port/ starboard
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Racing Rules
Forum Discription: Discuss the rules and your interpretations here
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10839
Printed Date: 28 Jun 25 at 4:30am
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Topic: port/ starboard
Posted By: mangoman
Subject: port/ starboard
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 9:46am
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I am coming up to the windward mark on port; the next leg is still to windward but more of a tight fetch on port. I am probably a boat's length or so away from the mark lining up for the next leg. Another boat is coming up to the mark on starboard but on his present course I will easily pass in front of him; as he gets to the mark he heads up as he has overstood the mark by quite a bit and calls starboard on me forcing me to tack off to avoid him. I may be wrong but I don't think he can alter course like that to get into a right of way position ? |
Replies:
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 10:11am
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Why did you tack off if you were easily going to pass in front? I had this yesterday, rounding on port, leeward port on starboard coming up trying a hail to confuse.. just tell them to hold their course, if they clip you then you deal with it by doing your turns, if you know they're going to hit you then rightly tack off, difficult to prove in a starboard port confrontation that they altered course to bring about the situation.
Short answer either call their bluff or tack off, only you know if you would have cleared them anyway. He's going to argue that you made him tack off anyway, so unless there is a collision, no harm done, but likely you'll end up in the protest room anyway if it's a serious race, just because of the close proximity. So, either you are clear ahead and there was no chance or he's close enough to call, that is the deciding factor.. |
Posted By: Brass
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 10:20am
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Opposite tacks on a beat to windward ... no mark-room for you there (rule 18.1( a )) Other boat with right of way on starboard changing course ... must give you room to keep clear (rule 16.1). You tacked away and kept clear. No rule broken.
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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 11:20am
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Why would he "head up" if he's "over stood" Surely he''d have to bear off? ------------- -_ Al |
Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 11:34am
Sounds like they are rounding the mark on the Stbd side of the boat. The other way to most racing. ------------- Needs to sail more... |
Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 11:48am
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I guess this was at buoy 31, to be left to starboard before continuing on, on a port fetch as you say, to 30? It was easy to over-stand 31 as the tide was sweeping you above it, so Mr Starboard's hardening up was probably done without malice, as he was just coming onto the beat again after close reaching in to the mark having overstood. He had to pay heed to Rule 16.1 "When a right-of-way boat changes course, she shall give the other boat room to keep clear". Apparently he did this though , as you were indeed able to keep clear? ------------- http://www.wilsoniansc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilsonian SC http://www.3000class.org.uk" rel="nofollow - 3000 Class |
Posted By: mangoman
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 11:55am
I was going to pass ahead until they altered course hardening up into the wind as they passed the mark; then they were coming straight at me so I had to tack to avoid the collision. I see it that they cannot alter course to get into that position forcing me to take avoiding action and should have held their course and gone behind me; if the mark had not been there and I was happily sailing along on port and I knew I was going to pass clear ahead and then they suddenly alter course I thought they had no rights ? |
Posted By: mangoman
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 11:56am
Mark was to be left to starboard and there was a strong tide pushing you down on to the mark just to exarcebate the situation |
Posted By: mangoman
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 12:00pm
Yes I suppose I did have room to tack and keep clear; just a bit miffed that it put me going in the wrong direction at the time. Anyway, as us who were there know with what happened with the wind later it made no difference ! |
Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 12:10pm
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I suspect, Mike, that you have fond memories of the proper rules of yore, in particular Rule 35 which stated that "the right of way yacht shall not alter course to prevent the other yacht from keeping clear..." Except, that rule went on to say "except when assuming a proper course....when rounding a mark", so you'd have been stuffed then as well! ------------- http://www.wilsoniansc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilsonian SC http://www.3000class.org.uk" rel="nofollow - 3000 Class |
Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 1:45pm
But you wouldn't as the other boat was obviously not sailing upwind, on a normal beat with no mark you would have been both as close to the wind as possible. ------------- Needs to sail more... |
Posted By: laser193713
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 2:26pm
Could have just ducked him if you REALLY didn't want to tack! Unless I am mistaken there is no rule stating that "A boat on port tack shall be allowed to remain on port tack if that is her chosen direction up the beat, a boat on starboard tack must allow her to pass ahead so that she is not forced to tack undesirably." 
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Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 2:56pm
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Ducking would most likely have involved mangoman (I must ask you where you got that handle from, Mike) running headlong into a very solid navigation mark. But Mike's objection seems to me the usual one to rounding windward marks to starboard. Port tackers have to ensure they have a lot of room to manoeuvre round incoming starboard tackers. That said, when I'm 20 boats back in a big fleet queued up on starboard coming into a port-rounded windward mark, those few extra boat-lengths that I'd need to sail to enable me to give way at a starboard rounded mark don't seem a bad option. ------------- http://www.wilsoniansc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilsonian SC http://www.3000class.org.uk" rel="nofollow - 3000 Class |
Posted By: mangoman
Date Posted: 22 Apr 13 at 5:15pm
I'll explain where the name came from one day !! There is no way I could have ducked him, I just didn't anticipate his huge change of direction Looks like I'll just have to be more aware in future situations I probably should have hailed that I couldn't tack because of the moored boats to windward of me .... well they were about 30 yards away I guess .... takes me a long time to turn that thing round you know ...... perhaps I should have said I thought we were using AC rules.... |