like the Phantom that replaced it, the same as some people don't like rice... 2 billion Chinese people can't be wrong. Besides who'd like a bowl of rice when they've been feasting on Sailing Foie Gras with its amazing power and blistering downwind speed, not to mention the convivial and welcoming restaurant that made it so accessible, if you could take the time to dine with them?
Anyway, metaphor aside, there was an emerging fleet of RS300s and it's very easy to see greener grass, and it was greener, so green the glare blinded me when the 'promised asymmetric' came along- two of them in fact and boy, didn't they deliver a great sh*t fight.... one of the best wouldn't you say?
I'll leave you to make up your own mind on whether the RS100 'project' has delivered or not, either way the recent nationals attendance would show me that even if I wanted to continue sailing asymmetric hiking boats, there really is only one option left. It comes to something when you look at the results and work out that simply finishing half the races would have been enough to crown you a National Champ... sorry, but there are some people who should never expect to get an invite to the Endeavour.... I'm one of them.
Jump forward a couple of years, which included 18 months off dinghies, and I got a Solo. I enjoyed my Solo most of the time. it's a well sorted boat and the rules are tight and they work to deliver great racing at club, local, regional, national and international level. However dinghy sailing is a light wind activity for me these days, and I'm underpowered in a Solo in those conditions. Getting ghosted offwind was frustrating, however if I had sailed it more regularly, or took it to some windier, coastal opens, then the law of averages would have worked it all out I'm sure. But in truth, am I ready for the Solo just yet? No, not really, not if there is something newer and nicer that I could help a little bit, but get a lot out of. The Solo remains a reliable option for when a) I'm too old to windsurf or b) I retire and want a nice boat to sail locally and at a few events.
I'll be honest, I had intended to switch back to the RS300 or a Finn as soon as I sold my Solo. After 10 years of trying different boats, unstayed unarigs are by far my favourite mode - especially for racing and the tactical options it offers. I've no shame in sharing that I asked Rodney for a quote on a Finn, and whilst I'm not questioning the value for what the typical customer gets, I would question the value I would get out of one for a wednesday night chariot. Again, it's something I see more as a goal for early retirement in maybe 10 years, rather than something I want whilst I have a young family and busy office schedule. If I could predict the future today, as it stands, then the D-Zero will get traded in for one in due course, but as I said, expectations can change. I don't know where I'll be living in 10 years, never mind what boat will be suitable.
So it was narrowed to a 300. There's a still a couple left racing at Draycote, and one more, free for others to use if I couldn't make it, seemed like a good way to move on, and help boost the numbers by one in the all-but-dead handicap racing there. I had a couple of options lined up for the 300 and then something upset the plan.... I learned that the 300 was being discontinued, and for me, investing 8 grand in a new boat when the class has been given its last steak, well, f**k that people. No way I'm going to be left that out of pocket if it crashes over two seasons like other SMOD fates. Ironically, (and for balanced opinion) it seems the 300 is having a bit a resurgence- it certainly got a lot more activity and buzz than some other RS classes at their sprints. Who knows, maybe the BY@Beer can turn it around and shift a few new units over the next few seasons. I genuinely hope so, it's a great boat and I doubt it will be permanently off my own radar for some years to come.
So I decided to wait and get what was to become the RS Zero/Aero... sit it out over the winter months (no hardship) and windsurf the spring/summer on a longboard. Get a new boat late summer/early autumn this year. A few folks knew that, but someone told me to drop Dan a mail first. I did, I liked what he had to say, I changed plans when I got to see the first photos.... the D-Zero meets many of the same expectations as the Aero for me, but all round I think it's a nicer package and not trying to be all things to all people with the multiple rig 'kiss of death'. Plus waterline length is king, and it would probably take a fresher mindset than I've currently got to give the Aero the benefit of the doubt on upwind performance.
Any concerns with the D-Zero? I had initially thought that the Zero rig would be a little underpowered for me, but sailing a proto at Haversham in light winds has put that idea to bed. Sure, i could do with shifting a few cags to get the most out of it, but I wasn't suffering too badly either - despite weighing in that morning at 102kg. There were three of us out there, none of us had sailed them before, I was the one in the lead despite starting last. Sure, a little snapshot and v. lucky shift, but that's all it takes to get a confidence boost in my book.
So what are my expectations:
- folks to sail against (ideally in similar paced boats Zeros, Aeros, Rooster 8.1s, OKs, Finns etc) - a decent build quality - a nice feeling rig (no more Hyde crap) - simple sailing, not too techy and tweaky - easy to get from the roof to the water
I'm changing clubs to ensure that I get some people to sail against. As for the rest, well I'm as confident as I can be that Devoti will deliver on this. Confident enough to spend 5 grand anyway.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 10:49am
So what he really needs is a Finn or the new D 0.5 boat.
Can I change my bet?
------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:01am
Originally posted by iGRF
So what he really needs is a Finn or the new D 0.5 boat.
