Enterprise or similar
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Choosing a boat
Forum Discription: Ask any questions about the sport!
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=7361
Printed Date: 06 Aug 25 at 8:00pm
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Topic: Enterprise or similar
Posted By: Owenfackrell
Subject: Enterprise or similar
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 8:44am
Hi
I would like to know if the enterprise is car toppable as I'm looking for a dinghy around this size to take to the south of France and leave there. There a few reasons for not wanting to tow the main one being the fact that we have to transport the boat to the house by small ferry which would mean leaving a road trailer with the car and having to bring just the trailer back to the UK. The other is that it's cheaper to put it on the roof. The car is a Volvo xc90 which has a roof limit of 100kg. The requirements for the boat are being capable of single handing buts also of getting more people in when required.
Many thanks in advance.
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Replies:
Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 9:03am
I used to car top a 470 across Europe, which was ok. But that was before cars had next to useless built on side rails on their roofs. That will be the stumbling block - the car might manage the weight of the boat, but will the roof bars? Also, I had an estate - longer than your volvo, so less boat overhanging unsupported. Finally, the obvious problem is getting the boat up onto the roof and getting it back down again at the other end - you need a bit of a gang to help.
I'm not sure the enterprise is your ideal choice - there might be something easier to fit on the roof, but help to make the choice we need to know what sort of height and weight you are.
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the same, but different...
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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 9:15am
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The minimum hull weight (looking up the class rules) is 94kg. This doiesn't include the centre board, does include other fittings. Doesn't include ropes. That's an absolute minimum. As you're not after a race-spec boat, there's a very real danger that a centreboard and some rigging, plus the boat equivalent of "middle age spread", will take you over that 100kg.
Also, the mast is one-piece, 6.2 m long, and would certainly take you well over that 100kg. Your car is 4.8m long. Even if you get it perfect, you'd have 0.7m overhang front and back, which is really quite a lot. Plus a boom.
There's also a fair chance you'd have to widen the racks- adding more weight.
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-_
Al
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 9:29am
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Thanks for that. What else would you recommend? The boat needs to be grp or plastic for low maintenance as it going to be left there it also needs to be cheap ie no more then £500. I am 6 foot tal and around 83kg.
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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 10:06am
A £500 Ent would almost certainly be badly overweight!
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-_
Al
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Posted By: Steve H
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 10:14am
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A miracle is just about car toppable and the older ones may still have a two piece mast. Would be fine to single-hand and take other out in
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 10:23am
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I already have a miracle and ithas a 2 piece mast but as it's wooden I don't wantto take it there and leave it adit will spend most of the time just sitting around which won't do the wood any good. The reason for leaving it there is that it means I would always have it and it will be cheaper in the long run.
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Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 10:24am
I hate to say it, but why not just buy a boat when you get there? I have a french boat - a simoun 445 which I could sail singlehanded if I chose - I am pretty much same height and weight as you, or I could take company.
http://www.wanaboat.fr/univers/1-deriveurs - http://www.wanaboat.fr/univers/1-deriveurs
Plenty to choose from!
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the same, but different...
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 10:54am
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I had thought about doing that but as I only go for 2 weeks at a time I don't really want to spend it looking for a boat ( and the wife wouldn't be happy about that either). Would some thing like a laser fun be 2 much for single handed?
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Posted By: Mister Nick
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 5:45pm
Originally posted by Owenfackrell
I had thought about doing that but as I only go for 2 weeks at a time I don't really want to spend it looking for a boat ( and the wife wouldn't be happy about that either). Would some thing like a laser fun be 2 much for single handed? |
You should be fine with a Laser Fun. If you put the bungee to hold the trapeze wires further towards the back of the boat it would be okay, although I found that when I helmed from the wire on a Laser 2 (Exactly the same boat) there was quite a lot of forward pull. If you don't want to trapeze you could quite easily use the toe straps and hike instead.
