Which boat for me and the nipper?
Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: General
Forum Name: Choosing a boat
Forum Discription: Ask any questions about the sport!
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3429
Printed Date: 05 Aug 25 at 6:34pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Which boat for me and the nipper?
Posted By: Matt Jackson
Subject: Which boat for me and the nipper?
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 1:04pm
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My son is just coming up for 4 and we have another on the way (which is going to make Contender sailing unpopular at home) so I'm starting to think about what boat would suit us. I don't want to put the lad off sailing before he's started so it needs to be a really stable boat but initially at least I'll be doing all the work. I was think Wayfarer (hmm v heavy) or Wanderer (don't know much about them) but haven't really kept up to speed with more modern designs so need a bit of advice, would a L2000 be mad? I'm not too worried about ruggedness as I'm reasonably careful and the kids won't be sailing alone for a good few years. Just to throw one more constraint in, it would be useful if I could sail with the wife as well (I'm 15 stone and she's not Kate Moss (thank the lord)). ------------- Laser 203001, Harrier (H+) 36 |
Replies:
Posted By: timnoyce
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 1:15pm
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***** Warning, incoming sales pitch! Been at the boat show for 11 days so I really can't help myself! ****** I'd really have to suggest the Wanderer. Partly because we build them at Hartley Laminates, but really because they are a great boat! We just launched the new Phil Morrison updated Wanderer at the boat show and it seemed to go down very well. Originally designed by Ian Proctor as a small version of the Wayfarer it shares many of its stable and practical qualities. At 129kg it's no featherweight but it's a quality GRP dinghy that will hold its value for many years (check out the resale value of used Wanderers!) Its fully self draining with sealed storage for the kids dry clothes etc... and if you go really crazy you can even take it racing 
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Posted By: stuarthop
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 3:12pm
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bear in mind that the early 2000/stratos style wanderers have trouble with taking in too much water into the side tanks when you capsize making it very hard to right the boat. Personally if your after a new boat then i'd suggest the wanderer/2000. If its a second hand boat then it would be a 2000 hands down for me, they sail well, are very predictable, when your hit by a gust you can almost count to 5 before you need to react! and theres a good and freindly racing circuit for them aswell. ------------- |
Posted By: Stuart O
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 4:09pm
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Having seen your stand and the quality of your workmanship think you are worthy of your sales pitch. Id go wayfarer, good stable boat and a good class assciation. |
Posted By: Barty
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 5:55pm
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I was given a Mirror for free for me and my 4 year old. It was a wreck but I stripped it over the winter added a ally pole, spinnaker kit and all the usual class gadgets. He loves it and has even been doing figure of eights on the helm. When it blows and he doesn't want to go out I take it out single-handed and can easily fly the kite. I have even won club races in it. He has been out in a 5 and wasn't put off at all. The boat has got to be one of the best for little people. Don't over look the older classes. You can pick them up for pennies ready to sail. ------------- http://www.highlandtopper.com - For Topper boats & spares in Scotland-highlandtopper.com |
Posted By: Matt Jackson
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 5:58pm
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Yeah but I'm 6ft tall and over 15 stone - I think it'd be a bit scary with just me in it. ------------- Laser 203001, Harrier (H+) 36 |
Posted By: Matt Jackson
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 6:02pm
Except I'd have to lug the thing around alone - no thanks. I've taught in them and although they are good on the water and have loads of room it might be a bit limiting as to when I can sail (ie when there are othe big lads around to drag it out of the water) ------------- Laser 203001, Harrier (H+) 36 |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 6:03pm
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I would of thought an Enterprise would be very suitable.
------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: Lukepiewalker
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 6:25pm
| Miracle, National 12, Ent, GP... the possibilites are endless... It all comes down to how much space you need and how much stability you want I suppose. Your modern Double floor GPs offer the self drainingness and are still nice and comfy. Possibly a bit bigger than you would like if you want to race with the kids, but ideal for racing with your wife. Although there is that there biggish Genoa. |
Posted By: craiggo
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 6:33pm
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I'd say Graduate if they ever get around to asking someone like Phil Morrison to design a modern one !
