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Overtaking cyclists

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
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URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10914
Printed Date: 28 Jun 25 at 5:53pm
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Topic: Overtaking cyclists
Posted By: alstorer
Subject: Overtaking cyclists
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 11:13am
actually, I'll bite. If you're driving your car, unless the road is an extra wide one that could be three lanes wide, if you're overtaking even a single cylist you need to be almost entirely straddling the centre line. period. Especially if they're doing 20-30 and you're doing rather more than that. If they've got any sense they'll not be hugging the gutter (that way drains, potholes etc lie) and they'd really, really appreciate it if it didn't seem as if your wing mirror nearly hit their elbow.
If, like when I was on my way to work this morning, there's someone farting about reversing their car on the other side of the road, taking up all of that lane, then wait a few seconds, rather than try to squeeze past  and push me onto the verge. You utter 4r5e.
ahem.
Other cyclists: don't be tits. I appreciate it is a minority of you run red lights, cycle on pavements and don't use lights, but you're t055ers that aren't going to pay any heed to these pleas anyway, being very similar in attitude to the german car driving idiots that keep coming close to killing me on my way to and from work. For some reason your behaviour translates to what we "all" do on bikes, so I can confidently assert that everyone who drives a german luxury car is a speeding, red light jumping, cyclist squeezing moron I think?


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Al



Replies:
Posted By: gordon1277
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 11:34am
Ok I'll bite as well.
when on my local road we have a cycle lane in the road on one side and an off road one which can be used in either direction on the other side why do cyclists insist on using the road avoiding the manhole covers about 4ft away from the kirb.
Also should we not ban pensioners from shopping Saturdays, only a small attempt to take this off track like every other topic!

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Gordon
Lossc


Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 11:40am
Originally posted by gordon1277

Ok I'll bite as well.
when on my local road we have a cycle lane in the road on one side and an off road one which can be used in either direction on the other side why do cyclists insist on using the road avoiding the manhole covers about 4ft away from the kirb.
Also should we not ban pensioners from shopping Saturdays, only a small attempt to take this off track like every other topic!

We have a road near where I live. There is a perfectly good and brand new, smooth cycle path next to it. Clearly signed as a cycle path.

Do cyclists use it?

Hell no....

Did they kick up a stink when they put traffic calming on this road?

Hell yes....

So the council put then special cut through lanes at each of the constrictions....talk about wasting money left right and centre....

Anyway rant off....I am a cyclist as well as a motorist I do try my best to give them plenty of room. Not easy when they decide they need to speak to their mate behind them and sit up and twist as they weave all over the road....


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Paul
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D-Zero GBR 74


Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 11:47am
Bikes and Motor vehicles sharing a road?

Cats and Dinghies sharing a course?


Of course all parties deserve the respect we give fellow humans but is it practical these days?

 


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 12:19pm
there are some good cycle lanes and some bad ones around us.  I would use them personally, but I can understand why some road bikers don't use the one painted down the road I live on.  I think it was painted there to fulfil some pro-cycling/go green Local Goverment agenda, it's on the most cambered, pot holed and poorly edged bit of road going...

as for cycling on the pavement- yes I do it, when I'm cycling with my kid.  

Do I stop when I encounter a pedestrian?  yes, religiously, even if I don't need to 'stop'.  I won't blast past them on the grass verge as that could be intimidating.  So I stop.  If there are lots of pedestrians, I stop and get off and push my bike.  

Should I be on the road... no.  Not while there's an empty stretch of pavement, that is safer for me and my child.  Period.


