Phantom Purchasing Guidelines
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11384
Printed Date: 14 Jul 25 at 3:36am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Phantom Purchasing Guidelines
Posted By: Dan LXIX
Subject: Phantom Purchasing Guidelines
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 12:15am
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Hopefully someone can guide me in the right direction on this one. I'm looking to move into a Phantom this year and I want to find out which rig would be better suited to my size. I'll be buying second hand. I'm after an Ovington hull with carbon spars, but should I be looking for any particular rigs and sail cut? I'm 6'3" and just under 16st at the moment.
I have tried to join the Phantom class forum to ask this, but I've been waiting for them to approve me  |
Replies:
Posted By: NeilB-Phantom
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 12:35am
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Hi I'm 6'5 and 17 stone. I have a Super spars large diameter mast and use a north CC14+ which is the medium cut (16+ was the full cut), now discontinued; I believe North now only make 1 cut of sail. P&B still do flat medium and full. Not many people use the full so far as I know, even at my size depowering is usually more of a isstue than a lack of power! The Super spars seems to suit me but I haven't tried any of the other varieties of carbon mast, super skinny CST masts now see to be most in vogue and other manufacturers seem to be going that way too. But I don't tink its actually that critical, the general condition and set up of the boat would make much more of a difference to you. My boat is set up for the taller chap and has the toe straps mounted nearer the centre line than standard, on my previous standard boat at 6'5 I had to use the opposite side toe strap to hike comfortably. Don't think there are many boats like mine about JJ custom low buoyancy on Ovington hull. Hope this helps Neil ------------- Phantom 1384 Dazcat D995 |
Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 7:22am
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Pretty well any carbon rig would do to be honest. I wouldn't get too hung up about it. It's unlikely that you will find one but an older Superspar 55mm ought to be out at your weight and height, it's too flexible. Never had a Selden so not sure what is what with them. Cst as Neil says it's the latest fashion so if you can find one great.
A medium cut p&b would be fine but you could go for a full cut. Will Gulliver used to use one to great effect, but due what he uses now. As for the hull do not write off the Vandercraft hulls post sail number 1100. The vast majority are just as quick as the ovi hulls. I can beat them with mine. They are down to weight and the same shape hull so there won't be any difference in speed. ------------- Everything I say is my opinion, honest |
Posted By: rb_stretch
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 7:34am
| At 6'6" and 15 1/2 stone I use the Selden S3 with North Cc14+ sail. Arguably I would be better with the Selden S2 which is a bit softer at the top, but as Maxi says, with your weight, all the rigs should be fine. |
Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 4:56pm
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Buy the aero - half the price, just as quick! ------------- |
Posted By: Blue One
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 6:32pm
Is that forum speed? 
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Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 6:49pm
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Either that or the infamous RS 'marketing machine' redefining the Laws of Physics ;-) ------------- |
Posted By: Blue One
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 6:57pm
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Don't think so, we both know nothing is faster than forum speed!
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Posted By: getafix
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 8:46pm
| Have you tried a Blaze, or if the water you sail on is big enough, a Contender? Might be worth tasting other dishes before ordering? |
Posted By: E.J.
