Why I like/hate the boat I am currently sailing.
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10820
Printed Date: 17 Jul 25 at 4:53am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Why I like/hate the boat I am currently sailing.
Posted By: rogerd
Subject: Why I like/hate the boat I am currently sailing.
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 9:01am
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After boots review of the Alto I thought we should have a why I like my boat thread.
My new boat is a 1957 Jack Holt designed Merlin Rocket. Only three sails so far and I am learning how she works and what I need to change.
However my first impressions are that she is suited to the shifty puddle I sail on. Quick to tack, stable to gybe even with a very young and inexperienced crew and showed our transom to the very good Comet sailor we have.
Still trying to sort a second hand mast to replace the stiff wooden one she came with and save the woody for cvrda events.
Only downside so far is when we capsized the boat filled up with water and only a lot of bailing could save us so it was race over. The young lad was very cold so time to go in anyway.
Best bit for him was overtaking his older brother. Best bit for me I found I could more or less single hnad her and a really lovely responsive boat.
I have never owned a Merlin before but I can see why they are so popular.
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Replies:
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 10:18am
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Good thread Roger! Why I like the boat I am sailing? Class Racing- it's delivering what I bought it for Why I am surprised I like the boat I am sailing? It's actually quite nice, feels solid and you don't capsize every time you have a wonky gybe. I also like the sail very much, it's the first one since sailing oppies that I feel I've got to set nicely. Why I hate* the boat I am sailing? It's a stark reminder to how good class racing is, and a damn shame our club doesn't have a fleet of Finns anymore. (50+ back in the late 70's apparently). The Finn would probably suit my weight better than being at the top end of a Solo, sailing inland predominantly in the evening summer series. * hate is a strong word, if anyone hates their boat then they really need to sell it, or indeed destroy it as if you truly hate someone or something, then the financial implication of their destruction is of little concern.
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 10:25am
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My current boats are;
An old wooden miracle which my daughter loves to go out in as she has some where to sit. Its easy to both rig and sail by my self (though im learning on doing 3 sails). The down sides are the fear of damaging the pain/varnish that i spent a whole winter re-doing.
A dart 18 which i have wanted since i was a boy. She is fast and i cna sial her on my onw very happily. Its nice to have some where to lie down when there is nex to no wind. Its great for taking away and sailing of a beach. The only real down side is th ecost of replacement parts but as they last along time its not so bad.
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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 10:46am
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Love the Lightning for the easy rigging, great acceleration, ease of maneuvering, and most of all, the excellent atmosphere at open meetings. Gybing in a strong wind... maybe not my most loved aspect! Minisail - love the quirkiness, the scow bow, reaching downwind in a blow. Upwind, not so sure about. Would love it if there were more people playing in them as 2nd or 3rd boats - a dead cheap way to get lots of fun. Firefly - Love everything apart from bailing out after a swim! ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: JimC
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 11:15am
| I have an International Canoe: 'nuff said... |
Posted By: rogerd
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 11:19am
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Ok dislike.
Last year I bought a british moth and disliked it a great deal. I just couldnt get her to go. Rupert borrowed her for an event and told me he thought it was very heavy and he, a better sailor than me struggled with it.
It really knocked my confidence so she went on ebay pretty quickly and the B in BM became bl**dy Moth until it had gone.
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Posted By: fleaberto
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 11:20am
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My Lightning is super-easy to rig, pretty easy to get going in the 'confidence inspiring' light winds and feels racey as the wind speed rises a little - so a great way of starting out in single handers.
Turns into a handful in a bit of a blow, but hey, that's part of the fun? The chatty, relaxed, sociable atmosphere at Opens is probably my ultimate favourite part. The boat suits me supremely well, but it's the people that keep me turning out to come 15th at events
 Downside? - downwind/gybing in a blow?. My technique actually involves working out how quickly I'll recover from the inevitable swim
EPS? - Now I love it. Honestly, I really do. Comfortable, easy to sail (Honestly) and, for me, can realise some superb high speed reaches (I only weigh 70kg). It's my 'blast' boat and I have a blast everytime I sail it. Even after a tough day I don't think I've not been smiling after sailing this boat.