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Posted By: catmandoo
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 1:13pm
At least cats when given their own course will sail it !  Majority of cyclists in glasgow run red lights , 

I too cycle whenn i can dig it out the boat jumble called a garage , funnily i use cyclepaths , well ive paid enough for them !!!! Stop at lights and the rest clad in lycra think im a space alien 


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Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 2:09pm
Not the Majority, the Minority!  Most of the road cyclists around me obey the road rules.  But then i dont live in an area of massively busy roads or loads of traffic lights.  i would suggest most of the bad press for cyclists comes from commuters. 
 
i also wouldnt use a specific cycle path on my road bike (although use red cycle lanes) as cycle paths often have drop curbs, man hole covers pedestrians etc. etc. These are just unsafe on road bikes.  I happily use cycle paths on my Mountain bike but i would be travelling slower, i have suspension and £500 worth of hoops designed to take the abuse.


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Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 3:28pm
if you've lived or worked in Lunnon town you might share a view with the director of Addison Lee about some cyclists.

I know I've seen city couriers squeezing the near side of buses and lorries on brakeless fixes.... it's trendy apparently, especially if you live in a 'pod' in Hoxton.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-17792851


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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 3:38pm
I was stuck behind a big old truck going down a mountain yesterday, he in turn was stuck behind some roadie determined to race him to the bottom and doing a fair job of winning, he, the truck did the decent thing and pulled over to let traffic pass, the roadie however continued to be a fecking nuisance putting himself at danger (it was snowing), I tried to clip him with the mirror as I passed (as is perfectly legal for downhill MTB riders to do when in a car overseas according to Grumpfs law) but failed as he baled down some slip road.

All roadies are cocks and as such deserve side swiping at every opportunity - it's written.

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https://www.corekite.co.uk/snow-accessories-11-c.asp" rel="nofollow - Snow Equipment Deals      https://www.corekite.co.uk" rel="nofollow - New Core Kite website


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 12 Jun 13 at 4:32pm
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures
 I must not use strava to record my sailing adventures




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Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 10:50am
Originally posted by alstorer

actually, I'll bite. If you're driving your car, unless the road is an extra wide one that could be three lanes wide, if you're overtaking even a single cylist you need to be almost entirely straddling the centre line. period. Especially if they're doing 20-30 and you're doing rather more than that. If they've got any sense they'll not be hugging the gutter (that way drains, potholes etc lie) and they'd really, really appreciate it if it didn't seem as if your wing mirror nearly hit their elbow.
If, like when I was on my way to work this morning, there's someone farting about reversing their car on the other side of the road, taking up all of that lane, then wait a few seconds, rather than try to squeeze past  and push me onto the verge. You utter 4r5e.
ahem.
Other cyclists: don't be tits. I appreciate it is a minority of you run red lights, cycle on pavements and don't use lights, but you're t055ers that aren't going to pay any heed to these pleas anyway, being very similar in attitude to the german car driving idiots that keep coming close to killing me on my way to and from work. For some reason your behaviour translates to what we "all" do on bikes, so I can confidently assert that everyone who drives a german luxury car is a speeding, red light jumping, cyclist squeezing moron I think?

Two cyclists side by side however is a different story, the outside one should get a good clattering with the wing mirror by law.


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Needs to sail more...


Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 11:35am
if the road is too narrow for two cars and one bike (ie you can't safely pass a single cyclist without going into the other lane), why are a pair riding two abreast so offensive to you? You need to go slightly further over, but the length of road they're occupying is reduced.

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-_
Al


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 11:50am
Classic cyclist suicide bid in front of me this morning. Roadworks on left, road is narrowed. I'm just behind a learner who is having trouble setting off past the roadworks. Cyclist shoots down the inside of both of us and then cuts across ahead of the learner, who has not the slightest clue they are there. Very lucky cyclist not to get flattened...


Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 1:06pm
Originally posted by alstorer

if the road is too narrow for two cars and one bike (ie you can't safely pass a single cyclist without going into the other lane), why are a pair riding two abreast so offensive to you? You need to go slightly further over, but the length of road they're occupying is reduced.


Because two cyclist riding abreast is not legal on:

rule 66
never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends

If you live where I do. In a rural location... that has become some sort of cycling race track over the last 3 years. Packs of cyclists are a danger to themselves and car drivers.

