Power boat drivers: wear your kill cord
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Topic: Power boat drivers: wear your kill cord
Posted By: alstorer
Subject: Power boat drivers: wear your kill cord
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 9:23am
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-22560652" rel="nofollow - As soon as anyone else saw the initial reports on this, were you able to see this conclusion coming?
Just waiting for the other bit of my suspcions, where it turns out he was driving in tight circles bouncing over his own wake.
A tragic case, but a powerful lesson to anyone driving a RIB or other rescue boat. ------------- -_ Al |
Replies:
Posted By: SoggyBadger
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 9:40am
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Definitely a Darwin Awards contender. Sadly he took his daughter with him.
------------- Best wishes from deep in the woods SB |
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 9:56am
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it's sober reading, whilst I've always used a kill cord on a RIB or powerboat, (why the f**k wouldn't you????) we have one fitted to our outboard (8HP) that powers our small family cruiser- a Beneteau 21 ft sailboat. We only use the engine to get out of the berth and out of the marina itself.... frankly it's a bit of putt-putt experience unless we can get sailing. I use less than half a small external outboard tank of fuel a year on average. I have usually clipped the kill cord to the back guard rail and engaged into the engine- it won't work without it. It's with easy reach of anyone in the cockpit, and I always give a quick safety chat to anyone coming onboard that includes, if in doubt, pull the red cable to stop the engine. I will be clipping it to me in the future. You just can't take chances. ------------- |
Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 10:13am
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A very sobering article. Unfortunately I bet there will be a lot of door slamming, unfortunately, in this instance, the horse is long gone. I always test the kill cord when I drive one of the club powerboats. Once when launching before the boat is free and then again once I have driven it round to moor up (just in case there is an issue when everything has been used. Yes i am probably paranoid but having been involved in a near miss myself a few years ago I want to be damn sure they are going to work if i need them to. ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: JohnW
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 10:46am
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Link to the MAIB safety bulletin from this incident: http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources.cfm?file=/SB1_13.pdf" rel="nofollow - http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources.cfm?file=/SB1_13.pdf |
Posted By: Late starter
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 10:47am
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I've only ever driven power boats as part of safety duty or instructing at the club. With 20 20 hindsight, I'm glad the club persuaded me (and all our other safety crews) to do the Level 2 Powerboat and the Safety Cox courses. I guess because we did the courses, safety protocols (such as wearing kill cords) became almost like second nature. It's become a bit fashionable in recent years to attack "Health and Safety", but I do now wonder if some form of regulation (eg mandatory training) of power boat drivers is warranted. |
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 11:33am
It seems crazy to me that insurance isn't mandatory. That would be the obvious 'hook', as premiums could reflect those with valid PB2 (or equivalent NCB) rather than legislating (and failing to enforce) who can or can't drive a powerboat. A problem for definition in itself, does a blow-up Avon tender with a 2HP constitute a 'powerboat'? ------------- |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 12:12pm
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Err... thankfully these accidents happen very rarely, I don't think any more legislation is needed in the UK. If it is, let's start with tax,insurance and a test for cyclist! ;-) ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 12:16pm
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good point, I guess it's easy to lose sight of that when the incident is so fresh. ------------- |
Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 1:21pm
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mandatory insurance/tests/licences is something the RYA have long lobbied against. ------------- -_ Al |
Posted By: PeterG
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 2:39pm
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mandatory insurance/tests/licences is something the RYA have long lobbied against.
