Site looks nice.

Has the SS achived International status now? (I don't see it listed on the ISAF site)

Rick

Interesting point. The class is sailed or building in 15 countries, and the association is for all those people. So it isn't a North American association, it is an International one. Can the ISAF claim sole useage of the word "International"?

Love the pics of the beaches...oh well, back to concrete slipways on Sunday!

Only thing I can say:

I WANT ONE!

Are there any in the UK? Or being built at the moment?

And just as important whats the practical weight range, I fear as a Phantom sailor I'd have to lose weight. A leg or two perhaps.

Gary

Very nice.

Photos look like you were fully trapezing in about a F2! Makes me wonder how manageable the boat would be in anything stronger, so maybe another "too far" boat (see graemef post!!).

I've thought for a while that there is a space in the market for a "tamer" trapeze single handed monohull, something your average laser sailor could move up to, possibly as a transition to the MPS/RS700 type of boat. Something like a Vareo with 10-20%more sail and a trapeze, I reckon it would sell well.

There is the Vortex (I'm a vortex sailor myself) but there seems to be a lot of prejudice against this for various reasons.

Any thoughts?

iwsmith

Wouldn't the Contender or RS600 fit the bill for a "tamer" trapeze s/h monohull? Or do you mean a boat with a kite too?

I know what you mean about peoples attitudes to the Vortex, though in some ways it seams to be the ideal boat for s/h with a kite.

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo o, not another big argument

The 600 is far from tame despite the lack of kite. That giant fully battened main is pretty vicious

Sorry, should have said with a kite.

I certainly wouldn't regard the 600 or the contender as tame!

I'm sure the S Solo is a great boat as are the MPS and RS700 but there are a lot of people (like me) who are a bit older and lighter for whom boats like these have a very narrow window where they're enjoyable.

Something a bit less likely to bite you back but still with reasonable performance and all the toys (trapeze. assy etc) is what I'm talking about. 

My thoughts exactly - now fullfilled with a V3000! and the kids can double up to sail it too.

ISAF's requirements for a class to gain International status are here: http://www.sailing.org/regulations/2006_partV.PDF One of the main requirements (as well as a class structure - rules, committee etc) is "in the case of International Classes, in at least six Member National Authorities which are from at least three continents and meet the following criteria as to the number of boats per country according to size:LOA Up to 7.6m  Boats per country - 20" - it's the same requirement for recognised classes.

One thing that International status gives a class is the right to hold world championships - if a class isn't classified as an international class, then it's not allowed to hold a worlds. Hence things like "Intergalactic" champships, or "World's invitational". ISAF is trying to make sure that being world champion actually means something - you're don't end up with things like the "Lymington Scow World Championships" (not that there is such a thing - my invention, for illustrative purposes).

[/QUOTE]
. I am 46 and 104kg so a perfect specimine, not on your life. [/QUOTE]

Thats just killed any reasons I can't have one on physique grounds

I'm pretty much the same build.

How typical a build are you for the class? Wondering if it suits larger sailors as its origin is American? My apologies if I'm stereotyping here.

Thats just killed any reasons I can't have one on physique grounds

I'm pretty much the same build.

How typical a build are you for the class? Wondering if it suits larger sailors as its origin is American? My apologies if I'm stereotyping here.

Dare I, dare I ... oh what the hell ... a 3000 can be a stepping stone, 13.5 m assy, 54 kg hull for the new V3000, and quite a few of our members have progressed into 700s and MPSs. At 74 kg I have no difficulty.

Obviously it's not a 'singlehanded class', although we do allow singlehanding at opens (not the Nats). You should have seen Nick A cruise through the fleet in the last race at the Nats, singlehanding his brand new V3000 for fun (DSQ).

Love the Swift ... looks a thing of real beauty ... and expensive. What's the price tag?

PS, 3000s, let's not turn this into another PR thread or 3000 single-handing debate ... it's just a one off comment!!!

Sorry my earlier post was perhaps a bit ambiguous, I wouldn't consider the Contender or 600 tame either, hence the " " marks.

It is actually pretty easy to sail. Easier than a "niner" or the MPS. I sailed one most days in a week in Florida and only had one swim. I sailed it in about 17 - 18 knots and it was very manageable. Not suggesting that a novice could sail one but a Contender or 505 sailor would make the transition very easily. By comparison I tried a MPS out for about 45 minutes in about 10 knots and had 3 swims. The MPS is a nice boat - just a little harder to turn corners in. I'm sure a little practice would fix that too. I suspect the MPS has a little more straight line speed than the Swift Solo but the ease of manouvering of the Swift Solo means the 2 boats are very close around the course.

Both boats are good singlehanders but with a very different approach.

FUGU - I reckon 90kg might be closer to ideal weight in a location with breeze above 10 most of the time. The day it was blowing you and Ron had much better upwind speed than Kris.

Steve 

Originally posted by m_liddell What is it about the swift that makes it easy to sail with that much sail? I'm surprised the cherub lot haven't been asking about the weight again j/k

• Boat has a jib and main so coe of the sails combined is lower than a cat rigged boat
• Rig is fully adjustable on water - unlike niners
• Rig is full carbon very lightweight and engineered to provide gust response
• The hull does provide some form stability - not that much but more than niners or mps 
• One sheet controls both sails so it is easy to dump power.
• no wings and high boom mean you can scurry to either side of the boat fast to keep control  

Cheers,

Steve

[/QUOTE]

FUGU - I reckon 90kg might be closer to ideal weight in a location with breeze above 10 most of the time. The day it was blowing you and Ron had much better upwind speed than Kris.