Recently I over took a cyclist and a good half a mile further down the country lane I had to pull in as the road narrowed to allow an oncoming vehicle, that was already in the single lane section to come up the hill. The cyclist, in full training mode, was so absorbed in his efforts that he saw none of this until it was far to late for his brakes to make any impact on his high speed. He passed me and the on coming car as all the vehicles cross. Squeezing between the space between me and the on coming car. With a whisker to spare. Eventually he came to a halt 20 yards further down the road. And then proceeded to rain expletives at me... shouting why did I stop!!!!

If he had been splattered by the on coming car where do you think the finger of blame would get pointed first? At the car drivers. I'm afraid cyclist need to take a long hard look at there behaviour on the road. And stop pulling the... I'm the one that gets hurt card. Neglecting the fact that the car drive is most likely also hurt... just mentally scared for life... instead of physically.

I have to add that the road craft of MTB's seems far superior to the Bradley Wiggins wannabes, well certainly around my way.

Rant over.

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http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group


Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 1:17pm
Originally posted by Jack Sparrow


Because two cyclist riding abreast is not legal on:

rule 66
never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends
 
In the Highway Code, only parts that are marked MUST or MUST NOT involve definitions of legality. Rule 66 makes a recommendation, but fails to define "narrow" or "busy"- is a narrow road a two lane road with narrow lanes (see my post above for why this should make not the blindest bit of difference to your ability to pass) or is it a single track road (where yes, riding two abreast, especially round bends, is moronic).
If the road is busy (in both directions) with not enough space to pass a single cyclist, then again, two abreast should make no difference. If it is a larger group, then two abreast should in fact make it safer to overtake. Seriously. Think this through.

 Packs of cyclists are a danger to ... car drivers.
 
This irks me.


Recently I over took a cyclist
he's a moron
 
 


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-_
Al


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 1:24pm
clearly the answer is cycling on the road ought to carry mandatory 3rd party insurance.

That way the 'he said, she said' & saddlebags at dawn can be decided by groups of insurance firms and solictors making a pretty packet out of the situation- thus creating jobs, paperwork and soft industry.

If bad cyclists were then consistently unable to get insurance, (poor claims history) then the troublesome little sh*ts would be forced off the road.... just like the troublesome car drivers are who also can't get insurance with their drink driving and dangerous driving convictions.


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Posted By: gordon1277
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 1:37pm
Hi ALL
Another thing, why will people spend hundreds on bikes and not buy any lights! Especially Paper boys/girls. Parents should be shot for not making sure the kids have lights and not wairing all black to leave the house at 5am in the winter.
Both Wendy and I have come very close to hitting people on bikes because we did not see them.
Give other road users half a chance.

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Gordon
Lossc


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 1:38pm
Surely they would just ride uninsured, same as loads of car drivers?

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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 1:43pm
Most "serious" cyclists will have 3rd party insurance. Anyone with an expensive bike will likely have more comprehensive insurance, which will include 3rd party. Anyone with British Cycling membership has 3rd party insurance. Anyone with CTC membership has 3rd party insurance.
 
The cyclists that are less likely to have to insurance are those riding clunkers and junkers in town...
 
Riders without lights scare me in winter. Part of my commute goes along unlit, not really wide enough, cycle paths. In nasty weather, all of a sudden out the gloom appears this black shape weaving all over the bloody place...


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-_
Al


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 1:45pm
Originally posted by Rupert

Surely they would just ride uninsured, same as loads of car drivers?

I'm sure they would, but at least then they could be prosecuted and given community service... maybe washing the buses for the bus w**kers.


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Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 2:45pm
I'm a motorist not a cyclist, it's too bloody dangerous on roads for pushbikes.

To be honest I can't remember the last time I got irritated by a cyclist, yep some do push their luck but not many in my neck of the woods. Motorists on the other handDisapprove It's now the norm to see 1 or 2 cars sneak through on red or late amber, particularly at road works. Two lanes filtering down to one lane brings out the worst in many. Cars using a right turn lane to get ahead of those in the left lane. Mobile phone users. Fast lane hoggers on motor ways. Cars that deliberately speed up when you overtake........blah blah.