Unfortunately the fact that an issue is something the RYA lobbies against is no longer any guarantee that I am in agreement with their position. They can be a bit like the AA at times - anything that might impact on boat users other than positively must be opposed regardless. While an Avon Redstart (if they still make them) with a 2hp Seagull on the back may pose little risk to either the users or the rest of the world (provided they wear earplugs), the same cannot be said of 8m RIBs with 100+HP on the back. Misused, they represent a very real threat to both the occupants and others. I would think that a very good case could be made for requiring 3rd party insurance and training before being let loose in a powerful motorboat, and a knee jerk reaction otherwise from the RYA would do nothing to increase my respect for them. ------------- Peter Ex Cont 707 Ex Laser 189635 DY 59 |
Posted By: Mister Nick
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 5:22pm
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I read somewhere that his wife was driving the boat in tight figures of 8 with their daughter sitting on her lap. Apparently they'd only owned the boat for 2 weeks. That's an incredibly powerful kit to be messing about with without using a kill cord. Very silly and very upsetting. I always use a kill cord, without fail. I hate driving boats without them. I used to race on a yacht that lived on a swinging mooring and the owner had a RIB to get us all out there. I remember driving the RIB back from the mooring on my own once in some very, very bad weather, but the boat didn't have a kill cord fitted. It just made me so nervous, I don't understand how it can slip peoples minds. It's the first thing I do before I even turn the key, never had an issue remembering. They're not just useful for if you fall out of the boat. It's really good to have a way to kill the engine in a hurry too. In Cowes week last year we took our RIB from Cowes back to Hamble at about 1 in the morning. We hit the wake of the Red Jet at a dodgy angle and the boat took off, chucking one of the guys right into the front of the boat. Stupid mistake but it's easily done when it's dark, rough and you're in a small boat. I pulled the cord straight away, didn't even bother with the throttle control. If he'd gone over the bow with the engine running he'd have been stuffed. It was far safer to just pull the chord than it would have been to try and get the throttle into neutral in time. Mandatory tests and licensing are a really bad idea. The Powerboat 2 qualification is living example of why little bits of paper don't mean a thing in situations like this. Yeah, they tell you to wear a killcord, how to approach a dock, how to pick up a MOB. Doesn't mean that lots of the people who've got the certificate are actually capable of doing that/will do that. Legislation is just going to cost lots of uneccesary money, and is unlikely to even work. How do you enforce it? A harbour master can poodle up to a big 300HP RIB and ask him for his licence, but what stops the guy in the RIB just driving off? RIBs aren't like cars, they're far harder to identify. There are at least 2 other RIBs identical to mine that live on swinging moorings where I sail, and it's not even a particularly common type of RIB.
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Posted By: PeterG
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 6:36pm
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Mandatory tests and licensing are a really bad idea. The Powerboat 2 qualification is living example of why little bits of paper don't mean a thing in situations like this. Yeah, they tell you to wear a killcord, how to approach a dock, how to pick up a MOB. Doesn't mean that lots of the people who've got the certificate are actually capable of doing that/will do that.
Of course you can't be 100% sure that people who have a PBL2 are going to behave sensibly on the water, anymore than the same can be said about car/bike drivers. However, at least by forcing people to do some minimal training there is a better chance that those who are not inherently stupid won't do something stupid out of ignorance. In this specific case having being told to wear a kill chord would have made a vast difference, had it been acted on. So really no idea where you are coming from with it being a "really bad idea", in what way is it likely to make things worse, which is your implication. ------------- Peter Ex Cont 707 Ex Laser 189635 DY 59 |
Posted By: Mister Nick
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 7:13pm
It's a waste of resources, it's not going to work. 99.9% of boat users will be fully aware of what a kill cord does and will know that they should be wearing it. I highly doubt that this guy managed spend 20+ grand on a nice new RIB without wondering what this shiny bit of bright red chord dangling from his throttle did. Yes, by training people and getting them to have a licence there is a better chance that stuff like this won't happen, but you could gain far more by just showing people the dangers and leaving them to make their own decision. The type of person who buys an expensive boat and then drives it dangerously is not the type of person who is going to respond well to being forced to do a training course. Any kind of legislation or mandatory licencing is just going to be a knee jerk reaction to pressure being applied by people who don't understand what they're talking about. There is a huge amount of opposition to this all over the internet, from both inexperienced people and people who make a living using powerboats and drive them professionally. It's not going to make the situation worse, but I feel that it's a waste of time and resources that are better spent on other methods to reduce the risk. |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 8:05pm
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It's another example of mis management by the sports Governing body, if anyone at the RYA knew anything about power craft they would long ago have moderated the recommendations for all power craft. Back in the seventies, the competition arm of the BWSF decreed that racing power and ski tow boats be fitted with a foot throttle with a return spring, this rendered the traditional control into a simple in or out of gear mechanism.