Steve 

Steve,

Actually, the boat Kris was sailing had cap spreaders problems that have made it slow in a blow even with big guys sailing.  The spreaders were too long and raked too far forward.  The net effect if a very stiff mast (the tube was tested and it flexes the same as the others).

I've just not been able to determine what weight works best after sailing against a variety of good sailors.  Common sense would indicate that big guys would do better in heavy air and visa versa.  So far, experience has not shown that correlation.

Bram

Hey Bram,

I was thinking that 90 kg would be about perfect. Guess how much I weigh?? 

In reality I guess that the skill of the sailor will have a lot to do with it. The good thing is that we'll be able to fine tune the mast sail combinations to suit different weights as well. This is another advantage of not having class mandated masts and sails.

Steve,

In the past it has seemed that I was fast in light and heavy air but mediocre in 8 to 12 (at 200 lbs).  Ron Watt and I have been doing a lot of head to head sailing in light air and the importance of shifting gears correctly has become even more apparent.  It's not rocket science since nearly every skiff sailor knows what needs to be done, it's just that on the Swift everything is adjustable.  If you don't make the adjustments as the wind velocity changes, someone else will and you'll be left behind.  I suspect that weight is important but relatively insignificant when compared to rig adjustment.

Bram 

I am always amused by this one.

I find it very simple.

Do you intend to race under "The Racing Rules of Sailing"? Presumably.

So can ISAF tell you what to do with the word "International"?  YES - if you want to use their rules.

Who says so? ISAF

Why? BECAUSE THEY WROTE THE RULES!

Of course, you can also come and sail at Lancing!

Say Fugu, how about "The International Swift Skiff Association"?  May have to check with the International Association of Associations to get permission to use the word "association" and I can see where that might lead to the "associated" controversy!  In the scheme of things, this is important stuff.  Actually, we choose the name knowing that we'll meet the ISAF definition reasonably soon and don't want the hassle of changing our non-profit name at that time (a bit lazy, I'd agree) 

Speaking of good water! I choose this picture because it may be one of the last times I get to cross in front of you (looks like I'm bracing for the hit)

Bram,

You can't use that skiff word - only Aussies can have boats called skiffs

The only bad news I have for you is that when we get on the water with our Aussie designed sails and masts - the only thing you'll be seeing is our wake

The first regatta with the differently rigged boats should be a lot of fun.

Geez, I forgot Steve.  Can you tell me why that is again?  

It'll be hard not to lobby for Lake Macquarie (Toronto).  Best times ever (in spite of the lack of Bud Lite) at the 1976 505 worlds.

Ah mate, I'm getting old and slow.  Not so old that those Aussies will cross in front (I suspect my flag drapped casket will be faster than that) but what I'm gaining in knowledge, I'm losing in speed and agility.  I'm really looking forward to getting some experienced young skiff sailors going.  Imagine how fast you could tack if you simple headed out on the new tack without hooking up.  Watching Charlie after 45 minutes in the boat was an eye opener to the possibilites.  Some day we'll see tacking and gybing duels in the Swift that will bring a lot of additional excitement to skiff sailing.  The high boom and clean deck combined with the fact that there is only one body to coordinate with the rate of rotation will surely take us there.

Regards,

Bram     

Actually I think that our class is closer to being able lay claim to being a "skiff class" than many of the others - including the Musto Performance Skiff.

Why?

• We can design our sails and mast with some restrictions as we like
• We build the boats ourselves
• We can arrange the deck layout as we wish
• Some might say we carry a stupid amount of sail
• The class is run by the members - not a commercial organisation.
• Our hull design is fixed but so are the 16s and 18s.

We don't have years of history as a class but at least our structure is similar to the skiff classes unlike SMODS that have just picked the word because it sounds good.

(Puts on flame suit)

Bram,

We need to get that regatta happening before you are in your casket. I'm happy for you guys to pick any venue you like over here. At least you'll feel good about that part of your trip - as you see the Aussie transoms in the distance

Cheers,

Steve

Steve,

Actually, the respect owed your countrymen for taking sailing and sailing innovation to new levels should never be in doubt.  The rest of us pretty much had our heads is a dark place during the 80's and  90's while the Aussies came up with innovation after innovation.  The Swift simply would not exist if not for the Bethwaites and the other Aussies that primed their pump.  It's fun to see that kind of passion getting started in several spots around the US again.  With the enthusiasm in the UK and some rethinking of priorities here, I think that high performance sailing is on the verge of seeing serious growth.  It likely won't happen overnight, but more and more people seem to be willing to exert the energy needed to make it happen in the long run.

I can hardly wait to see a container of Swifts being loaded to head for a Worlds in Australia.  My desire to see that first Worlds regatta down there is out of respect for the heritage of skiff sailing.  This picture was the start of it for me (aft port corner--a couple of pounds lighter and maybe two or three years younger).  Sydney, 1976

Bram,

You've obviously got a desire to be a skiff sailor. I was walking around the rigging lawn at my sailing club at the weekend and there were 12s 14s and 16s there. If you come over we'll have to see if we can hook you up for a sail on one of them.

It was really interesting looking at the different rigging ideas in use. I'm going to adopt a couple on the Swift Solo.

I haven't been paying that much attention to the forums because I've been busy in the garage making this............

The end is in sight now and I'm looking forward to getting this baby out on the water.

Steve 

You're getting close mate!  Looks like you're ready for hybrid.  You're giving me the bug to start another one.

 Are you going for the forestay adjuster? 

I've become a fan of the system I used in Florida.  While I like the idea of a single adjuster for both primaries, the fact that I can reach the current system from the wire is nice--even though I have to wait to adjust the other side on the new tack.

Keep us informed.

Bram