Can I change my bet? |
whoa there cowboy.... you're forgetting the influence you have played in my sailing education over the past 5 years.
Whilst I don't think all-out light weight is necessarily a good thing on a dinghy, especially with an imbalance on the sail area, lively snappy handling is something that windsurfing has led me to expect from sailing these days.
I never really understood what people meant about feeling connected to the boat, or more specifically disconnected from it. I do now, thanks to windsurfing - sailing in its purest form. Anyway, suffice to say my first sail in a D-Zero was bare-foot to properly test it. And it delivered.
Much as I liked the Finn, I do wonder, almost hope, that I would find it a 'bit of a bus' once I've got used the feeling of something erm, elegant, for a more civilised age.
[TUBE]0aRtupiY9Dw[/TUBE]
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:13am
Everyone should learn to windsurf before they sail boats, I thought this as I robbed a couple of kids off the dinghy course to join our team fifteen lot the other night.
I'm pleased if my influence (I've never been the sort anyones mother would recommend their child having anything to do with)has changed the way you (or anyone else for that matter) think, I'm not right or wrong I've just been lucky enough to cross a few sports. But it is significant that wind and its employment as a means of propulsion and the competition it affords has been by far the most enduring and long may it continue into retirement which appears to be upon me at last.
Sail and own as many boats as you like Jimbo, it's OK by me, it's in the rules after all, the correct number of boats a man should own is N + 1.
------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website
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Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:28am
I think you are going to like it jimbo. I think you'll find it satisfying and rewarding, as well as a 300,who knows, but you'll have fun finding out.
Apologies for the poking fun, but after a couple of glasses last night and something you wrote in another thread I thought it was a good idea..... Obviously not really in hindsight, but at least it got you practising your keyboard and elegance skill set.
By the way I do like stella, just not for an all evening drink.
------------- Everything I say is my opinion, honest
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:35am
sh*t, that mean you can officially bully me during the day time.
Don't worry mate, life is there to laugh at, and if you can't laugh at yourself then who can you laugh at?
Besides, who's the joke really on? Me? If I get bored of a boat, or it no longer suits what I want, then I chip it in for something I want more. Or the person trapped sailing something they don't really want to anymore because they lack the wherewithal & confidence, or are simply too damn lazy to make a change? I know people who have simply stopped sailing when their time came to sell their Laser. I find that a bit sad, but understand all too well that circumstances change, and frankly, if all that's on offer is drifting around a pond in a very expensive bath tub, then other sports and life events will take priority.
But for me it has been best to try a few things out, than resign oneself to nothing more than a Costa Meatball panini to pass the weekend, or worse, 5 a side football - with the dicks at the local accountancy and law firms.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:48am
Or continue with your collection? What do they call folk who collect steak pies?
Pielately?
There must be quite a few of you in the Phantom class, do you often swap them?
------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website
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Posted By: Thunder Road
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:48am
Originally posted by kneewrecker
sh*t, that mean you can officially bully me during the day time.
Don't worry mate, life is there to laugh at, and if you can't laugh at yourself then who can you laugh at?
Besides, who's the joke really on? Me? If I get bored of a boat, or it no longer suits what I want, then I chip it in for something I want more. Or the person trapped sailing something they don't really want to anymore because they lack the wherewithal & confidence, or are simply too damn lazy to make a change? I know people who have simply stopped sailing when their time came to sell their Laser. I find that a bit sad, but understand all too well that circumstances change, and frankly, if all that's on offer is drifting around a pond in a very expensive bath tub, then other sports and life events will take priority.
But for me it has been best to try a few things out, than resign oneself to nothing more than a Costa Meatball panini to pass the weekend, or worse, 5 a side football - with the dicks at the local accountancy and law firms.
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I think you just made my mind up for me 
------------- Finn GBR16 Thunder Road.
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Posted By: Blue One
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:54am
Originally posted by getafix
Reckon a year or so, he stuck out the Soslow for that long? And I think GRF gave up on the 100 first? |
It will all depend on how often he sails. He only stuck with the solo for so long because he didn't sail it very often. It was always too windy, too light, too wet, too dry, or wind surfing or on holiday etc etc etc . If he sails every other week, I give it three months. But if he sails it as often as the solo, I give it a year.
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Posted By: KeithF
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 12:05pm
Originally posted by kneewrecker
But for me it has been best to try a few things out, than resign oneself to nothing more than a Costa Meatball panini to pass the weekend, or worse, 5 a side football - with the dicks at the local accountancy and law firms.
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Spot on there.
I had a 300 for 4 years and hated every minute of it - what the hell was I doing.
Since then three Finns and loved every minute. Four years blasting around in a D-One - haven't won a race at the club but had great fun re-learning to swim and coming 2nd! Now on to the D-Zero - MAGIC.