So if the driver were flung from the craft it immediately slowed to a standstill, they also had the redundant safety of the kill cord as a back up option. Even now RNLI boats don't have it I've watched on two separate occasions them flip backwards (they never appreciate wind either)and spill their contents in the sea and the boat upside down props still spinning. The other point of foot throttles is the control of having both hands on the wheel, essential for travelling at speed over waves and to correct the boats attitude in the air, the way things are now, one hand on the wheel the other on the hand throttle control is ludicrously dangerous as it also encourages the habit of sitting on the side of the boat. Fundamental obervation by power boaters, never trust sailors around power craft and as for that ludicrous power and safety boat 2 exam, you can drive a coach and horses through it, it's so full of holes. |
Posted By: PeterG
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 8:26pm
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Yes, by training people and getting them to have a licence there is a better chance that stuff like this won't happen, but you could gain far more by just showing people the dangers and leaving them to make their own decision.
When and where do you do that? On a powerboat course perhaps? You aren't suggesting anything much different to what I am. People will make their own decisions whatever, I am not suggesting power cords should be compulsory (though GRF's suggestion would seem to have merit for high powered boats), just that - as you suggest - people should be shown the dangers before the start. On of the best ways to do that is to ensure they take a course. There may be limitations to the course, and the quality of tuition varies, but at least it provides a way of ensuring that people are stupid by choice rather than by ignorance. It's a start, and probably all that can be achieved in practice. I'm not greatly in favour of compulsory licencing for on water activities in general, but unlike most others modern high powered RIBs are increasingly popular and have the potential to cause real harm and damage to others than just the driver. That is the key issue for me. If I go and drown myself being a prat on my Contender that's my business, but I'm not likely to harm any one else doing so. That is not true of a large powerful RIB. ------------- Peter Ex Cont 707 Ex Laser 189635 DY 59 |
Posted By: Mister Nick
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 8:41pm
A powerboat course is not right format to distribute such advice. As I said, very few people are going to respond well to being forced to be a training course. People are already stupid by choice rather than ignorance, I could go and ask a 9 year old Optimist sailor what a kill cord does and they'd be able to tell me without any issue. Similarly, I would be willing to bet that this guy in Padstow knew exactly what the killcord was too. It needs to be handled by high-profile organisations like the RYA advertising these kinds of stories (ie. Padstow), signs in Marinas, netural methods that leave it up to the individual without pressurising them. I don't think there's anyone who just point blank disagrees with wearing a kill cord. Most people just forget to put them on. You need to remind them in places where it matters, rather than relying on an inefficient training course that will probably be forgotten about in a matter of minutes. Oh course, I totally agree with you. RIBs do have the capacity to do horrendous damage, as we've seen. But we need to implement solutions that actually work, I don't see the point of forcing a community of boaters to do something that the majority are totally opposed to. If anything, you could end up with people having an attitude that just disregards what the course teaches because people don't want to be there.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 17 May 13 at 8:56pm
| RIB manufacturers should be forced to fit their boats with foot operated throttles, no-one in their right mind would seriously suggest otherwise, you'd fail your driving test if you drove a car with one hand on the steering wheel and the road doesn't bounce about like the sea. |
Posted By: laser4000
Date Posted: 18 May 13 at 12:40pm
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this looks like a sensible buy http://www.tridentuk.com/sailing/Univeral-Outboard-Motor-Lanyard-Kill-Switch-WL-3CL117.html" rel="nofollow - http://www.tridentuk.com/sailing/Univeral-Outboard-Motor-Lanyard-Kill-Switch-WL-3CL117.html
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Posted By: rogerd
Date Posted: 18 May 13 at 1:07pm
I am worried I am agreeing with grumpf again. It hadn't occurred to me about foot throttles but why not. The only other vehicle I can think of with a hand throttle that's stays in the position you leave it is a tractor. |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 18 May 13 at 7:47pm
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There are quite a few reasons why foot throttles are not the best idea. A lee shore recovery is a good example of where you need to keep the engine running whilst at the same time being able to move around your boat. Not ideal, but necessary. Driving a rib for race management or safety duty is not the same as driving a powerboat for waterski-ing. If you cannot steer effectively with one hand whilst operating the throttle with the other then there is something seriously wrong with your steering! In pb2 we teach that is it far more important to have a hand on the throttle than it is to sterr - a good well maintained steering mech will ensure this is safe and possible. I would have thought it much more possible for a foot throttle to become jammed or accidentally knocked in a busy boat than it is for a hand throttle. As for pb2 being an inefficient course - nonsense! It's actually the best way there is to learn to operate a powerboat and safely in almost any environment, and the best way there is to pick up good habits. Everyone I have ever taught has thoroughly enjoyed the course and said how much they had learned (including those already driving pbs) not just about driving, but about safety afloat at all times. ------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 18 May 13 at 7:47pm
http://www.bobsmachineshop.com/products/controls_foot.cfm%20" rel="nofollow - Here
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 18 May 13 at 7:51pm
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Wing wang with all due respect you're talking bollox.