Downside? - It's a bloody long way to try and get back in when you're out on Wing-Hole 7 and you drop into a lull! ------------- Lightning368 'All the Gear' (409), Lightning368 'Sprite' (101), Laser (big number) 'Yellow Jack', RS Vareo (432)'The Golden Rays' |
Posted By: robin34024
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 11:23am
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having handicap raced a topper at our puddle for the past 3 years, i never got any competitive racing at my own club. the time came to move out, and i tried the laser, but hated it, so i decided to try the streaker, as i would at least be able to race the few solo's and maybe the odd enterprise. now, half a year later we have at least 2 other boats that i can race against, and although it doesn't sound like much, its far better than trailing around behind the whole fleet in a topper... the streaker is also a really comfortable boat, and suits our little, shifty water perfectly, being very light, quick and easy to tack :D ------------- |
Posted By: themeaningoflife
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 11:23am
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RS800- Massive learning curve, unbelievable acceleration, perhaps too stable to keep it challenging without lots of class racing though, having come from the 29er. 29er- Beautifully twitchy, especially in waves, that means there is always something new to learn. The youth class racing scene is fantastic, half my closest friends I've met through the class. RS200- Great class racing, easy to take a beginner out in, but still maintains a challenge, especialyl when it's windy. Also reminds me how to hike in the holidays when not team racing. Firefly- Team Racing boats good only for that, Team Racing, since they are very heavily built, with over-specced sails and rubbish controls. However we are doing up a classic racing Firefly for Itchenor School's Championship, which hopefully will be quicker/racier. ------------- Cambridge University Lightweight Rowing Club RS800 1128 kindly sponsored by http://www.rwo-marine.com" rel="nofollow - RWO Marine |
Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 11:29am
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3000: - Like: easy trapeze asymmetric, ideal for our light (120kg) weight. The V planes very early. Low to water - fun. Easy to wheel about on land. - Dislike: playing with Wayfarers in light airs - 3k doesn't have a lot of sail. Can be wet to sail and thus cold in winter. ------------- http://www.wilsoniansc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilsonian SC http://www.3000class.org.uk" rel="nofollow - 3000 Class |
Posted By: JohnW
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 12:01pm
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Albacore - what's not to like about cruising along at 20 knots! ------------- |
Posted By: pondmonkey
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 12:07pm
The fact that rest of the Albacores go whizzing past at 30? ------------- |
Posted By: Mister Nick
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 12:20pm
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RS500 Likes - It's quick and a lot of fun when you get it going. Pretty easy to sail in moderate wind. Dislikes - No self-tacking jib, really hard to gybe without the kite, very difficult to sail on a reach when it's windy, mainsail is a bit of a pain to depower. J80 Likes - Fast, rewards good crew work, fairly simple to sail, fantastic class, can take a lot of abuse and feels very safe, even when it's been knocked totally flat. Dislikes - The only thing I can think of is the weight limit. We really struggle upwind when it's breezy because we're too close to the weight limit for another person but still too far off it to keep up with the fatties. Other than that there's nothing I can think of, it's a brilliant boat.
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Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 12:24pm
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EPS, I like that everything worked (until I messed about with stuff) and it's balance, lively feel and zippy performance in puffs.
I hate, it's low freeboard and the daggerboard. Alto, I like it's balance, feel, ease and performance in all conditions. I hate that it has to have flap things in the bottom to let all the water out and that water accumulates in it instead of running out the back. I also dislike the spinnaker delivery and collection system as supplied, so have modified mine. |
Posted By: Fraggle
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 12:45pm
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Laser Radial -
Likes - the close class racing, I can go anywhere and find another one to race, simplicity of rigging, one design so if I come last it's my fault not my boat, any ability can sail it but it really rewards effort, blasting off wind in good waves and breeze.
Dislikes - totally monopoly of market (for my size single handed) means nothing else out there that I would want to sail instead - really annoying on those days when I want a change. Lack of quality of parts and the parts/rights fiasco!