You can sail it singlehanded effectively, so your little ones can sit at the front and pretend to crew, with little effect on performance, as they get bigger you can give them the jib sheet and train them up. No spinnakers in the way, no genoa, just a nice simple beautifully balanced little boat. |
Posted By: Barty
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 7:37pm
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Matt I'm 6'2" and over 15 stone and fit in the Mirror fine ------------- http://www.highlandtopper.com - For Topper boats & spares in Scotland-highlandtopper.com |
Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 8:15pm
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what???? how barty? im 5'11" and 11 stone and struggle to sail one. how do you manage??? by the way i would think a 2000 if you want a modern boat but im not very sure about older classes. I would think a GP ould be too big for you and a small child but fine for you and the wife. ------------- 600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it. Also International 14, 1318 |
Posted By: redback
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 10:20pm
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For a 4 year old you need a Mirror. When mine were about 8 and 5 we had a Mirror and the kids loved it. We used to take it all sorts of places and row it. We explored great lengths of the Medway and all the little bays around Bough Beech. Its quiet big enough for two adults and a couple of small kids and not too difficult to car top and launch in rivers, lakes and beeches. They are very light. The sails are small so when you actually do some sailing they are not too heavy for the kids and as they get older they can helm and a collision will not do too much damage. In light winds they are probably as fast as a Contender and have a much more favourable handicap! Ours won its first race in a fleet of 35. We bought ours for £200, painted it up, sailed it for about 4 years (by which time we were racing it) and sold it for £300. |
Posted By: HannahJ
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 10:30pm
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Mirror (although I'm very biased). www.ukmirrorsailing.com - www.ukmirrorsailing.com Great boats for sailing with little kids, and if you're the helm then height doesn't matter, it's the crew that gets cheese-wired... or fallls of the thwart backwards as mine did yesterday  ------------- MIRROR 64799 "Dolphin" The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist hopes it will change; the realist adjusts the sail |
Posted By: Barty
Date Posted: 24 Sep 07 at 11:36pm
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Remember the Mirror now allows gnav's which make the front much more comfortable. It is a squeeze at 6'2" but when the breeze is up they are great boats. I agree with redback, I won a club race in my second outing in a force 1. It's all too easy now to look at modern assy boats and forget the older boats that make you think!!!! ------------- http://www.highlandtopper.com - For Topper boats & spares in Scotland-highlandtopper.com |
Posted By: Simon Lovesey
Date Posted: 25 Sep 07 at 8:57am
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Great to see the support for the Mirror, and as stated by several people with real life experience of young family sailing the Mirror is only real serious choice for taking small children out without scarring them whitless. At 45kg the Mirror is seriously light, this means you can easily handle the boat ashore on your own. This light weight means they only need small sails, so again can safely be handled by one adult in all conditions. This means you can take the nippers out in all winds, or if the breeze comes up whilst some way from the shore you can get back with parent and child's confidence intact. The small sail area means light sheet loads, so the nippers are not just passengers they quickly get to trim the sails and will soon be taking the helm, try that in the bigger boats mentioned here with a four year old. The Mirror also has a Tardis like interior and far more roomy than many bigger boats The Mirror Class has a couple of demo boats in the North, one of these is based in Ripon which has a thriving fleet. Ripon is part of the MCA Armada programme and you can go aong to one of their Mirror days as a guest. If you want I can put you in touch with the local contacts http://www.ukmirrorsailing.com/ARMADA/ripon/ - http://www.ukmirrorsailing.com/ARMADA/ripon/ Starter boats from a few hundred and will hold their value, so negligble real cost. Good racers from £1000, and if you get really serious Winders have just started producing fine Mirrors with a makeover from Phil Morrison ------------- http://www.sailracer.org" rel="nofollow - www.sailracer.org Online Sailing Results, GPS Tracking & Event Management |
Posted By: Jack Sparrow
Date Posted: 25 Sep 07 at 9:56am
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I'm sorry but the chaps 15 stone and he says his wife isn't that small
if you think a Mirror is a good boat for them that's just plain daft. Enterprise: At 15 stone + 1 - 4year old (2 stone?) an Enterprise will be good until it gets proper windy. In fact this was the case at Burghfield last weekend where a Father ( 15 stone ish ) was sailing with his tiny son ( 6 years ) in gusty strong breeze and doing well in the open meeting until his kicker broke. The Enterprise will also be great for sailing with the chaps wife and is recommended as a safe family cruiser by the RYA. Not only that you can get some really competitive racing. N12 not suitable at all. Unless he wants to scare is son off sailing. Graduate: too small, low event turn outs no good for 4 people Wayfarer: too big, but great for cruising, racing involves a kite, OK for racing with the wife but not with kids. Wanderer: maybe if you want to sail in fleets with old farts wearing worn out sun hats. ------------- http://www.uk3-7class.org/index.html" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Class Website https://www.facebook.com/groups/1092602470772759/" rel="nofollow - Farr 3.7 Building - Facebook Group |
Posted By: Matt Jackson
Date Posted: 25 Sep 07 at 12:41pm
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One of the reasons a Wanderer is a possiility is that it's quite close to the GP PY and there is a few GPs at Scaling Dam giving at least some chance of a race now and then... and I'm thinking of becoming an old fart at some point. I'm of the opinion that a Mirror isn't for me I'm afraid - too big and no other boats at the club. ------------- Laser 203001, Harrier (H+) 36 |
Posted By: Stewart2880
Date Posted: 25 Sep 07 at 8:07pm
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Albacore. Sail with either crew, or both for some "quality family time"-legaal in class rules. Not weight dependent, get some Firefly sails for the breezy bits and great on handicap. Stewart |