The first thing they teach you is to come alongside and kill the engine. I had to write to them to point out the error of their ways, it may be OK piddling around puddles with a hand throttle, one on the wheel one on the throttle but it is not in waves. And really kill the engine near a lee shore? If that guy had been forced to sit in rather than sit up he'd still be alive today and so would his daughter. |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 18 May 13 at 7:59pm
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.what would I know, I'm just a powerboat instructor. I don't think I've ever taught anyone to come alongside and automatically kill the engine. And if you read what I said more carefully instead of instinctively disagreeing with me, you'd see I said NOT to kill the engine on a lee shore. Yes, powerboating is different on the sea, but a hand throttle is still safer than that anitquated hinge thing you've shown. I can't imagine what would happen if something/someone got wedged in or on that. Look at pictures of the rib that was driven in the accident - and put your glasses on this time - very secure seating, just plain stupid driving. ------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 18 May 13 at 8:43pm
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And a kill cord is just as important on a little Zodiac with a 3hp outbard as on any bigger RIB. We won't drive without it but then we've done our PB2.
The club ribs we drive now have knobs on the steering wheel making driving one handed easier and you are taught to keep your hand on the knob!
Even when I was driving a 25hp Orkney without any training common sense dictated the use of the kill cord. Personally I wouldn't have a problem with a requirement for a qualification but I also would suggest the government taxes caravans by length and boats by engine horsepower (wind is free). At least a few of the "Romford Cowboys" might be tamed.
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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 19 May 13 at 12:02am
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You can cheerfully have 20-30hp on a lightweight boat on a tiller control - and it can make a lot of sense from boat layout to do so. A foot control on such layouts would be tricky, to say the least. On 10hp or less set ups, a tiller control is ALL that makes sense- and those don't stop the prop unless you stick them in neutral or pull the kill cord. ------------- -_ Al |
Posted By: Contender443
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 9:16am
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I also don't think a foot throttle is a good idea especially in the small ribs we use. I like both feet firmly fixed to the floor just to keep my balance. If one foot is using a throttle this will not be the case. Then what happens when you slip or bounce off of a wave. You could get more (or less) power just when you don't want it. There also the racing marks to consider, you just need to be bringing one of those on board and drop the anchor on the foot throttle and you are off unexpectedly. What about a foot pedal that operates just to put the boat into drive so that the boat will only move when it is kept down. That way you can keep a firm and steady footing. Of course the real proble could be the way that we sit and perch ourselves especially in the larger ribs. ------------- Bonnie Lass Contender 1764 |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 9:20am
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the rules around seating in training RIBS have been changed for those training centres that offer the more advanced pb courses or operateon the sea. Seat backs are becoming compulsory partly for safety and partly to prevent spinal damage that is so prevalent in those that use ribs a lot. i've used a fair few seagoing RIBs that have foot holders for rougher conditions. ------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 10:33am
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The whole point of a foot throttle is that is forces the driver to be seated in, rather than on or astride those ridiculously unsafe benches that raise of the centre of gravity whilst increasing the windage.