The bad driving is not exclusive to cyclists, the general standard across the board has declined and there seems to be fewer police around to discourage it.

Could the cause of the irritation be: Two sets of road users with completely different safety requirements and abilities being forced to share the same space with little or no policing...Perhaps it's the situation that is intolerable and not the folk. 


Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 3:10pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

Originally posted by Rupert

Surely they would just ride uninsured, same as loads of car drivers?

I'm sure they would, but at least then they could be prosecuted and given community service... maybe washing the buses for the bus w**kers.


Oh, don't get me started on buses... big queue behind, belching out smoke - how is that eco friendly? And no passengers on board. May as well run a minibus round most of the routes round here, but the delusional idea that people might ride in them who don't absolutely HAVE to keeps them sending monsters round the narrow roads.

My wife once worked out it would take her 2 hours to get the 6 miles to work if she took the bus.


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 4:02pm
Originally posted by Rupert


Oh, don't get me started on buses... big queue behind, belching out smoke - how is that eco friendly? And no passengers on board. May as well run a minibus round most of the routes round here, but the delusional idea that people might ride in them who don't absolutely HAVE to keeps them sending monsters round the narrow roads.

My wife once worked out it would take her 2 hours to get the 6 miles to work if she took the bus.

In rural areas buses don't really work as they take far too long to get you anywhere.

I used to live 8 miles from work and to get the bus each day would have take 1 hr 45 mins. I could do it in the car in around 20 mins even in rush hour.

In urban locations buses make much more sense as long as the service is reliable.


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Paul
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D-Zero GBR 74


Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 13 Jun 13 at 9:53pm
It's about time cars were taxed by postcode so those of us with almost non-existant bus services paid less.
 
I have a 12 minute drive to work which would take over an hour by bus of which 45 minutes would be walking! And that's assuming I can get one at the right time.


Posted By: timeintheboat
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 9:33am
Are any forumites thinking of doing any of the orgainsed bike events this year?

 


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Like some other things - sailing is more enjoyable when you do it with someone else


Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 9:45am
I seem to have a number to pin on my back for http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/The-Big-Bike-Ride/" rel="nofollow - this already , will proabably do http://www.bike-events.com/Ride.aspx?id=365" rel="nofollow - London-Cambridge  and I got a place for the http://www.prudentialridelondon.co.uk/" rel="nofollow - RideLondon 100 , which will be the longest I've ever cycled. I'm half heartedly raising money for AsthmaUK- I got a place through the ballot, but had applied to them for a back up fundraising place. When i got my ballot place, this freed me of any obligation to fund raise, but I'm doing it anyway. http://uk.virginmoneygiving.com/alstorer%20" rel="nofollow - Donations glady taken.

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-_
Al


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 9:51am
the first bit of my new bike has arrived...



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Posted By: JohnW
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 11:00am
This could change the game totally if they catch on

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22887729" rel="nofollow - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22887729  



Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 11:21am
Originally posted by JohnW

This could change the game totally if they catch on
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22887729" rel="nofollow - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22887729  

The flying pushbike - but with no more than 5 mins battery... So we can look forward to pedalcyclists attempting to fly over red traffic lights and running out of battery and crash landing right in front of a moving bus or lorry...


Posted By: timeintheboat
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 12:09pm
Originally posted by alstorer

I seem to have a number to pin on my back for http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/The-Big-Bike-Ride/" rel="nofollow - this already , will proabably do http://www.bike-events.com/Ride.aspx?id=365" rel="nofollow - London-Cambridge  and I got a place for the http://www.prudentialridelondon.co.uk/" rel="nofollow - RideLondon 100 , which will be the longest I've ever cycled. I'm half heartedly raising money for AsthmaUK- I got a place through the ballot, but had applied to them for a back up fundraising place. When i got my ballot place, this freed me of any obligation to fund raise, but I'm doing it anyway. http://uk.virginmoneygiving.com/alstorer%20" rel="nofollow - Donations glady taken.