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 9:33pm
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If your specifically looking for a Phantom as your post indicated; I wouldn't suggest a Contender or even a Blaze, I would suggest a Phantom. ------------- |
Posted By: Dan LXIX
Date Posted: 09 Mar 14 at 10:15pm
I'm quite happy to have a boat that isn't covered in scaffolding or has me swinging about like a teabag, thanks 
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Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 8:11am
the Blaze may have some 'scaffolding' on it...but upwind when the breeze is on it is a joy to sail past Phantoms and Lasers who are busy pulling all sorts of strange faces whilst you perch there nice and comfy on the rack.... Then you come to the reaching legs and the speed comes on. You don't get the same sensation of speed as you do in a boat where you are closer to the water but then again you also stay a lot drier as you plane past them (or pull away more). As our very on 'blaze720' would say...give it a try, you might be surprised! My only real complaint about the Blaze was that it was a little 'sticky' in lighter winds although I am told the sail design (which has changed since I left the class) has sorted that out. ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 8:14am
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Back on topic..... If you decide to go for a Vandercraft boat watch out for the side deck going soft, there were quite a few at Hunts that suffered because the bracing in the tanks as not in the optimal place and the deck developed a lot of flex. Ovi sorted this out though. Aside from that they seem to be every bit as fast as the Ovi (with equivalent equipment on board). ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: blaze720
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 9:34am
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I'm not going to bang on about the Blaze ... we I would but most know about the boat by now. What I will say is perhaps try anything that might suit. It may sound trivial but it is a bit like looking at houses or cars really. Until you have been around or tried a few yourself it is very difficult to really know what might really suit. Otherwise it is really like asking football fans which is the best club in the land ... and yes they will have a few views on that as well. Don't 100% trust any of us - we know what we like already !  Mike L. |
Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 11:14am
Actually Paul, Vandercraft sorted that out, not ovi. It was sorted by about boat 1160 or so (well that's the last one I know that did it anyway). The problem came because of the joint between basically two flatish sheets of foam sandwich and the curve joint. Vandercraft solved it by putting a formed piece behind and bonding it in place. This repair can be done retrospectively though it's not easy. You only need to press on the area where you would sit and if it flexes stupidly there's a problem. If there are cracks in the gelcoat it doesn't mean there's a problem with flexing, you need to push it. Mine has cracks along that area but it is still rigid as anything. ------------- Everything I say is my opinion, honest |
Posted By: Dan LXIX
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 11:32am
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Okay, so I wasn't being serious with that comment, but I'm not sure how suited either the Blaze or the Contender are for inland waters, and although we only sail handicap I'd rather sail something that has at least two of the same on the water. That is one of the advantages of the Laser (current boat for me with an 8.1) for a small club.
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Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 11:46am
Good to know that. The guys at Hunts who had Vandercrafts said it was a perennial issue (one them had 3 hulls under warranty precisely because of this, the side deck flexed alarmingly even when pushed by hand on one of the hulls). Good to know the guide hull number where it was rectified by the builder. ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 11:46am
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I like both the Blaze and Contender, but at the upper end of their respective weight bands I also struggle with the thought of using them predominantly inland. Plus a Contender is simply too heavy for a 21st century boat. :-) Given the choice of just those three, I'd swallow up the handicap and get on with sailing a Phantom. ------------- |
Posted By: gordon1277
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 12:42pm
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Hi
1277 would be perfect for you, 60mm diameter Superspar mast, North 16plus sail, with a Newish P&B as an option and spookilly I am selling her. See Phantom website or Apollo duck. Self promotion aside the phantom is a great boat for us normal size people 6ft plus and over 16 stone and does real;y well inland hope you find what you want. Regards Gordon ------------- Gordon Lossc |
Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 1:22pm
Well let's put it this way Paul, I know that 1160 had the problem but not sure about later boats. I know that 1175 doesn't do it so somewhere close to 1160 was the last to experience it. I guess it done of things that take a while to come through the system and of course a while load more were built in the interim. ------------- Everything I say is my opinion, honest |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 10 Mar 14 at 1:40pm
ftfy ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: gordon1277
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 1:00pm
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Sorry Graham where normal your not. just short and to light.Simple.
Ask Maxi he knows everything. ------------- Gordon Lossc |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 1:51pm
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I saw Maxi at the Dinghy show, he'd fallen over, but unfortunately there was no one available on the Phantom stand to come over and pick him up, (somebody had probably bought another cake to the stand) so I pulled up a chair and had a chat... ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: maxibuddah
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 2:43pm
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And I was still taller than you ------------- Everything I say is my opinion, honest |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 3:34pm
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------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: Steve411
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 4:00pm
Did you see some of the literature on the Phantom stand? Fleets in pie chart format. Probably a pasty chart somewhere if I'd looked hard enough. ------------- Steve B RS300 411 https://www.facebook.com/groups/55859303803" rel="nofollow - RS300 page |
Posted By: gordon1277
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 4:02pm
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anything resembling a pie or pasty would have been eaten. ------------- Gordon Lossc |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 5:05pm
No, I've learned that without waterproofs, it's best to steer clear of that stand, they are normally gorging themselves on something messy/likely to squirt over you if you get too close... Looked like they had cow pie again this year.. ------------- https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 11 Mar 14 at 5:14pm
 almost a coffee on the keyboard moment! ------------- the same, but different... |