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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 1:18pm
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Fraggle, I'd have thought there were loads of small single handers for you to have a play in and see which you found fun? ------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 1:29pm
Splash, Lightening, Comet, Streaker, OK...Farr 3.7 ( if you want to trapeze) etc.... Farr 3.7 - Like; the fantastic feeling you get sailing it, sensitive and fast without the need to be an Olympian. Hate; the fact that even though Bruce Farr designed it in 1972 no one this side of the equator seems to have picked up on the fact. ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: Fraggle
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 1:39pm
Not a trapezer, and everything else on that list is SLOW with very little class racing. Nothing there that would tempt me away, if I change I want to go faster, particularly if I'll be handicap racing. Just need Punk to go on sale... ------------- |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 1:51pm
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RS400 Good Points: Accessible for a 'late to dinghies' H/W team. Fast enouth to be fun in a breeze. Fast enough to make it over the tide in light weather, most of the time. Reasonably dry to sail, so not cold in winter. Good fleet racing at local club Class start at FED week Fairly robust and cheap to run at club level Older boats seem competitive Not too weight sensitive, given a decent course downsides not many opens being part of the RS class association reduces the focus of the CA. 'Nationals' wrong time or place lately. |
Posted By: gbr940
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 2:55pm
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B14 - great boat all round and proven still fast compared to these nippers in similar trapeze boats, looks great on and off the water, easy to handle (once you've got the basics mastered), great fleet racing, VERY VERY VERY sociable class scene, good UK events and international venues
Oi...Mister Nick - get your RS500 to Netley SC so we can have a J/80 style sail-off - hahaha!! ------------- RS400 GBR1321 |
Posted By: chrisarnell1
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 3:55pm
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Splash (my daughter's boat) - love - easy to rig, well balanced, comfortable to sail in all conditions (especially if you're a Topper sized sailor), really quick offwind in a breeze, good International fleet - Worlds were great fun last year) Hate: Controls don't have enough power to effectively flatten the sail, lack of class racing here in the UK and availability of boats and spares. Me - borrowing a friend's laser for club racing: Loves ease of rigging and sailing and able to compete well on handicap against Finns and more expensive boats. Hates: It's not an OK Dinghy. |
Posted By: iGRF
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 4:15pm
So is that like er it's not an ok dinghy, or is that it's not a dinghy that is an ok, ok? |
Posted By: Thunder Road
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 4:16pm
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I like my boats for different reasons, but when I'm stuck in an airport having missed a flight and can't get home until stupid o'clock it is the Finn I dream about. ------------- Finn GBR16 Thunder Road. |
Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 4:31pm
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RS700
Fantastic high performance singlehander, that provides excellent racing and gives you a huge grin when sending it downwind. Upwind its a challenge to find the groove and possibly a little over canvassed but all the sail controls are pretty effective once you work out just how much kicker and Cunningham are really required. Weight equalization seems to work well but leads to paint flaking of wing bars which makes them look shabby. Daggerboard is too soft, but you easily get used to that. Gelcoat bubbles and cosmetic cracks are a visual nuisance. Sail life is excellent for mainsails lasting well over 4yrs. Spinnakers last about 2yrs before they turn into absorbent hole ridden bedsheets. Had mine for 8yrs now and love it. Graduate I love the simplicity, the perfect handling and the fact I can teach my kids to sail and also competitively race. I don't like the aft tank, as I always worry about scratching it when I drop the main. I also wish the class would get themselves out there a bit more and make everyone else realise how good they are. |
Posted By: Oli
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 4:47pm
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K6 points like a finger upwind, which annoys just about everyone on the start line. you doesnt capsize, shorts and t-shirt sailing light loads and easy layout means i can take novices with me doesn't capsize towable behind a regular car and did i mention it doesn't capsize ------------- https://skiff-media.teemill.com/" rel="nofollow - T-SHIRTS https://www.photo4me.com/profile/23908/" rel="nofollow - PRINTS |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 5:36pm
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K6 you have friends to come and get you, but does anyone know what happens if you fall off a K1?
------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: MattTrinder
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 5:52pm
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Buzz - love the performance, and the fact that it is low to the water and flat, so feels like a skateboard. Everything works, it is fairly robust and can be sailed singlehanded at a pinch. Don't like the fact that it is completely the wrong boat for the puddle that I sail on so we get mullered on handicap - it really needs some decent length reaches for the kite to work |
Posted By: MattTrinder
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 5:53pm
and forgot to mention the lack of space under the boom for someone my size - tacking is a kneeling affair which I can never get to look elegant... |
Posted By: Oli
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 6:00pm
Either needs a kill cord arrangement or a remote control mob device. Or perhaps to be mr phelps?! ------------- https://skiff-media.teemill.com/" rel="nofollow - T-SHIRTS https://www.photo4me.com/profile/23908/" rel="nofollow - PRINTS |
Posted By: RS400atC
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 7:36pm
You need to get it to the coast, where you will find your handicap is OK in a breeze! |
Posted By: Jeremyc
Date Posted: 12 Apr 13 at 9:13pm
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Fraggle, try a europe! Bit sluggish up wind, but off wind they are fantastic, 43kg hull, it just flies?