Looks good on 23rd and I'd do the 100km but instead I'll be http://www.jollysailorsbrancaster.co.uk/Photos/4th%20TJS%20Beer%20Fest.pdf" rel="nofollow - here .

I'm looking at London -> Southend (July 21st) and Cambridge -> Norwich (Sep 29th). I'd like to do http://www.greatcycle.org/" rel="nofollow - this
but the logistics look tricky.

However, must do some more sailing this year.............


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Like some other things - sailing is more enjoyable when you do it with someone else


Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 12:22pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

Originally posted by Rupert

Surely they would just ride uninsured, same as loads of car drivers?

I'm sure they would, but at least then they could be prosecuted and given community service... maybe washing the buses for the bus w**kers.

Why would you punish a cyclist without insurance more harshly than a car driver without insurance?




Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 12:25pm
Originally posted by JimC

Originally posted by JohnW

This could change the game totally if they catch on
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22887729" rel="nofollow - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22887729  

The flying pushbike - but with no more than 5 mins battery... So we can look forward to pedalcyclists attempting to fly over red traffic lights and running out of battery and crash landing right in front of a moving bus or lorry...


And when they crash, they get a propeller blade straight through them, propelled by the lorry.

It looks like a wonderful toy, but the bike on ET was better.


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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 12:49pm
Originally posted by bustinben

Originally posted by yellowwelly

Originally posted by Rupert

Surely they would just ride uninsured, same as loads of car drivers?

I'm sure they would, but at least then they could be prosecuted and given community service... maybe washing the buses for the bus w**kers.

Why would you punish a cyclist without insurance more harshly than a car driver without insurance?



In an ideal world I wouldn't.  But driving without insurance is usually met with a 6 point penalty and a hefty fine.  As cyclists don't have a points based licence, and are obviously too poor to drive a motorcar, it seems ludicrous to penalise them financially and attempt to 'ban' them riding again.

Far better that they performed some civic service... maybe like clearing up dog sh*t in the park.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/22905640" rel="nofollow - http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/22905640


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Posted By: getafix
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 1:08pm
Ha ha ha ha LMAO, who is going to arrest all these un-insured 'dangerous' roadies? 

...the super-cops who arrest all the w*nkers in the middle lane of motorways constantly, or the 80mph+ speeders, or the double-parkers, or the overtakin-in-to-corners-superstars, or the bus-drivers who pull out without looking or the guy who went straight over the mini-roundabout in front of me this morning, or the girl who had the front to look annoyed at him while driving with her mobile clamped to her ear towards both of us?

I am just joe public, but it seems to me the fount of many of the problems on our roads is the total absence of the people who are employed to keep the law of the land... probably filling out forms to get the wing-mirrors fixed on their plod-mobiles in quadruplicate for some desk-jockey somewhere deep in whitehall... allegedly 


Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 1:14pm
Originally posted by timeintheboat

Are any forumites thinking of doing any of the orgainsed bike events this year?

 
I am meant to be doing a MTb Enduro event in the FOD in septem ber however it clashes with the battle of the classes so i may have to can it.  Not sure i am up to a 100mile road bike event again yet.  I managed 42miles on Saturday and felt it It made the 10 miles i did the next day hard work.  Staying off a road bike for 6 months has taken its toll on me.  Trying to build myself back up.

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Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 1:14pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

Originally posted by bustinben

Originally posted by yellowwelly

Originally posted by Rupert

Surely they would just ride uninsured, same as loads of car drivers?

I'm sure they would, but at least then they could be prosecuted and given community service... maybe washing the buses for the bus w**kers.

Why would you punish a cyclist without insurance more harshly than a car driver without insurance?