------------- Keith - Finn GBR63
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 12:10pm
Originally posted by Blue One
Originally posted by getafix
Reckon a year or so, he stuck out the Soslow for that long? And I think GRF gave up on the 100 first? |
It will all depend on how often he sails. He only stuck with the solo for so long because he didn't sail it very often. It was always too windy, too light, too wet, too dry, or wind surfing or on holiday etc etc etc . If he sails every other week, I give it three months. But if he sails it as often as the solo, I give it a year.
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I sailed the Solo (or my boards) most weeks when I was in the UK, I didn't necessarily race every week though. When I'm not in the UK I tend to be Spain where I have my main boat, (and another windsurf set up), although three weeks were taken out with other holidays last year which was a little unusual.
And you are right, when there's wind in the UK forecast, I tend to windsurf in preference. Although inland windsurfing has lost its appeal somewhat- to the point where I haven't actually joined anywhere whilst boat-less this season so far. So I tend to find less-is-more and hit the coast once or twice a month at the mo instead. Less bullsh*t ... you know the score on that front.
As I said, I liked the Solo, I would probably buy another one if circumstances were right, or more accurately, if there were no other options. Boat on boat I much preferred everything about it over my Phantom. But I figured something with a little more oomph would be preferable for light wind Wednesday night racing- hence the plan to get a Finn or a 300. For reasons mentioned, I don't think a Finn is the right boat for me right now. And the 300, well I guess it would have paid to do my research before selling the Solo. I could have got 6 months more out of it for minimal depreciation, but unsurprisingly no one was going to announce from the roof tops that the 300 had been axed.
Either way, the D-Zero is too good an opportunity to pass up - so I'd be moving the Solo on now anyway. I suspect I'll give it a couple of seasons at the very least before shaking my head at the conservative nature of UK sailing. 
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 12:20pm
Originally posted by KeithF
Originally posted by kneewrecker
But for me it has been best to try a few things out, than resign oneself to nothing more than a Costa Meatball panini to pass the weekend, or worse, 5 a side football - with the dicks at the local accountancy and law firms.
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Spot on there.
I had a 300 for 4 years and hated every minute of it - what the hell was I doing.
Since then three Finns and loved every minute. Four years blasting around in a D-One - haven't won a race at the club but had great fun re-learning to swim and coming 2nd! Now on to the D-Zero - MAGIC.
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Posted By: Thunder Road
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 12:27pm
Originally posted by kneewrecker
Originally posted by KeithF
Originally posted by kneewrecker
But for me it has been best to try a few things out, than resign oneself to nothing more than a Costa Meatball panini to pass the weekend, or worse, 5 a side football - with the dicks at the local accountancy and law firms.
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Spot on there.
I had a 300 for 4 years and hated every minute of it - what the hell was I doing.
Since then three Finns and loved every minute. Four years blasting around in a D-One - haven't won a race at the club but had great fun re-learning to swim and coming 2nd! Now on to the D-Zero - MAGIC.
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You too Keith, brilliant  
------------- Finn GBR16 Thunder Road.
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Posted By: Blue One
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 12:35pm
As I said, James, three years would be spot on for me and I do think it would be good for you to stay with one boat for a few years.
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Posted By: KeithF
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 12:35pm
All we need now is a venue for the D-Zero world masters
------------- Keith - Finn GBR63
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 3:04pm
Originally posted by Blue One
As I said, James, three years would be spot on for me and I do think it would be good for you to stay with one boat for a few years.
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yes, but then I'd have to clean it. Far easier to trade it in for a new one- and you get a new sail.
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 3:05pm
Originally posted by KeithF
All we need now is a venue for the D-Zero world masters
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Dublin Bay.... nights out down Temple Bar, big swell, sponsored by Guinness and upwind planing.
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Posted By: rodney
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 4:21pm
I'm up for Dublin Bay
We are hoping to fit in a Roadshow weekend there after the summer. Don't tell the missus but am also up for Temple Bar
------------- Rodney Cobb
Suntouched Sailboats Limited
http://www.suntouched.co.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.suntouched.co.uk
[EMAIL=rodney@suntouched.co.uk">rodney@suntouched.co.uk
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Posted By: kneewrecker
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 4:34pm
I wonder if we can borrow Ronan Keating's 'Gold Card' for Abrakebabra?
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Posted By: rodney
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 4:44pm
Hope so! We will need it, might even explore its limits
------------- Rodney Cobb
Suntouched Sailboats Limited
http://www.suntouched.co.uk" rel="nofollow - http://www.suntouched.co.uk
[EMAIL=rodney@suntouched.co.uk">rodney@suntouched.co.uk
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Posted By: Blue One
Date Posted: 30 May 14 at 11:34pm
Originally posted by kneewrecker
Originally posted by Blue One
As I said, James, three years would be spot on for me and I do think it would be good for you to stay with one boat for a few years.
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yes, but then I'd have to clean it. Far easier to trade it in for a new one- and you get a new sail. |
Works for me. 
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