As to facourite boat, 12, 12, 12, 12! Have four of them, they are just addictive! Having raced 29er, musto, and loads of others, nothing beats a 12 for responsive by the seat of your pants sailing. Best thing, though l have a carbon one to race on the circuit two ofthe others were free, and the last was £250 so for bang for bucks sailing, just can't beat it. Have spent the last two weeks replacing hog, centreboard case and garboard planks on a 1968 one, and l have to say l have never enjoyed myself so much, though could do with a little bit more time as now have to evacuate the workshop! ------------- N12- pure joy D-Zero more pure joy |
Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 13 Apr 13 at 7:10am
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Albacore - like because it is a tatty cheap GRP one that needs minimal maintenance and is safe enough at an insecure club but really suits our weight, especially in a blow. Dislike because we miss the kite.
Lark - lively and responsive and taught us a lot and a great class for the social side at opens. Light, up-together and modern and points up to wind better than any other boat we've sailed. Dislike because we're too big and heavy for it. Up for sale at £1500 if anyone's interested.
Merlin - love the looks - our old one is a pretty boat in varnished wood with a graceful curve to the sheerline. Made us lots of friends and given much pleasure. Dislike on days when nothing works properly as she's old and fairly original and she stalls when tacking or fills up into an unsailable bathtub (hence RogerD gave us the Radox award!) Dislike also the fact that she and her fatter sister ship are both languishing in need of major works because we haven't time to fix them until the house extension is done.
Dislike all our other boats because they need time investing in them which is in short supply at present.
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Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 13 Apr 13 at 11:29am
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How many other boats do you have?! I suggest that you get together with Winging It and start an 'anonymous' group therapy soceoety where you can work out your addictions. Was going to include Rupert, but he seems to be on top of his menagerie. ------------- http://www.wilsoniansc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilsonian SC http://www.3000class.org.uk" rel="nofollow - 3000 Class |
Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 13 Apr 13 at 6:56pm
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Yes, I've only got 8 - barely getting started, really!
------------- Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686 |
Posted By: rogerd
Date Posted: 13 Apr 13 at 7:00pm
| Makes me look seriously amateur with my five. Oh and Pat has a garden full and more |
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 13 Apr 13 at 8:17pm
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Contender, Likes: it is beautiful to look at, lovely to sail, amazing competition. Dislike: I'm getting a bit too knackered for it. Moths: love all three because they are quirky, challenging, head turners. dislike: they fall apart so often. megabyte: like: spacious, easy, smooth sail, very forgiving. dislike: the daggerboard style rudder is a pain, the board is slippery, there aren't enough of them around. kestrels: fast yet spacious and relatively stable, lots of fun on the sea, sym kite dislike: heavy cherub (classic): fun and quirky but I'm way too fat for it. 2000: like: stable, acommodating yet racey, dislike: can't fiddle with it i14 (classic) beautiful boat, hope it will be joyful to sail, but it's taking a long time. prototype: fun to fiddle with, but nothing to compare it with. ------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: andy h
Date Posted: 13 Apr 13 at 11:12pm
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Europe: Likes: Fabulous, refined sailing experience in wind and waves. Dirt cheap to buy and doesn't cost much to run. Hates: paying for petrol to travel to sail against other ones, I'm too big for it on light days, the voices inside my head telling me that a solo would make more sense. Mirror: Likes: It means I'm spending time sailing with my kids, personal nostalgia trip every time I take the cover off. Hates: varnishing, nothing else really.
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Posted By: Bootscooter
Date Posted: 14 Apr 13 at 12:22pm
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Laser;
Like - Ace class racing, responsive. Dislike - My perception of the over-pricing of bits/sails, uncomfortable. OK; Like - Proper boat, handles brilliantly, great in all conditions. Dislike - Wish it was lighter/faster for the gusts. Alto; Like - Speed, ease of use, comfortable, great in all conditions. Dislike - Only one at the Club at the moment. L2K; Like - Great for instructing and team racing, awesome in a blow. Dislike - Lack of character, bit slow. Dart 16; Like - fast, fun, bulletproof. Dislike - no good for Club racing. |
Posted By: rb_stretch
Date Posted: 14 Apr 13 at 4:52pm
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Phantom
Likes: Great overall feel, very responsive on the tiller, vice-free handling, very easy to read and feel the sail Dislikes: No escape from the hiking... Albacore Likes: Good all round boat, very comfortable, nice feel Dislikes: Dacron sails |
Posted By: Gfinch
Date Posted: 14 Apr 13 at 5:35pm
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Mirror - Great fun boat for cruising / just going for a sail. Laser - Also brilliant for cruising and racing, good fleet at most clubs, but hiking hurts. Laser 4000 - For all that is wrong, getting the kite up in a breeze outweighs everything by 10:1. ------------- 3513, 3551 - National 12 136069 - Laser 32541 - Mirror 4501 - Laser 4000 |
Posted By: patj
Date Posted: 15 Apr 13 at 5:41pm
I've lost count but I think a dozen! Sandy & I had two each when we met and then they must have started breeding.