In an ideal world I wouldn't.  But driving without insurance is usually met with a 6 point penalty and a hefty fine.  As cyclists don't have a points based licence, and are obviously too poor to drive a motorcar, it seems ludicrous to penalise them financially and attempt to 'ban' them riding again.

Far better that they performed some civic service... maybe like clearing up dog sh*t in the park.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/22905640" rel="nofollow - http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/22905640

LOL  Too poor to drive a motorcar...  I guess that means everyone on this board is too poor to drive a speedboat too.


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 1:16pm
Surely GPS enabled Boris Bikes should be the only road legal ones...  

At least that way the Government dept that is Google (they don't pay corp tax, therefore must be public service) can  plot your journey on google earth to see if you were cycling on the pavement/through a red light.

Amazon could fulfil issuing of fines.  They're another government department that has taken over from the 'The Library' - a rarity of local governance and town trusts in former days.

And a final thought- Speed Awareness Workshops and Cycling Proficiency Tests could be run from a Starbucks.  (Starbucks now the non-corp tax paying government department that provides the country with its required level of calcium and lactose, an inevitability after Maggie stole our milk...)


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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 2:12pm
as I say, roadies will (likely) have insurance. I'd have thought MTBers with decent bikes would too. They won't have specifically bought 3rd party, it'll just have been thrown in as part of a package- premiums for 3rd paty insurance for cyclists are really, really low. Given that insurance premiums are a function of risk (liklihood of an accident occuring) and severity (how much the payout is likely to be), with an added "we've got a racket going as you have to have it" for car inusrance premium on top of that, the low cost of 3rd party insurance for cyclists should give you an indication of how dangerous to others your average cyclist actually is, rather than your perception.

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-_
Al


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 2:59pm
Originally posted by alstorer

indication of how dangerous to others your average cyclist actually is, rather than your perception.


Not to mention how likely said cyclist is to disappear over the horizon in the knowledge he's virtually impossible to identify unless he sticks around...


Posted By: ASok
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 5:57pm
Originally posted by yellowwelly

the first bit of my new bike has arrived...

As this is now a cycling forum......
 
What model is that saddle? I've got a Charge saddle on my MTB, its getting a bit tired now but is by far the best I've had. Beats the Fizik number that was fitted as standard and is considerably cheaper


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Posted By: Ruscoe
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 8:29pm
Looks like a fixie or bmx saddle charge bucket? The charge spoon or knjfe probably best for mtb or roadie

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Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 14 Jun 13 at 9:59pm
Charge Stool on a layback BMX post

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Posted By: ASok
Date Posted: 16 Jun 13 at 1:03pm
Ah yes. I have the spoon for mtb

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Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 17 Jun 13 at 12:12pm
Driving around London this weekend, what gene of f**kwit has embedded itself in the local cyclists's DNA?

Honestly, they were a nightmare- no signalling, cycling through the inside of junctions, weaving traffic like it's slalom downhill session...  I used to do a lot of driving in London for work, and there always were cyclists and in the main never had any issues, bar the odd courier bike trying to make a bonus.  However these swarms of (predominantly male cycle nerds) all on superGhey road bikes or uber-uncool fixies with orange wheels, seem to have taken over, even through semi-pedestrianised areas.

Is there a group think going on that says they're:

a) never in the wrong
b) never going to die
c) morally superior due to the green agenda, therefore exist in a different space/time continuum from the rest of the road users?

Honestly, I felt sorry for the cabbies and bus drivers... what a nightmare dealing with them everyday.


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Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 21 Jun 13 at 10:36am
new bike, yay!