Little sit behind with egg whisk inflatables are surely not what is under discussion here, surely we're talking about the high performance end of the spectrum. We raced the very first ribs back in 1976, we had to flip it and totally rework the rocker initially, then strip the bench out and fit side by side seats, it still didn't prevent it, I swear to God, going round one buoy up on it's side at full ninety degrees, they are the most inherently unstable of crafts at high speed. After that we ditched it and returned to a slightly more conventional boat. I've since owned two more and nothing much has improved from then 'til now, diabolical things, all accidents waiting to happen. Foot throttles are the very least that should be legislated, I've seen them set up with no Engine offset, no weight forward, fuel tanks and batteries not secured, I've given up going anywhere near them rather than spot all the probabilities for disaster. |
Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 11:03am
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You mention the word "spectrum" there. Trouble is legal restrictions don't like "spectrums", they like lines. So, at what combination of power and boat size would you draw the line requiring a proper seat and a foot throttle? ------------- -_ Al |
Posted By: jeffers
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 11:42am
Sorry but having been an (ill) passenger of a rib ride up the Solent over a rolling swell I would NOT want a foot throttle as you would not be able to control the throttle. ------------- Paul ---------------------- D-Zero GBR 74 |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 11:58am
Well you're lucky I'm not in charge then aren't you, I'd have you projectile vomiting all over the Solent.. 
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Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 12:48pm
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in defence of the PB2... probably the second most important bit of my DI course, the most important was the First Aid. I've been around boats all my life, but driving a 200HP PB outside the harbour walls at South Shields (Tynemouth) in February on a F5/6 sea was a bloody sobering experience... not for the feint hearted!!! Responsible sales and marketing would include a demonstration to a 'new customer' as part of the handover. Of course this adds cost, eats into margin, doesn't cover aftermarket sales etc... but either the industry takes responsibility and ensures this happens across the board or it can face a future that includes a regulated framework.
------------- |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 1:16pm
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we make it dirt cheap so that members will take it up. I'm wondering if it should be compulsory, in which case it should be free or at cost in return for a set number of duites ------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: PeterG
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 3:19pm
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We've made PB2 compulsory for support boat helms. We did offer free direct assessment for existing experienced drivers, but new ones, who need to do the full course do have to pay, though it's very heavily discounted to a small fraction of a commercial cert. ------------- Peter Ex Cont 707 Ex Laser 189635 DY 59 |
Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 4:21pm
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Quick question: What is the legal requirement regarding insurance with water craft?
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 5:00pm
None. Anyone can walk into a store or visit ebay, buy a high powered jet ski or rib and tear around to their hearts content, no license no insurance no need to register with any authority. Marvellous thing freedom isn't it, worth fighting to protect by educating and encouraging club membership etc etc. |
Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 5:11pm
A partial solution springs to mind. You cannot regulate against stupidity, that's evident on the roads but I bet most of us are glad it's a legal requirement. |
Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 6:26pm
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insurance for all drivers of all "power boats"? Or would you somehow exclude rubber dinghies with put-put engines? Draft that one... ------------- -_ Al |
Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 6:35pm
| Make it "compulsory insurance for drivers of ALL boats". After all we don't have powerful engines on our racing dinghies yet the insurance companies receive plenty of claims. Though most will insure because of the theft risk and that policy will normally include third party liability. |
Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 6:44pm
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All power boats sounds OK to me. They're all potential meat liquidisers, leg breakers or skull crushers. Even if it needs categorising, say excluding put puts, it would still be a much simpler task than road insurance.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 7:07pm
| Well most responsible folk insure their craft of course and it is mandatory for competition and probably safety use, for the expedience of theft protection and potential third party liability, but you asked about it being a legal requirement which it isn't, it's part of the fundamental raison d'être of the RYA, standing as it does in the stead of a Government department. |
Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 7:39pm
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The debate over regulation Vs individual autonomy/responsibility is as old as philosophy itself, it'll never go away or be resolved as an argument. One things for sure though, the more often these things happen, the more likely regulation becomes and imo, rightly so.
