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Boats hardly anyone talks about Pt 2 - Javelin

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11027
Printed Date: 15 Jul 25 at 11:59pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Boats hardly anyone talks about Pt 2 - Javelin
Posted By: iGRF
Subject: Boats hardly anyone talks about Pt 2 - Javelin
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 4:19pm
Just for you tick, I've no idea what you're talking about other than something you chuck on sports day or a wetsuit brand many years ago owned as I recall by a lady.

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Replies:
Posted By: robinft
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 4:36pm
Very pretty 17'7" 2man single trapeze dinghy with a symmetric kite, designed by Peter Milne when he was editor of Y&Y, I think. At the time it had the most comfortably shaped side tanks for hiking helms.


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Laser number 9


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 6:40pm
In the UK its a sort of a half way house between an FD and a FiveOh. Popular in Holland for some abstruse reason, otherwise only in UK. One of the best of the "all the others" fast boats of the 70s, which is probably why its survived in some sort of state when so many contemporaries are pretty much extinct.

In NZ and Aus a Javelin is a very nice lightweight(ish by current standards) 14ft trapeze development boat, rather less extreme than the 14, and in the US the name is used for some heavy thing...



Posted By: getafix
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 7:08pm
Good sea boats and very pretty


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 7:22pm
So is it 17ft or 14 ft and have the convicts made it an assym?

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Posted By: i tick
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 7:38pm
Ah, ha! If my photo posting window was not stuck (can no one help me?) I would post photos. I owned half, mainly the front half, of a Javelin for a number of years. It was, and is, 17'.7" and very pretty. Narrower than a 5oh and a bit slower.  We lake sailed ours which was good fun with such a powerful boat. PY 946 I believe. It had a very big kite and I rigged up a self launching pole because I struggled to clip an ordinary 2 metre pole on. This is a boat for real men! I used to crawl under the foredeck to sort the chute out and I could disappear up there. Happy memories.

One of the principal clubs for Javs is up the road from here at Glossop where Richard and Kathrine Smith are based. They are multiple national and European Champions.

2 years ago the Reid brothers came back into sailing and joined our club. They had sailed Javs with their father 30 years ago and had some success. They dragged the old boat out of the nettles, sorted it out and managed 3rd in the Nationals this year. The boat was then entered for the Bala long distance but Stuart, the helm, could not find the time. So, the 'boy' took over and they sailed it into third. 

These boats have a small but enthusiastic following and if you try one you can see why.


Posted By: i tick
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 7:40pm
That Aussie thing is not a Jav. Peter Milne designed good British boats like Fireball not Australian beach toys.


Posted By: i tick
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 7:41pm
and......thank you young Fuller for pulling me in x


Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 7:46pm
Originally posted by i tick

and......thank you young Fuller for pulling me in x


Think nothing of it tick, I thought you'd dozed off there for a minute, you haven't ruined another keyboard with your dribbling into it have you?

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Posted By: Do Different
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 9:22pm


Javelin has a group on Facebook. Lots of pics on FB and Assoc website, javelinuk.com


Posted By: i tick
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 9:54pm
Thank you for that 'Do Different'. I never knew. Now GRF can see what I mean.


Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 9:54pm
We just had 28 Javelins at the Euro Cup in Holland.  Force 5 all week Mostly Dutch boats but Brits in the top three positions and a few Germans knocking about too.  For an obscure class it's surprisingly popular.

Something of a muscle boat (you sheet in the jib by straightening your legs) but there are plenty of women in the class (including the current European champion crew!) 

New builder JJ Boats in Norfolk is making some very clean hulls with some interesting new ideas for fitting out - in a year or two we'll all be tweaking the rake during races, only a few years back having a raking rig at all was a bit trick.

Fantastic boats on the sea in big waves and lots of wind.  The top leg of the triangle course is like galloping along in a herd of buffalo. Katanka, katanka.    

Should be four of us at Weymouth in a couple of weeks.


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Javelin 558
Contender 2574


Posted By: i tick
Date Posted: 09 Aug 13 at 11:06pm
Four of you Nick. Sailing what? I will be there spectating. Yes the genoa was a bit of a problem for a midget like me. Kathrine Smith, winning crew is married to Richard Smith, winning helm. She also has 2 children and makes spinnakers. She also has the bluest eyes in sailing....ahhhh.


Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 10 Aug 13 at 8:47pm
I'll be at Weymouth crewing 574.  560 will be theren from my hoem club, plus 573 coming down from kielder and, all being well, the new "demo boat" sailed by its builder and a mate from Alton Water.

Kath and Rich are just unbeatable through tacks and gybes (something about Kath's ability with a pole I reckon) , but they only got the Euros by a whisker :!).  Very Very close at the front of the fleet, would have been closer still except the best German team lost their mast in high winds and extreme rig tension.  Pretty close in the mid fleet too (lots of decent new dutch teams), pushing us back to 11th :(

Come and say hi at Weymouth.


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Javelin 558
Contender 2574


Posted By: Thunder Road
Date Posted: 14 Aug 13 at 11:51am
They had their Nationals at Bridlington a few years back, they were a great bunch of people, along with the Snipes they were probably the most friendly and enthusiastic I have come across as a PRO.

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Finn GBR16 Thunder Road.


Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 15 Aug 13 at 10:15pm
Well thanks ThunderRoad ... tho by "friendly and enthusiastic", he may just mean "peeved". (was trying to type a word beginning with p and ending with somewhat under the influence of alcoholic beverages, but the forum won't permit! Who would have thought a sporting forum would be so prudish)
.


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Javelin 558
Contender 2574


Posted By: Hector
Date Posted: 23 Aug 13 at 5:50pm
Always liked the look of them - a Mini FD sums it up - proper boat. Bit heavy I seem to recall?
The small chine / deflector looked very cool back in the 70s and still does. There was one at Yorkshire Dales that never got sailed - I have a horrible feeling it may be in 'Coffin Corner' now.

574 1


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Keith
29er 661 (with my daughters / nephew)
49er 688 (with Phil P)
RS200 968
Vortex (occasionally)
Laser 2049XX


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 23 Aug 13 at 7:26pm
That mainsheet looks like it is running over raw ali on the boom exit 


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 23 Aug 13 at 8:33pm
Originally posted by 2547

That mainsheet looks like it is running over raw ali on the boom exit 

How can you possibly tell with an image that size? A little bit of PTFE or even Tufnol glued in place is all it takes to provide a suitably slippery surface...


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 23 Aug 13 at 9:41pm
Originally posted by JimC

Originally posted by 2547

That mainsheet looks like it is running over raw ali on the boom exit 

How can you possibly tell with an image that size? A little bit of PTFE or even Tufnol glued in place is all it takes to provide a suitably slippery surface...

Well even with an insert why have ball blocks and rig it running over an edge?


Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 23 Aug 13 at 9:52pm
Thats ME on that wire there!  Southwold a couple of years back.  

Not sure what that sheet runs over. Though we do get through quite a few main sheets, so far it's cleat damage not boom damage that kills them - I shall take a look in the morning. :=)


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Javelin 558
Contender 2574


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 23 Aug 13 at 10:11pm
Originally posted by NickA

Thats ME on that wire there!  Southwold a couple of years back.  

Not sure what that sheet runs over. Though we do get through quite a few main sheets, so far it's cleat damage not boom damage that kills them - I shall take a look in the morning. :=)

I'd run the sheet external like this ...





Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 25 Aug 13 at 9:10pm
Can't honestly see what's been done on that furball.

For some reason, not routing the main inside the boom, on a Jav, results in the helm getting garotted. Our main really does run through a hole in the aluminium of the boom;  but it's carefully filed down and now highly polished aluminium so adds little friction at all, certainly doesn't wear the sheet out. 

Meanwhile, Sailfest has proven europes faster furballs to be quicker than the average Javelin club sailor .... but I doubt the mainsheet has anything to do with it Smile


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Javelin 558
Contender 2574


Posted By: Noah
Date Posted: 25 Aug 13 at 10:49pm
I also prefer the internal route to the external - even with loops to keep the sheet tight to the boom it decreases headroom albeit only a half inch or so, and the loops always fail at  the most inopportune moment with the ever present threat of garrotting :-(

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Nick
D-Zero 316



Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 26 Aug 13 at 3:47am
Originally posted by Noah

I also prefer the internal route to the external

Agree that loops are untrustworthy, but a piece of Mylar cloth for the whole length OTOH... I get very nervous about cutting longish slots in the boom. If it's safe surely the boom must be overspecified.


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 26 Aug 13 at 11:27pm
Sailcloth loop the the majority of the length and no slots in the boom is the way to go. 




Posted By: Dougal
Date Posted: 27 Aug 13 at 7:10am
Only works if you have a loose footed main.  

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What could possibly go wrong?


Posted By: 2547
Date Posted: 27 Aug 13 at 6:58pm
Originally posted by Dougal

Only works if you have a loose footed main.  

Edit:

You get a rectangle of sail cloth and two strips of spinnaker repair tape ... loop the rectangle below the boom then tape it to each side of the boom. That way the helm can never get garotted and as the loop is soft you don't lose any space under the boom when tacking/gybing as the cloth just brushes aside.

This way the mainsheet does not run over any edges and so does not have friction which is undesirable for a number of reasons least of all the sheet wares out ...


Posted By: Dougal
Date Posted: 28 Aug 13 at 4:01pm
Originally posted by 2547



Originally posted by Dougal

Only works if you have a loose footed main.  

Edit:
You get a rectangle of sail cloth and two strips of spinnaker repair tape ... loop the rectangle below the boom then tape it to each side of the boom. That way the helm can never get garotted and as the loop is soft you don't lose any space under the boom when tacking/gybing as the cloth just brushes aside.
This way the mainsheet does not run over any edges and so does not have friction which is undesirable for a number of reasons least of all the sheet wares out ...



That would work!


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What could possibly go wrong?


Posted By: NickA
Date Posted: 29 Aug 13 at 9:42pm
Those booms are significantly over engineered; some people cut a triangle off the back end for extra clearance and lots of them have holes in where stuff like spinny pole retainers were once mounted.  We did bend one once, probably landing heavily on it during a capsize, but it was bent back out again and is still in good service.

One thing about being a bit old fashioned and lacking in carbon whatnots, Javs are pretty strong.


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Javelin 558
Contender 2574



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