 As for the group therapy society - we're all cvrda members! http://www.cvrda.org/ - http://www.cvrda.org
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Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 15 Apr 13 at 5:46pm
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ha, I have just got rid of both kestrels! That takes me down to nine - single figures for the first time in ages. It feels good!
------------- the same, but different... |
Posted By: frow3n
Date Posted: 16 Apr 13 at 8:47am
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Laser : like : great class racing; one design so you know its all equal. dislike : sails don't last, parts are too expensive and its monopolised the unstayed rig market for singlehanders meaning no other classes can properly emerge. 29er : like : super fast, challenging to sail, massive kite Dislike : pain to launch and come back in at QM.... ------------- Laser Radial 201357 29er 1907 Queen Mary SC |
Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 16 Apr 13 at 11:58am
Is the dislike there on account of the rudder, or something else? ------------- http://www.wilsoniansc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilsonian SC http://www.3000class.org.uk" rel="nofollow - 3000 Class |
Posted By: frow3n
Date Posted: 16 Apr 13 at 12:00pm
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its more about the boat being designed like a wedge-shaped... meaning its unstable and wants to capsize... the rudder is actually quite nice with stock :) ------------- Laser Radial 201357 29er 1907 Queen Mary SC |
Posted By: vscott
Date Posted: 16 Apr 13 at 12:05pm
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Osprey: Loves - Beautifully mannered and responsive yet very powerful, technical for me without too much string (that's for my husband to play with)
Downside? Tough on the physical side for me - heavy to pull on land Firefly: Loves - my first love so will always like the fact that it punishes mistakes. Dislike the bailing out. ------------- Mk IV Osprey 1314 Think Again 
Kielder Water Sailing Club |
Posted By: Medway Maniac
Date Posted: 16 Apr 13 at 1:10pm
Yes, narrow waterline, and the double floor is quite high, isn't it? ------------- http://www.wilsoniansc.org.uk" rel="nofollow - Wilsonian SC http://www.3000class.org.uk" rel="nofollow - 3000 Class |
Posted By: Charlie 8835
Date Posted: 16 Apr 13 at 1:44pm
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505. Obvious choice, so apologies. Any wind strength, flat water, wavy water......the design simply has no vices....except for tight reaches.....which is basically our own fault for going with a ma-housive kite.
Quality of the fleet nationally and internationally is breathtaking.
Close eyes, and I am back in 2001. Me with Christian D crewing in the Cavalaire Eurocup event (south of france). 30 knots+ as we gate.....Ian Pinnell / Steve Hunt lead on the left, Philippe Boite / Fabrice Toupet in the middle, and us in Simon Lake's (borrowed) boat. There may have been about 50 others at the start, but there were only about 5 boats there at the weather mark....boat balanced, nose down, and just driving flat out...tell tales streaming....pinching is for pussies.......boom on the quarter.....tiller neutral.....smokin' up the beat...
No other design would have been travelling like that in wind and waves like that (FD maybe, but probably overpowered?)
Hates the lack of sailing currently......family rightly taking priority...!!
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Posted By: fab100
Date Posted: 16 Apr 13 at 5:35pm
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RS100: Likes: I love racing it ATC at Frensham and on the circuit Passers buy seem to stop and coo over it We seem to have built up a great Craic at circuit meetings as well as great racing Takes less time to get on the water than the laser when the mast is up at the club Dislikes: The 10.2 is a bit of a handful at under 80kg in shifty, gusty club races but changing rigs is too much hassle to bother with Laser Likes: No excuses, mano-a-mano tight racing The 'new' XD controls have made it so much easier to sail in a blow I get to race people on average 5 years older than me at Masters meetings soon The privilege of racing one against Roger Gilbert sometimes (usually when everywhere else is blown off) Its the only boat I can beat (or even get near) him in. Now to persuade Keith Videlo to swap his So-Slo for one too The LPE/Kirby side-show Dislikes: They seem to think I will be a Grand Master soon. B*stards. Stop rubbing it in. The way prices of monopoly parts has escalated stupidly since it got involved with that 5-circle circus ------------- http://clubsailor.co.uk/wp/club-sailor-from-back-to-front/" rel="nofollow - Great book for Club Sailors here |