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Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 7:41pm
agreed totally... glad it's quite a rare occurrence. ------------- |
Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 20 May 13 at 9:22pm
I see you mentioned mandatory insurance earlier (now I've read the entire thread). I'll try and keep up in future. So insurance is a legal requirement on inland waters. Just found this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiGcNtb6me8" rel="nofollow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LiGcNtb6me8
It would seem that a suitable framework for licensing and insurance already exists then. I wouldn't think it would need much alteration for coastal use? |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 21 May 13 at 8:39am
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Again if you're the responsible type, which to a large extent Darwin decrees amongst those who would go to 'the sea in ships' since for a large part the sea very quickly punishes the stupid, then Insurance becomes mandatory simply because of the necessity when in Marina's because of the potential interaction with other craft/third party liability etc.
I recall even as a young irresponsible water skier back in the early seventies, before we took up competition, we were all insured, even the drug runners, because of the high risk of loss in the Channel (high speed terminal nose dives were a bit of an issue). Now and again you'd get the morons turning up in their baths (quite literally tin baths with an outboard) on some stupid cross channel bid that wouldn't be, but someone would generally have a word with them, like that t**t that tried to circumnavigate Sheppey thinking it was the UK, I bet he wasn't insured, but then there's no charge for rescue either, by and large it is a volunteer operation. There is a delightful anarchy about boats and boating and long may it last, inland things are different, a lot easier to patrol and police, the Norfolk broads was the first place I experienced and had to pay a license and have a number stuck on my windsurfer for, I never went back there. I also had the ludicrous irony despite having an offshore powerboat license and having campaigned all over the UK and Cross Channel events, of having to sit the RYA Power or Safetyboat 2 test. I did in fact point out to them at the time it was full of potential safety issues, this, just in order to take a rib onto Roadford reservoir during a kids windsurfing rally which my three were attending, never went back there either. The sea is the only totally free place on the planet, hence why I like to spend so much time on it, not that it stops the odd Range boat shouting the odds at you if you stray to close to the ranges, I wonder how Insurance cover stacks up against being shot. |
Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 21 May 13 at 9:21am
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Pretty sure that "sunk by heavy artilley" would be excluded by your insurance company :p
I'm quite in agreement though- whilst on rivers, canals, lakes etc- even estuaries and harbours- I can understand that there's a proper owner who can, frankly, set the rules (though Scottish access laws would be better), the sea should be less regulated. ------------- -_ Al |
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 21 May 13 at 9:54am
 private water company reservoirs are different from lakes of course. ------------- |
Posted By: transient
Date Posted: 21 May 13 at 11:27am
The anarchy you talk about is appealing but does it really exist within dinghy or yacht sailing? Those of us who belong to sailing clubs are required to be insured. If the standard of our sailing was a danger to ourselves or others the senior instructor would no doubt ask us to attend some training. The anarchy you talk about exists with windsurfing, surfing, BMXing, skateboarding etc and I definitely think it's great for pushing boundaries (these folk are only a danger to themselves generally)......but not in club sailing, the anarchy has gone.....I have no problem if those who are not affiliated to a club are forced to play by the same rules as us. As for the freedom to jump into a mega horsepower meat mincer and carve up the coast with the potential to kill someone else without insurance or training......well, I don't actually want that kind of freedom. I understand why some folk do though. |
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 21 May 13 at 12:04pm
it exists to a level with windsurfing, although most windsurfers I know do insure their kit and by association have the third party liabilities covered... 3 boards, 5 sails, 2 booms and 2 hi-carb content masts and a plethora of other kit... well it all adds up. ------------- |
Posted By: sargesail
Date Posted: 21 May 13 at 1:35pm
Hmmm "Target, lone windsurfer "i GRF", 200m, 10 Rds Rapid....Fire."
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Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 21 May 13 at 1:51pm
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According the Director of Internet Pimping for Star-Borg Windsurfing, Grumpf doesn't actually windsurf anymore. ------------- |
Posted By: blueboy
Date Posted: 26 May 13 at 1:53pm
Hmmmm to that. I've driven some club RIBS that were pigs to steer single-handed. However a foot operated throttle strikes me as an accident waiting to happen on safety RIBS. |
Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 30 May 13 at 2:26pm
I assume there some long and complex rant about how shortboards wrecked it that goes with that story
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