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Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 21 Jun 13 at 11:32am
Originally posted by yellowwelly


Driving around London this weekend, what gene of f**kwit has embedded itself in the local cyclists's DNA?
Honestly, they were a nightmare- no signalling, cycling through the inside of junctions, weaving traffic like it's slalom downhill session...  I used to do a lot of driving in London for work, and there always were cyclists and in the main never had any issues, bar the odd courier bike trying to make a bonus.  However these swarms of (predominantly male cycle nerds) all on superGhey road bikes or uber-uncool fixies with orange wheels, seem to have taken over, even through semi-pedestrianised areas.
Is there a group think going on that says they're:
a) never in the wrong
b) never going to die
c) morally superior due to the green agenda, therefore exist in a different space/time continuum from the rest of the road users?
Honestly, I felt sorry for the cabbies and bus drivers... what a nightmare dealing with them everyday.



Yep.. that's about the size of it.... and we get the green lane peloton version... on a day out from the city... Nightmare.

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Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 22 Jun 13 at 8:25am
Originally posted by Jack Sparrow

Originally posted by yellowwelly


Driving around London this weekend, what gene of f**kwit has embedded itself in the local cyclists's DNA?
Honestly, they were a nightmare- no signalling, cycling through the inside of junctions, weaving traffic like it's slalom downhill session...  I used to do a lot of driving in London for work, and there always were cyclists and in the main never had any issues, bar the odd courier bike trying to make a bonus.  However these swarms of (predominantly male cycle nerds) all on superGhey road bikes or uber-uncool fixies with orange wheels, seem to have taken over, even through semi-pedestrianised areas.
Is there a group think going on that says they're:
a) never in the wrong
b) never going to die
c) morally superior due to the green agenda, therefore exist in a different space/time continuum from the rest of the road users?
Honestly, I felt sorry for the cabbies and bus drivers... what a nightmare dealing with them everyday.

 

  

Yep.. that's about the size of it.... and we get the green lane peloton version... on a day out from the city... Nightmare.

I do a huge amount of riding in london, and I agree to some extent - you see some horrendous roadcraft.  Once a month you normally pass someone being scraped off the road and put into an ambulance bit by bit.  But to play devils advocate and add some perspective:

1.  No signalling.  You can always spot the newbies, they ride along and pop their arm out straight like it says in the highway code.  They keep doing it until they get t**tted by a motorbike or a wing mirror, then they stop.

2.  Going up the inside at junctions - I don't do it because I don't have a death wish, but when councils have painted a cycle lane down the left side of a road, and there's stop start traffic so the bikes are making progress through the cars it's not exactly surprising.  The only other option is...

3.  Weaving in and out of cars - sucks that you're stuck in traffic and they're not eh LOL  Also note the massive conflict between moaning about this and moaning about point 2...

I think a healthy dose of realism is needed here - in London driving isn't like driving anywhere else. Nobody follows the rules whether on bike or in car.  If put on your bobby hat and start counting traffic offenses to the letter of the law, you might end up quite shocked.  Roughly 4-5 cars jump every red light on my commute, cars stop over the stop lines every time, motorbikes burn off like they're on an italian racetrack, bikes hop on and off pavements, pedestrians run out in front of approaching traffic.  Massive blinkers required to think that bicycles are the problem.


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 22 Jun 13 at 9:49am
I like the last bit- but London's arguably easier to drive in than Paris, but the French (for all their many faults) don't appear to have this attitude amongst their cyclists- well not the last time I drove through Paris.

BTW if you want scary, no rules driving try Athens.... 'King hell!!!!!

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Posted By: aardvark_issues
Date Posted: 22 Jun 13 at 1:48pm
At least these guys aren't out in their massive chelsea tractors or whatever londoners drive these days...


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Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 23 Jun 13 at 8:00am
Originally posted by bustinben

 
2.  Going up the inside at junctions - I don't do it because I don't have a death wish, but when councils have painted a cycle lane down the left side of a road, and there's stop start traffic so the bikes are making progress through the cars it's not exactly surprising.  The only other option is...

3.  Weaving in and out of cars - sucks that you're stuck in traffic and they're not eh LOL  Also note the massive conflict between moaning about this and moaning about point 2...


RE point 2 - If there is a cycle lane fair enough. It is when there is not and you pull away to find someone undertaking you on a bike who then proceed to shout and scream at you when clearly they must have been able to see the traffic moving off yet still elected to try and squeeze down the inside.