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Posted By: Late starter
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 6:42pm
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I really wouldn't want to try and put an Ent on the roof of a car. You'd need some serious lifting effort for a start, at least a 4 person job and perhaps more than that. And that's assuming, as others have said, that the car and roofrack will take the load. I'd echo the Laser Fun point. Nice simple fairly light hull, simple rig, some had reefing points for the main and furling jibs. Indestructible tubs too, which I guess is what you want in something you'll presumably leave for quite a while. The main thing to check is that the mast splits - I once owned a Laser Fun and the mast split into two parts, a bit fiddly but I doubt a 1 piece mast would fit onto any car without a severe overhang. Not expensive boats either so you might find one for £500 at a pinch.
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Posted By: winging it
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 8:05pm
yes, plenty on ebay at the moment. We roof topped our L2 for a while and it was fine, just make sure you get good roof bars - thule are the best I found.
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the same, but different...
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Posted By: tomoore1
Date Posted: 15 Nov 10 at 10:19pm
I just bought an GRP ent for £180 for the uni sailing club. Although it will almost certainly be overwieght it is watertight and missing only a rudder and jib. If you were set on an ent looked around a bit you could get an ent for <£500 and use the change to pay for the more expensive ferry, loaning a trailer for the journey.
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Restoring Firefly 517
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 12:38pm
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Whats the thoughts on a cheap 420?
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Posted By: bornskiffyish
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 3:00pm
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420 is same or heavier than an ent, and very hard to get more than two of you in.
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Posted By: ex laser
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 3:13pm
why not think about a comet duo or something similar?
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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 7:57pm
A boat like a Laser 2 or Fun would roofrack very easily, whereas an Enterprise is pretty wide (wider than the car) and deep. There really are very few car topable doublehanders once you are bigger than the Firefly/Graduate/ Comet Duo sort of size boat. Mind you, in frace there are rather more - do you know anyone out there who could look at any for you before you go? Does Ebay in France have as many boats as the UK one?
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 9:06pm
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Ebay france doesn't have that many boats on at the moment. What about something like an europe?
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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 9:25pm
A Europe is a small singlehander, easily roofrackable, but not the same sort of boat at all to the Enterprise.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 10:29pm
I'm not to worried on it being like an ent but picked one of them due to the fact you can get grp ones fairly cheap which is the main criteria for me as I will be mainly using it for fun in the med and then leaving it there till the following year hence price and material choice.
So I'm looking for a grp or plastic dinghy for under £500 that will be fun for a 6 foot male weighing 83kg but that can also be used to swim off if there is little or no wind.
Oh and it needs to be man handelable by a couple of men as it has to go on a foot passenger ferry and ideally car toppable.
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Posted By: bornskiffyish
Date Posted: 16 Nov 10 at 11:40pm
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your essentially asking for something that doesn't exist. something grp / poly pro plastic, these materials are not light, and very unlikley to find a boat of the size you want that is car topable and light enough to be handled easily by two people. laser 2/fun is a good idea, or why not just a standard laser 1 it doesnt sound like your going to be going far from shore so could fit a couple of you on it pretty easily
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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 17 Nov 10 at 6:51am
certainly, you're way too tall for a Europe!
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-_
Al
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Posted By: Wee Man
Date Posted: 17 Nov 10 at 8:35am
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What about a Dart 15, split it down for roof racking. I'm not sure if the mast is one or two piece.
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Posted By: Owenfackrell
Date Posted: 17 Nov 10 at 10:00am
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I would love a dart but would want to leave it behind as it's the boat that I'm going to get my self for home. I'm starting to realise that some thing like the laser would be best any thoughts on a byte or are they ment for lighter sailers?
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Posted By: alstorer
Date Posted: 17 Nov 10 at 10:11am
Byte is definitely for lighter/smaller sailors. Laser would be ideal (though not so great with an adult passenger) plus if you do find it underpowered (you shouldn't really) you could with another year's budget buy a Rooster 8.1 rig for it.
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-_
Al
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Posted By: Rupert
Date Posted: 17 Nov 10 at 11:59pm
Might be worth looking at Minisails on ebay, too. They are all very old now, but come up fairly frequently,are cheap, and make a good platform, being round bowed. Narrow, so good on a car roof and stored leaning against walls.
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Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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