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Yacht Charter

Printed From: Yachts and Yachting Online
Category: Dinghy classes
Forum Name: Dinghy development
Forum Discription: The latest moves in the dinghy market
URL: http://www.yachtsandyachting.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2596
Printed Date: 18 Aug 25 at 2:29pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 9.665y - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: Yacht Charter
Posted By: limey
Subject: Yacht Charter
Date Posted: 12 Jan 07 at 9:11pm

Can anyone enlighten me whether (1) an experienced dinghy sailor/racer has all the necessary skills without formal training to charter a yacht. And (2) if its possible to do so without a Yacht Masters or similar certificate




Replies:
Posted By: combat wombat
Date Posted: 12 Jan 07 at 11:27pm
If with a skipper then yes, however without, yacht sailing is quite different.  I started on yachts, and moved to Dinghies - the move was hard.  It is easier to go from dinghies to yachts but you will need training - mooring and driving yachts in marina's takes skill and confidence - there is a lot of expensive hardware at stake if it goes wrong. 

They are also much more dangerous when racing.  The loads are very high on certain lines (ie genoa sheets, genoa car travellers, backstay runners) and from personal experience can cause serious and permanent injuries.  If you are to skipper the boat, you must be aware of all potential problems.  Also, by a yachts nature, you may be going into quite open waters - navigational issues aside, this creates more issues for you and crew. 

Having said all that, it is possible.  The sailing itself is obviously the same, just handled in a different way.  The main obstacle to overcome is seamanship skills, ie maneuvering, anchoring, mooring, navigation, safety etc. 


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B14 GBR 772


Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 13 Jan 07 at 7:48am

In general charter companies will want you to have either Day Skipper or Coastal Skipper, depending on the area and your intentions. I don't think it is common to ask for full Yachtmaster. They want your business but they also need to satisfy their insurers that they are only chartering to competent customers.

I'm not clear from your post whether you have previous yacht skippering experience. If not, then "an experienced dinghy sailor/racer" does not have "all the necessary skills". It's not about the sailing, with which dinghy sailors should have no problems. It's about navigation, pilotage and what it involved in maneuvering something weighing several tonnes in confined spaces.   



Posted By: mike ellis
Date Posted: 13 Jan 07 at 10:45pm
yachts are a nightmare to park compared to a dinghy

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600 732, will call it Sticks and Stones when i get round to it.
Also International 14, 1318


Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 13 Jan 07 at 11:37pm
not really, it's a lot less effort parking a yacht in my opinion.

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Needs to sail more...


Posted By: bustinben
Date Posted: 14 Jan 07 at 8:56am

I'd disagree, it's much harder to stop a yacht. 

Ever tried parking a yacht in a marina in a space that is only 10 foot longer than the boat with a firm breeze blowing you off?

 

You also need pilotage skills, and although a good dinghy sailor = a good yacht sailor pretty quickly, there is a learning curve (mostly to do with management of the loads).  You probably shouldn't be going through that curve on someone elses £60,000 machine without supervision/guidance!



Posted By: Charlie
Date Posted: 14 Jan 07 at 9:59am
With the parking thing, yachts tend to have engines, which give you a fine control over speed, plus usually enough crew for enough to jump onto the pier to control the boat in, which you don't have on a dinghy.

But sailing a yacht is very different to sailing a dinghy, and you have the whole navigation thing to contend with that you don't get with a dinghy. Plus running aground with a dinghy tends to be quick to recover, not so with a yacht, as anybody who has had to sit on the end of the boom can agree with.


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Finn GBR 657 - Blown It
Laser 164635
Planet Earth: 30% Land, 70% race course!


Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 14 Jan 07 at 10:32am
Originally posted by bustinben

I'd disagree, it's much harder to stop a yacht. 

Ever tried parking a yacht in a marina in a space that is only 10 foot longer than the boat with a firm breeze blowing you off?

 

You also need pilotage skills, and although a good dinghy sailor = a good yacht sailor pretty quickly, there is a learning curve (mostly to do with management of the loads).  You probably shouldn't be going through that curve on someone elses £60,000 machine without supervision/guidance!



Yep, 40kts, 36kt boat, 5 ft spare either end.

Once you know the basics it becomes easier, I would recommend doing a yacht course though beforehand, it will give you the knowledge and experience that is needed.


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Needs to sail more...


Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 14 Jan 07 at 11:55am

Originally posted by Charlie

With the parking thing, yachts tend to have engines, which give you a fine control over speed

If you think it is so easy, try it sometime with 30 knots of breeze pushing the yacht around, and maybe some nice strong tide in the mixture. Consider also the fact that the engine pushes the stern sideways at low speeds. It really isn't like "parking" except in easy conditions.



Posted By: tgruitt
Date Posted: 14 Jan 07 at 4:21pm
Originally posted by Stefan Lloyd

Originally posted by Charlie

With the parking thing, yachts tend to have engines, which give you a fine control over speed

If you think it is so easy, try it sometime with 30 knots of breeze pushing the yacht around, and maybe some nice strong tide in the mixture. Consider also the fact that the engine pushes the stern sideways at low speeds. It really isn't like "parking" except in easy conditions.



Never parked a yacht on our club pontoon then have you!! lol


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Needs to sail more...


Posted By: Oatsandbeans
Date Posted: 14 Jan 07 at 4:43pm

Being a good dinghy sailor will only help you in some of the aspects of skipperring a yacht. OK sailing it around will come quite easily, but that is actually the easy bit of it what you (probably),  won't have much idea of is ;

Maneauvering under engine, with all the complications that have been pointed out,

Navigation,

Electronics, VHF radar 

Emergency procedures

Engine maintenance

As a dinghy sailor you may think that the sailing bit is the important bit - well unfortunately it isn't - the other bits are actually more important.  You can be a piss poor sailor but if you  know the rest you can still be a good and safe cruiser.

I know about this because I have just spent the last 3 years going through the process of aquiring the other skills after 30 years of competitive dinghy sailing.  



Posted By: Stefan Lloyd
Date Posted: 14 Jan 07 at 5:55pm

Originally posted by tgruitt

Never parked a yacht on our club pontoon then have you!! lol

I don't know. Where's your club?



Posted By: Blobby
Date Posted: 15 Jan 07 at 9:16am
Originally posted by limey

Can anyone enlighten me whether (1) an experienced dinghy sailor/racer has all the necessary skills without formal training to charter a yacht. And (2) if its possible to do so without a Yacht Masters or similar certificate

1) No.

2) You can charter yachts in the Whitsundays (Queensland, Aus) with no sailing experience whatsoever.



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One step forwards, 2 steps back...


Posted By: Deimos
Date Posted: 04 Feb 07 at 1:27pm

Far more to sailing a larger boat than a dinghy. True that dingy experience will give you the "how to beat, reach, run, etc.", but then what happens when the wind get's up and you need to reef, when you come to anchor, when you reverse and the stern kicks, etc., etc.

Dinghy's are great fun, but if you are skipper of a larger boat then you have responsibilities for the safety of your crew and everybody on board.

This does not mean it is difficult, just there is quite a lot of knowledge you would need that being able to sail a dinghy would not give you.

That said I have done it a few times without any RYA certificates. In fact the first time the guy in charge of the boats forged my signature on my "self declaration of competence" (required by the then Yugoslavian government - I had not realised I was meant to sign the thing as I did not understand a word of the form). However, in practice I had been sailing cruisers and larger boats since age 9 so had experience.

Ian




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