RE point 3 - Cyclist who do this in stop start traffic just have a death wish and it is simply a matter of time before their luck runs out and they require scraping off the road. It is, of course, always the car drivers fault as it is when there is a collision between a car and a motorbike.....


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Paul
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D-Zero GBR 74


Posted By: sargesail
Date Posted: 23 Jun 13 at 8:17am
If you miss them normally use the door for a second chance....


Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 23 Jun 13 at 8:40am
Riding a m/cycle round the outskirts of London as I do the thing that gets me about so many cyclists is their utter lack of situational awareness. They're often even worse than pizza delivery kids on mopeds.

An example that really wound me up was some cyclist tailgating me as I went down the oustide of a traffic queue. Coming the other way was a couple of cyclists and a car attempting to go past them, so I stopped and merged into the queue so the oncoming car wouldn't feel pushed towards the cyclists alongside him. The cyclist behind me overtakes and the car coming the other way nearly squashes his fellow cyclists...

Something I used to do in my days of rider training was say "OK, hands up who thinks you should bear in mind the possibility of someone coming the wrong way down a one way street towards you?" and no hands would go up. Followed by "OK, hands up who's seen someone going the wrong way down a one way street?" at which point nearly every hand would go up (its a long time since I've seen this happen so I guess road marking and layout must have improved considerably over the years).

Anyway, the point was made. Expect the unexpected and unlikely and nearly impossible, because you spend so much time on the road that its going to happen sooner or later. From what I can see most multi car traffic accidents are caused by *both* parties doing something they've got away with hundreds of times before, but when two not-quite-careful-enoough actions meet you get the accident. And of course its why both parties think they're innocent, its always if s/he hadn't done that there wouldn't have been an accident...


Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 24 Jun 13 at 10:19am
I completely agree you - the decisions that some make, given that they should have a heightened awareness is quite mind boggling.  What I don't agree with is highlighting cyclists as the problem though - There is a significant majority of car drivers who don't have the required situational awareness (or just don't care, because there's no danger of them hurting themselves by their actions).  The number of times I've had another cyclist cause me to have a near miss in 5 years of riding I could count on one hand.  On the flip side, there's at least 1 incident every day where a car does something completely inexplicable which has the potential to cause me serious injury.  I normally ride under the assumption that that is what every single car is going to do,  which is why I'm still here typing this post.  I've had about 5 experiences where there was absolutely nothing I could do and I was missed/dodged death by millimeters (e.g. car turns left from lane 2, car stops at give way line makes eye contact then pulls out anyway etc).  

Some cyclists might contribute to their own downfall, but IMO they're a 1% contributor to a very large problem.


Posted By: yellowwelly
Date Posted: 24 Jun 13 at 10:22am
Well if there's one thing I did notice it was the motorcyclists seemed a lot more placid than 10 or so years ago.  A sign of the times maybe.... core bikers are still on motorbikes, they were probably the road aware ones anyway, but city bonuses for dicks-with-a-deathwish only stretch to a Wilier or Bianchi these days, so Kawasaki crotch rockets are out.

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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 24 Jun 13 at 10:28am
I realise that two abreast is controversial, but yesterday whilst on a ride I was cycling with another guy when we were hooted at for doing so.
 
Thing is, we'd been going single file when we were aware of vehicles approaching from behind. This was on a quiet two lane single carriageway- the beeping vehicle was travelling in the opposite direction, and was not impeded in the slightest. Mind boggles. Just rude.
 
I did however feel a pang of sympathy on another stretch for drivers. I was on an organised ride with about 200 or so riders (well strung out by this stage), and for about five miles there was a full bore, larger, sportive going in the opposite direction. There were though plenty of signs, and using the nearby A10 would have added a mere couple of miles or so to their journey- is anything ever that urgent on a Sunday morning?


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-_
Al



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